BLUEDOVE3

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390852" timestamp="1364940782"] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110469.msg1390839#msg1390839 date=1364937135] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=110469.msg1390810#msg1390810 date=1364928547] Dove- get some new victims- blaming Fox and Bush is out of date [/quote]Well, thats one of the major problems with you guys. Yall very  limited as to how and where you get your information for entertainment.  ;) [/quote] Please enlighten me.  Tell me how your news and entertainment is superior to mine. [/quote]Easy! We listen/watch CNN, MSNBC, fox, ABC, CBS,NBC, etc. Yall, well thats a different story. [s]Drugbaugh[/s]...err Limbaugh, [s]Prick[/s], errr Beck, fox and palin.

[quote name="Sfajacks10" post="1390945" timestamp="1364955113"] I understand Tubby Smith came in to UK when it was a really hot program but it takes a lot to maintain a program like that and he did. All his other jobs he was successful so I expect and hope for the same at Tech. Tech needs not just a quality coach but a quality person. Good hire. I was hoping they picked up Keith Frazier from Kimball HS but he went with ol Larry Brown and SMU. [/quote] The rumors I kept hearing involving Keith Frazier was getting crazy. (1) He wasn't going to Tech unless Chris Walker was hired as the permanent coach (2) possibility that his high school coach was getting a job at Tech if Frazier committed. Again, I said these were the rumors being spread out there, but still makes for some interesting conversation. Especially after he goes to SMU after the Tubby hire.

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390853" timestamp="1364940916"] Whatever you say.  I am still of the opinion that if you are running at me full speed and I move in the opposite direction (properly timed) you wont be so fast that I don't have a brief opening.  Ray Allen makes a pretty good living without the crossover/create his own shot.  If what you say is 100% accurate, then Larry Bird should have never scored. [/quote]Nash, you are leaving out a valuable equation to your solution. And I totally agree with you on your examples. But you continually want to compare players who were or are very dedicated to their craft. Not many high schoolers are dedicated to this craft. So with that being said, I still stand by by original statement. They don't work out 'adjusting their game."  ;)

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390810" timestamp="1364928547"] Dove- get some new victims- blaming Fox and Bush is out of date [/quote]Well, thats one of the major problems with you guys. Yall very  limited as to how and where you get your information for entertainment.  ;)

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390836" timestamp="1364935778"] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110733.msg1390832#msg1390832 date=1364934157] [quote author=Basketball IQ link=topic=110733.msg1390820#msg1390820 date=1364930507] Depends on the opponent huh? Various types of defenses are practiced in the hopes that the coach will implement whichever one increases his chance of beating that particular opponent. Personally I would play zone against any team in the Golden Triangle (as they are less than proficient at shooting from the outside) and force them to do what they're not comfortable doing which is stroking the jumper. The average high school team is fortunate if they have one 40%'er from the floor so coaching a squad up with the mentality of allowing your opponent one shot only, procuring the rebound and fast breaking out of the zone is a viable game plan in this day and age where player's are enamored with the cross-over versus the catch and shoot..... [/quote]In high school, I'll take a [s]cross-over [/s] ...errr create your own shot AND a catch and shoot player any day than a catch & shoot (only)player in high school. Most catch & shoot kids can't shoot with a man closing in fast in their space. Kids are more athletic and quicker these days and can guard catch and shoot players. [/quote] Dove, If I am the catch and shoot player and you are the quick athletic guy who is closing on me very quickly, I am going to guess a small head fake may create an opening for the slowest of the slow. [/quote]Nope!!!  But I could prove my point to you in a gym just like I had to do for another area coach who thought his player was going to light up the score board  ::) against a very athletic AND smart players. Deadly combination. Ask Duke!!

[quote name="Basketball IQ" post="1390820" timestamp="1364930507"] Depends on the opponent huh? Various types of defenses are practiced in the hopes that the coach will implement whichever one increases his chance of beating that particular opponent. Personally I would play zone against any team in the Golden Triangle (as they are less than proficient at shooting from the outside) and force them to do what they're not comfortable doing which is stroking the jumper. The average high school team is fortunate if they have one 40%'er from the floor so coaching a squad up with the mentality of allowing your opponent one shot only, procuring the rebound and fast breaking out of the zone is a viable game plan in this day and age where player's are enamored with the cross-over versus the catch and shoot..... [/quote]In high school, I'll take a [s]cross-over [/s] ...errr create your own shot AND a catch and shoot player any day than a catch & shoot (only)player in high school. Most catch & shoot kids can't shoot with a man closing in fast in their space. Kids are more athletic and quicker these days and can guard catch and shoot players.

[quote name="usedtobe" post="1390796" timestamp="1364927059"] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110469.msg1390787#msg1390787 date=1364926125] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=110469.msg1390760#msg1390760 date=1364920784] Well, Dove, if you are correct, we are in great shape because I was thinking there were more than 1% who were lazy, especially since we have a system that encourages laziness. [/quote] Nah, only a small percentage. Fox have you guys thinking we're on the brink of an economic collapse because too much  freebies. [/quote] I'm not Nash, but it isn't Fox that has me thinking that - it's your Guy, Obama. ::) [/quote]Well, Bush11 surely had you tightening your straight jacket for the bumpy ride.

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390760" timestamp="1364920784"] Well, Dove, if you are correct, we are in great shape because I was thinking there were more than 1% who were lazy, especially since we have a system that encourages laziness. [/quote] Nah, only a small percentage. Fox have you guys thinking we're on the brink of an economic collapse because too much  freebies.

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390775" timestamp="1364924316"] Do you think he recruited Carmelo because of his adaptability to a zone defense? [/quote] He recruited Carmelo because he could score in his system  ;D Hmmm? I'm sure he taught him defense after practices started. ;)

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390762" timestamp="1364920943"] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110733.msg1390713#msg1390713 date=1364911625] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=110733.msg1390710#msg1390710 date=1364910652] My point was that I believe Mr. Boeheim recruits the best basketball players he can find and then has them adapt to his system because he teaches it well.  I believe he could trade places with Coach K or Pitino right now and be very successful with those players using his system. [/quote]And [color=red]MY POINT[/color] being is that  Boeheim's recruits have to [color=red]meet a certain criteria[/color] BEFORE he makes a commitment. [/quote] What criteria?  Are you telling me that Mr. Boeheim looks at potential recruits and somehow decides "now this guy could do well in my zone defense" and that guy cannot?  Or does he do like most coaches and gets the best players he can get? [/quote]Exactly Nash, he may want to run from the 1-3-1 full court zone press  ;)

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390761" timestamp="1364920867"] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110733.msg1390753#msg1390753 date=1364920355] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=110733.msg1390739#msg1390739 date=1364916557] [quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=110733.msg1390727#msg1390727 date=1364915563] Some coaches just believe in the zone concept, and what it can do to a team defensively. My dad was a HUGE zone guy..Me, not so much..I think that zones expose weaknesses in a team's ability to actually defend. On the high school level, trapping zones thrown in every now and then are good to stymie a team offensively and get them off of their rhythm, but like any other zone, if you stay in it long enough, they will adapt to it, and its no longer effective. Its hard to adapt to tough man defense..If you can disrupt an offense playing man, you've done something! That means you are guarding your B---S off!  ;D ;D...Side note: You DO NOT have to have athletes to play man, contrary to what some may think.  As a coach you have to be able to teach more "team" man concepts, which emphasizes help principles...But thats another conversation for another day.. ;) [/quote] Dickie- Don't help principles imply that some sort of "zone" is, in effect, being used?  As for "staying in it long enough" would that statement not apply to any type of defense? [/quote] Always starting mess on here.  ::) [/quote] Just trying to learn a few things from you and Dickie V. [/quote] ;D

[quote name="UNLV" post="1390730" timestamp="1364915930"] Mcneese is poor, small, in Louisiana. Chuck is Mcneese only real positive. Lamar has everything and more to move BACK up. [/quote] yeah , a new stadium and no team. Kinda like buying a new suit and wearing scuffed up old shoes.

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390747" timestamp="1364917326"] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110469.msg1390704#msg1390704 date=1364909590] [quote author=Honest Abe link=topic=110469.msg1390656#msg1390656 date=1364870328] [quote author=no-look link=topic=110469.msg1390624#msg1390624 date=1364863818] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110469.msg1390619#msg1390619 date=1364862893] [quote author=no-look link=topic=110469.msg1390614#msg1390614 date=1364861891] [quote author=usedtobe link=topic=110469.msg1390596#msg1390596 date=1364854296] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110469.msg1390489#msg1390489 date=1364829356] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=110469.msg1390472#msg1390472 date=1364826189] Is the "capital establishment" comprised of bad people? [/quote] Greedy people who will stop at nothing to take your dollars for profit. [/quote] Dove, if you still sell cars, then you are a MAJOR hypocrite! :-X [/quote]It's 99% of those car salesmen that give the rest of them a bad name...  ;D  Just kidding, I sold cars for about six years. [/quote] Hmmm? Did I fire you? [/quote]Nah, I was always in the top three. It was those guys on or near the bottom that would get the axe...lol [/quote]Maybe those at the top should share their profits with those at the bottom so they don't get the axe? That should motivate...NOBODY!! ;D [/quote] Only  the 1% are lazy.  ;D [/quote] The 1% are lazy and pay most of the taxes. [/quote] My apologies Mr. Nash, I meant the other 1% on the bottom totem pole are lazy.

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390739" timestamp="1364916557"] [quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=110733.msg1390727#msg1390727 date=1364915563] Some coaches just believe in the zone concept, and what it can do to a team defensively. My dad was a HUGE zone guy..Me, not so much..I think that zones expose weaknesses in a team's ability to actually defend. On the high school level, trapping zones thrown in every now and then are good to stymie a team offensively and get them off of their rhythm, but like any other zone, if you stay in it long enough, they will adapt to it, and its no longer effective. Its hard to adapt to tough man defense..If you can disrupt an offense playing man, you've done something! That means you are guarding your B---S off!  ;D ;D...Side note: You DO NOT have to have athletes to play man, contrary to what some may think.  As a coach you have to be able to teach more "team" man concepts, which emphasizes help principles...But thats another conversation for another day.. ;) [/quote] Dickie- Don't help principles imply that some sort of "zone" is, in effect, being used?  As for "staying in it long enough" would that statement not apply to any type of defense? [/quote] Always starting mess on here.  ::)

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1390727" timestamp="1364915563"] Some coaches just believe in the zone concept, and what it can do to a team defensively. My dad was a HUGE zone guy..Me, not so much..I think that zones expose weaknesses in a team's ability to actually defend. On the high school level, trapping zones thrown in every now and then are good to stymie a team offensively and get them off of their rhythm, but like any other zone, if you stay in it long enough, they will adapt to it, and its no longer effective. Its hard to adapt to tough man defense..If you can disrupt an offense playing man, you've done something! That means you are guarding your B---S off!  ;D ;D...Side note: You DO NOT have to have athletes to play man, contrary to what some may think.  As a coach you have to be able to teach more "team" man concepts, which emphasizes help principles...But thats another conversation for another day.. ;) [/quote] Yeah, a 1-3-1[color=red] full court[/color] press zone.... was one of his favorites, but not mine.  :'(

[quote name="BlueOwl" post="1390680" timestamp="1364876901"] Haha children these days making little threads to see what people have to say about them! [/quote] Or more likely the parents.

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390710" timestamp="1364910652"] My point was that I believe Mr. Boeheim recruits the best basketball players he can find and then has them adapt to his system because he teaches it well.  I believe he could trade places with Coach K or Pitino right now and be very successful with those players using his system. [/quote]And [color=red]MY POINT[/color] being is that  Boeheim's recruits have to [color=red]meet a certain criteria[/color] BEFORE he makes a commitment.

Tubby is probably the right move.  Good point, the culture of that program needs to change.

Cannot believe I just gave Nash a +1. Thats on the scale of Obama and Rep. Majority Leader settling the debt issue.

[quote name="Honest Abe" post="1390705" timestamp="1364909743"] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110733.msg1390698#msg1390698 date=1364907324] [quote author=Mr. Buddy Garrity link=topic=110733.msg1390665#msg1390665 date=1364872098] [quote author=Honest Abe link=topic=110733.msg1390659#msg1390659 date=1364870548] Do players who play for Jim Boeheim not have the talent level to play man defense? They absolutely COULD play man, but they don't bc of his 'system'. Seems to be working pretty well for him. ;) [/quote] +1!! [/quote] You can take that plus away now  ;) [/quote]It was still a valid point. The original post did not specify HS 'systems' only. If it make you feel better, I'll give you a +1. [/quote]Thanks Abe, I can use all I can get.  8)

[quote name="Stevenash" post="1390703" timestamp="1364909451"] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110733.msg1390697#msg1390697 date=1364907291] [quote author=Honest Abe link=topic=110733.msg1390659#msg1390659 date=1364870548] Do players who play for Jim Boeheim not have the talent level to play man defense? They absolutely COULD play man, but they don't bc of his 'system'. Seems to be working pretty well for him. ;) [/quote]Jim RECRUITS players[color=orange] that fit his system[/color]. Big difference [/quote] What is it about a recruit that makes him "fit" into a zone system better than a man to man system?  Were Derrick Coleman, Pearl Washington and Carmelo Anthony incapable of functioning in a man to man system?  My guess is that if the coach is a great teacher, he can "fit" most any player into his system. [/quote]Ding! Ding!!! Give the man a ribbon.  You hit the correct keys to the notes being played out....... "[color=red]My guess is that if the coach is a great teacher[/color]"

[quote name="Honest Abe" post="1390656" timestamp="1364870328"] [quote author=no-look link=topic=110469.msg1390624#msg1390624 date=1364863818] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110469.msg1390619#msg1390619 date=1364862893] [quote author=no-look link=topic=110469.msg1390614#msg1390614 date=1364861891] [quote author=usedtobe link=topic=110469.msg1390596#msg1390596 date=1364854296] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=110469.msg1390489#msg1390489 date=1364829356] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=110469.msg1390472#msg1390472 date=1364826189] Is the "capital establishment" comprised of bad people? [/quote] Greedy people who will stop at nothing to take your dollars for profit. [/quote] Dove, if you still sell cars, then you are a MAJOR hypocrite! :-X [/quote]It's 99% of those car salesmen that give the rest of them a bad name...  ;D  Just kidding, I sold cars for about six years. [/quote] Hmmm? Did I fire you? [/quote]Nah, I was always in the top three. It was those guys on or near the bottom that would get the axe...lol [/quote]Maybe those at the top should share their profits with those at the bottom so they don't get the axe? That should motivate...NOBODY!! ;D [/quote] Only  the 1% are lazy.  ;D

Yep, the question was in reference to high school. Which is a good question.

[quote name="Mr. Buddy Garrity" post="1390665" timestamp="1364872098"] [quote author=Honest Abe link=topic=110733.msg1390659#msg1390659 date=1364870548] Do players who play for Jim Boeheim not have the talent level to play man defense? They absolutely COULD play man, but they don't bc of his 'system'. Seems to be working pretty well for him. ;) [/quote] +1!! [/quote] You can take that plus away now  ;)

[quote name="Honest Abe" post="1390659" timestamp="1364870548"] Do players who play for Jim Boeheim not have the talent level to play man defense? They absolutely COULD play man, but they don't bc of his 'system'. Seems to be working pretty well for him. ;) [/quote]Jim RECRUITS players[color=orange] that fit his system[/color]. Big difference