stevenash

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="817695" timestamp="1278966407"] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70860.msg817654#msg817654 date=1278956928] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=70860.msg817648#msg817648 date=1278954887] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70860.msg816293#msg816293 date=1278378747] There has been considerable debate about the pluses and minuses of Universal Off Season training at the high school level.  Would like your input on this please. [/quote]Stevie, it takes a truly gifted athlete about 2 weeks to get back into basketball shape. let's see: Basketball season counting the school season is from approx:  November to July/early Aug. I would stay with basketball conditioning. The problem is that football as a secondary sport starts in Aug/Sept. There really is no time for a rest period for the kids who want to play football. [/quote] It is interesting that you are able to quantify things for "truly gifted athletes"   Now, what about those who are not so "truly gifted"? [/quote]Simple, the not so gifted are at home most of the day playing X-Box or WI-FI thingy. [/quote]  Unrivaled brilliance

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="817648" timestamp="1278954887"] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70860.msg816293#msg816293 date=1278378747] There has been considerable debate about the pluses and minuses of Universal Off Season training at the high school level.  Would like your input on this please. [/quote]Stevie, it takes a truly gifted athlete about 2 weeks to get back into basketball shape. let's see: Basketball season counting the school season is from approx:  November to July/early Aug. I would stay with basketball conditioning. The problem is that football as a secondary sport starts in Aug/Sept. There really is no time for a rest period for the kids who want to play football. [/quote] It is interesting that you are able to quantify things for "truly gifted athletes"  Now, what about those who are not so "truly gifted"?

[quote name="86hawk" post="816564" timestamp="1278516354"] [b] Cleveland is not going to allow the same thing to happen to the three years in a row. [/b] Navasota was probably thinking the same thing.  Cleveland should have beaten HJ last year, but lack of discipline (IMO) did them end.  Unless they can play under control, they will likely meet the same fate. [/quote] They got in a little bit of a hole(Sutherland was hitting 3s from everywhere) and then started playing dirty to catch up and the refs called em on it.  In my opinion, that is a coaching issue.

[quote name="ForeverADog" post="816534" timestamp="1278506190"] Coach Williams was my coach my first 3 years of high school and is nice guy. Even though he never had much success in 4a going up against Lincoln and such. He likes to press. Similar to HJ trapping press. Evadale has the talent to press and be successful in that district so I look for him to do great for them. [/quote] Best wishes to coach Williams for success in Evadale.

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="816389" timestamp="1278427133"] [quote author=AggiesAreWe link=topic=70692.msg816324#msg816324 date=1278384621] Correction, Administrator. ;D [/quote] :-X :-X [/quote] Dove- its commendable that you acknowledge and respect those who occupy the hierarchy.  Have you taken the time to respond to the poll on this board regarding Universal Off Season?

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="816395" timestamp="1278428261"] DaDove is back-not sure for how long but anyway back to the question...... I visited the HF middle school to see what was going on in weight training class. In all honesty, I didn't have a problem with the workout EXCEPT the knee squats. My own personal feeling is that kid's (middle school)are too young to handle the stress of knee squats, especially when they are very active year round. [/quote] But I want to know if the "new circumstances" have altered, in any way, your prediction for a state title in the near future?

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="816324" timestamp="1278384621"] Correction, Administrator. ;D [/quote] Permit me to say then, that this experience is even more humbling.

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="816320" timestamp="1278383571"] Your "cleansing" is inspirational, but I am just feeling good about my charitable work for the day. You're welcome. [/quote] To think that a commoner could be inspirational to a moderator is beyond my wildest dreams

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="816316" timestamp="1278382244"] Glad I could be of assistance. My good deed for the day. [/quote] I guess you are experiencing that cleansing right now albeit indirectly via the veiled baiting admission.  That truly was a fine deed.  Two cleansings in one thread is an amazing accomplishment.

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="816308" timestamp="1278380941"] I admit to my mistakes daily. Just ask my wife. ;D Hopefully your initial "cleansing" will benefit you. [/quote] Darn- I misunderstood you again.  After all, you had "declared" that to be my first admission.  But of course, little ole me thought you meant it regarding statements on this board only.  But now you say that it also includes our domestic lives as well.  But I guess that rank has its privileges.  Guess I will just have to keep plugging away.  I was flattered though that you inferred I was the king of baitors and the flattery was accompanied by your admission that I know baiting when I see it.  Now I can rest comfortably in knowing I may have been wrong about OJ and Clinton, but not about the bait.

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="816305" timestamp="1278380590"] The king of baiters would know when bait has been thrown. ;) ::) Could it be that I asked the question about Silsbee in reference to Silsbee not using universal? Grad understood my " ;) :-X". Glad you realized your mistake. That's a first. [/quote]  It is very cleansing.  If you ever try it, you  will know exactly what I mean.  Hmm- looks like a tacit admission of bait throwing.

There has been considerable debate about the pluses and minuses of Universal Off Season training at the high school level.  Would like your input on this please.

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="816290" timestamp="1278378131"] Where did I imply that Silsbee used universal? I asked if folks considered Silsbee a successful basketball program in spite of not having a state title. [/quote] SInce you are very dedicated to staying on topic, then, what made you interject that comment in the middle of a discussion on the advantages/drawbacks of Universal Off Season?  I know, I know, it was just a coincidence because you were "suddenly" moved to make that inquiry about the Silsbee basketball program and did not want to start a new thread to find out.  The smiley faces after WOS grad also interpreted your inference as that Silsbee used the program was also strictly coincidental.  There certainly was no bait thrown out in that thread now, was there?  It was obviously my mistake.  But, it wont be the first time I was wrong.  I had to rethink things after OJ said he didnt do it and BIll Clinton said he did not have sex with that woman.

[quote name="WOSgrad" post="816259" timestamp="1278367277"] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70692.msg816246#msg816246 date=1278364773] [quote author=WOSgrad link=topic=70692.msg816237#msg816237 date=1278362295] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70692.msg816235#msg816235 date=1278361608] [quote author=WOSgrad link=topic=70692.msg816220#msg816220 date=1278358624] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70692.msg816212#msg816212 date=1278357010] Excuse me, now I think I understand you.  Let me see if I have it right.  The reason that a basketball program is better served with Universal Off Season than a basketball coach supervising and determining how and when to lift is- [/quote] In Hamshire, yes that is the case. Oh, and in answer to your question (because far be it from me to want to incur your wrath for not answering one of your questions)-too many make the playoffs for my blood. I think they had it right when 2 went from each district.  But. be that as it may, for most schools a playoff berth is still a measure of success.  And in fact, the failure to make the playoffs given the number of opportunities is an extreme failure. Now my turn for a question.  Why do you continue to have your fundamental opposition to Universal Offseason Programs in general cause you to believe that Coach Price's C&S program, which you do not know what it will entail, will doom the boy basketball program at Hamshire-Fannett? [/quote]  In case you are unaware, I DID NOT start this thread but happen to believe in the theory that Universal Off Season is counterproductive when it comes to basketball.  It has nothing to do with coach price (as previously noted).  You will never convince me that a basketball coach is less qualified than the football coach to determine when and where weight training should take place for basketball players.  AS I said in an earlier post, when it comes down to the last few seconds of a playoff game and my player has the ball, the only thing that interests me is whether or not he can make the shot.  If the skill isnt there, bigger, stronger, faster all become irrelevant.  PLease convince me I am wrong about this.  And while you are in the convincing "mode", convince me that a majority of consistently good basketball programs uses Universal Off Season for the basketball team. [/quote] I have long since endeavoring to convince you of anything, nash.  I would like you to ask the basketball minds, since you have evidently picked their brain as to whether they believe basketball skill is the end all be all as you have seemed to have intimated in your last post and that all other matters as you put it are "irrelevant."  And Really, I don't know enough about who does what as far as weight training to be able to answer your question as to who is successful with it or who is not. [/quote]  I do know that the great majority of highly successful basketball programs do not employ Universal Off Season because, like it or not, it does not benefit the basketball players like it does  the  football players.  I tried another analogy earlier but apparently someone deleted it.  Go back a few years when HJ had Ryan Donahoe and WOS had UT Signee and Seattle Seahawk Earl Thomas.Each time they played each other,  I think everyone knows who was bigger, stronger, and faster.(and it certainly benefitted Earl a lot)  I also think everyone knows who was the better basketball player. [/quote] Well, your analogy fails for this topic because it fails to account for an element that you pointed out, that being that Ryan was simply a more talented player than Earl.  What does that have to do with their preparation and whether a "universal" offseason program helps?  I'd submit to you that without Earl being as fast and strong as he was, he would have had no shot against Ryan.   Be that as it may, in this case, H-F has no Ryan Donahoes that we know of.  So why not let Coach Price implement a program that may improve them physically while they work on their respective basketball games? [/quote]The "failed analogy" was simply an example of Ryan developing his abilities over the years in the gym.  He was NOT born with an advantage.  It was developed and the development was a skills based development,.

[quote name="stevenash" post="816286" timestamp="1278377150"] [quote author=AggiesAreWe link=topic=70692.msg816285#msg816285 date=1278376837] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70692.msg816283#msg816283 date=1278376326] [quote author=AggiesAreWe link=topic=70692.msg816282#msg816282 date=1278376169] Well, guess what guys, Silsbee does not use the universal. ;) [/quote] [b]No wonder they are so successful[/b].  By the way,  a couple of my posts have been deleted.  You or WOS grad wouldnt know anything about that would you? [/quote] I thought that was why they didn't win two state titles? Which is it? ::) As for the deleting of posts, I have only deleted one post/thread today. The starting of that thread was unnecessary. I made it very clear in a prior post in this thread that I was against the universal, but that I wasn't going to condemn any school for using it. You should have bothered to read before including me into your argument. [/quote]  You will have to ask the OTHER TWO individuals who thought that Silsbee used UOS and would have  won it all if they hadnt.  Speaking of "which is it"- YOu first implied they used universal off season and then said they didnt-  Doesnt the "whicih is it" apply to you as well? [/quote]  I have read every one of the posts and believe I understand all of them pretty well.

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="816285" timestamp="1278376837"] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70692.msg816283#msg816283 date=1278376326] [quote author=AggiesAreWe link=topic=70692.msg816282#msg816282 date=1278376169] Well, guess what guys, Silsbee does not use the universal. ;) [/quote] [b]No wonder they are so successful[/b].  By the way,  a couple of my posts have been deleted.  You or WOS grad wouldnt know anything about that would you? [/quote] I thought that was why they didn't win two state titles? Which is it? ::) As for the deleting of posts, I have only deleted one post/thread today. The starting of that thread was unnecessary. I made it very clear in a prior post in this thread that I was against the universal, but that I wasn't going to condemn any school for using it. You should have bothered to read before including me into your argument. [/quote]  You will have to ask the OTHER TWO individuals who thought that Silsbee used UOS and would have  won it all if they hadnt.  Speaking of "which is it"- YOu first implied they used universal off season and then said they didnt-  Doesnt the "whicih is it" apply to you as well?

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="816282" timestamp="1278376169"] Well, guess what guys, Silsbee does not use the universal. ;) [/quote] No wonder they are so successful.  By the way,  a couple of my posts have been deleted.  You or WOS grad wouldnt know anything about that would you?

[quote name="team first" post="816276" timestamp="1278374974"] Was the question, "If Silsbee did not have the universal off-season, would they have 2 state championships right now"? If so, I would say yes!!! Sorry, but they are quick and athletic enough, if they would have been more skilled they would most likely have 2 right now!!! Universal off-season, as I have already stated is not the answer. Silsbee was good enough, in the eyes of a few!! Just didnt reach their potential, but got that tired pulled across the field. [/quote] Hmmm- Interesting

No- just like u would never inject yourself into this discussion in order to stir the pot and would never delete a post of someone else.

[quote name="WOSgrad" post="816262" timestamp="1278368240"] [quote author=AggiesAreWe link=topic=70692.msg816261#msg816261 date=1278368125] Question, is Silsbee considered a successful basketball program? I know that we have no state titles, but are we considered a successful basketball program? Just curious. [/quote] Of course, not, because Silsbee does use a universal offseason program right, AAW?  So by definition they cannot be successful. [/quote]Silsbee basketball program as good or better than any. My guess it has a lot more to do with number of players avaiable than it does with universal off season.  There are those who would suggest that, under the right circumstances, they would hold two state titles in the last four years

[quote name="Betrayed" post="816218" timestamp="1278358381"] And you know it ;) [/quote] Its just odd that on the nights that he had 40+ and hits the game winner, there never seems to be an arthritic difficulty.  Some of the poor (make that very poor) decisions he made in that game means the arthritis has made its way to his brain as well.

[quote name="WOSgrad" post="816249" timestamp="1278365578"] [quote author=Bucof2010 link=topic=70692.msg816241#msg816241 date=1278363600] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70692.msg816133#msg816133 date=1278299022] [quote author=Bucof2010 link=topic=70692.msg816129#msg816129 date=1278297074] Lol Idk a whole lot about 1-a but you take off EC and Anahuac of the past few years you don't have much on that list I know I know Buna has accomplished more than any two of those teams but we're out of the stone age now [/quote] And one would also need to ask what has been accomplished at EC after departure of Tremain Thomas [/quote] Look what we were doing before and while he was here geez two down years and we get thrown under the bus [/quote] Even allies are expendable in Mr. Nash's quest for being right. [/quote]  Boy you certainly are right there.  Implying that EC has not done as well without Thomas is truly a terrible and inaccurate(?) thing to say.  I guess there are a lot of us who BELIEVE we are right.  It is obvious that this is NOT an EXCLUSIVE province of mine.  Do I need to also apologize to Mr. Thomas at this point?

[quote name="WOSgrad" post="816237" timestamp="1278362295"] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70692.msg816235#msg816235 date=1278361608] [quote author=WOSgrad link=topic=70692.msg816220#msg816220 date=1278358624] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70692.msg816212#msg816212 date=1278357010] Excuse me, now I think I understand you.  Let me see if I have it right.  The reason that a basketball program is better served with Universal Off Season than a basketball coach supervising and determining how and when to lift is- [/quote] In Hamshire, yes that is the case. Oh, and in answer to your question (because far be it from me to want to incur your wrath for not answering one of your questions)-too many make the playoffs for my blood. I think they had it right when 2 went from each district.  But. be that as it may, for most schools a playoff berth is still a measure of success.  And in fact, the failure to make the playoffs given the number of opportunities is an extreme failure. Now my turn for a question.  Why do you continue to have your fundamental opposition to Universal Offseason Programs in general cause you to believe that Coach Price's C&S program, which you do not know what it will entail, will doom the boy basketball program at Hamshire-Fannett? [/quote]  In case you are unaware, I DID NOT start this thread but happen to believe in the theory that Universal Off Season is counterproductive when it comes to basketball.  It has nothing to do with coach price (as previously noted).  You will never convince me that a basketball coach is less qualified than the football coach to determine when and where weight training should take place for basketball players.  AS I said in an earlier post, when it comes down to the last few seconds of a playoff game and my player has the ball, the only thing that interests me is whether or not he can make the shot.  If the skill isnt there, bigger, stronger, faster all become irrelevant.  PLease convince me I am wrong about this.  And while you are in the convincing "mode", convince me that a majority of consistently good basketball programs uses Universal Off Season for the basketball team. [/quote] I have long since endeavoring to convince you of anything, nash.  I would like you to ask the basketball minds, since you have evidently picked their brain as to whether they believe basketball skill is the end all be all as you have seemed to have intimated in your last post and that all other matters as you put it are "irrelevant."  And Really, I don't know enough about who does what as far as weight training to be able to answer your question as to who is successful with it or who is not. [/quote]  I do know that the great majority of highly successful basketball programs do not employ Universal Off Season because, like it or not, it does not benefit the basketball players like it does  the  football players.  I t ried another analogy earlier but apparently someone deleted it.  Go back a few years when HJ had Ryan Donahoe and WOS had UT Signee and Seattle Seahawk Earl Thomas.Each time they played each other,  I think everyone knows who was b igger, stronger, and faster.(and it certainly benefitted Earl a lot)  I also think everyone knows who was the better basketball player.

[quote name="WOSgrad" post="816220" timestamp="1278358624"] [quote author=stevenash link=topic=70692.msg816212#msg816212 date=1278357010] Excuse me, now I think I understand you.  Let me see if I have it right.  The reason that a basketball program is better served with Universal Off Season than a basketball coach supervising and determining how and when to lift is- [/quote] In Hamshire, yes that is the case. Oh, and in answer to your question (because far be it from me to want to incur your wrath for not answering one of your questions)-too many make the playoffs for my blood. I think they had it right when 2 went from each district.  But. be that as it may, for most schools a playoff berth is still a measure of success.  And in fact, the failure to make the playoffs given the number of opportunities is an extreme failure. Now my turn for a question.  Why do you continue to have your fundamental opposition to Universal Offseason Programs in general cause you to believe that Coach Price's C&S program, which you do not know what it will entail, will doom the boy basketball program at Hamshire-Fannett? [/quote]  In case you are unaware, I DID NOT start this thread but happen to believe in the theory that Universal Off Season is counterproductive when it comes to basketball.  It has nothing to do with coach price (as previously noted).  You will never convince me that a basketball coach is less qualified than the football coach to determine when and where weight training should take place for basketball players.  AS I said in an earlier post, when it comes down to the last few seconds of a playoff game and my player has the ball, the only thing that interests me is whether or not he can make the shot.  If the skill isnt there, bigger, stronger, faster all become irrelevant.  PLease convince me I am wrong about this.  And while you are in the convincing "mode", convince me that a majority of consistently good basketball programs uses Universal Off Season for the basketball team.

[quote name="Betrayed" post="816210" timestamp="1278356175"] Kobe Bryant has the index finger of an 83-year-old man, We all remember Kobe Bryant's(notes) 6-24 shooting performance in Game 7 of this year's NBA finals. It wasn't a very good shooting performance, obviously, as he didn't make very many shots but continued to take shots. Basically, it was the very definition of a bad shooting performance, and I heard that Kobe Bryant's face will be added next to that phrase in a completely nonexistent dictionary of basketball terms.However, while Kobe's shooting wasn't so great, it's pretty easy to forget that he was playing with a severely injured right index finger, also known as the finger most important to shooting. When you remember that little factoid, making any shots with a completely retooled release is impressive. But that's Kobe Bryant for you — doing whatever he can to perform at a high level.As it turns out, that dedication might have cost Kobe a finger. No, it's not like he's going to lose it, but it's definitely going to be a pain in the hand for the next 50 years of his life.For Bryant, the sacrifice for success could well be visible for the rest of his career in the form of something that is not another championship ring to go around his finger.He might never play again without wearing support for his damaged right index finger.The middle knuckle on that critical finger on Bryant's shooting hand is so debilitated by arthritis after the past season of misuse and overuse that there may be no real way to fix it. Bryant will consult with specialists in July to figure out his options, but arthritis is not a problem that can just be cleaned up with arthroscopic surgery or wished away with a little rest.Yikes. The old broken finger that turns arthritic is never fun, especially in the two very similar fields of NBA basketball and blogging. We've lost a lot of good men out there, mostly from arthritic fingers.Seriously, though, playing through an injury is hard enough for anyone in any sport. But playing through an injury to your index finger on your shooting hand in a sport that requires constant use of that finger and hand? That's definitely not amoré, Dino. That's constant pain 82 times a season, plus the playoffs, for another five years, at least. Like I said before, yikes. [/quote]Hmmm- So the athritis lroblem is the reason on the bad nights.