bullets13

Just because you disagree with them, doesn't make them paper thin. You have yet to tell he how we're going to afford these extra 800,000 mouths a year, and where we're going to house them. It's not a crime.

We both know what happens the majority of the time. Just making a point.

what if a young couple is being responsible and using birth control and it fails? it happens.

I like the whole "you messed up one night, be accountable for 18 years" argument. Especially when you drop it on a teenager. Abortion is a legal method for being accountable, versus having the child and expecting others to raise it or pay for it. Again, here's an example of the typical conservative view on abortion: it's an outrage for tax payers to pay for abortions, but it's also an outrage for tax payers to pay for children on welfare.

I have two adopted daughters, btw. Glad your family found loving homes. Mine did as well. There are plenty out there who do not. Trust me, I've been deeply involved in the foster care system for the last 3 years.

my statistics come from the over 800,000 abortions a year in the US. Do these kids suddenly become wanted when brought to term? As for kids in orphanages and foster care, is there a difference to you between a 3 year old child and an 8-week-old embryo that's the size of a bean? There is to me. But you do bring up a good point about orphanages and foster care... there already aren't enough qualified and adequate homes for children in need of foster care. Where are all of these new kids going to go?

Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. It's been legal for a long time, well before our country moved from ultra conservative to ultra liberal. Personally, I don't have an issue with a woman choosing to end her pregnancy when the embryo is still the size of a lima bean, and not even close to viable outside of the womb. I have a major issue with partial birth abortions, and abortions where the embryo is developed enough to be viable. If you have an issue with that, that's perfectly fine, and I respect your reasoning behind that. All that being said, this thread is a perfect representation of how things go in the real world: conservatives are pro-life, and rabidly against abortion, but can offer no solutions as to what will be done with all of these unwanted children when they're born. Most of them don't want to pay for the fallout, and almost none of them are going to take a couple of these kids into their home.

Totally agree with all of this. I'd also like to get younger kids access to birth control. I feel a lot differently about a 15-year-old getting an abortion vs. a 25-year-old. Part of the issue is that the same contingent of conservative folks that are against abortions are also against birth control for teens because they feel it encourages sexual activity. That has changed some, but it's still definitely an issue.

I'd love to see it, but I doubt it. Everything aligned perfectly this week. This was the first tourney he'd really been competitive in all year. That said, he's definitely held up better than most older golfers, so I guess you never know. He was still posting some pretty impressive results as recently as 2018 and 2019.

"Although the emergence of the novel coronavirus now known as SARS-CoV-2 was probably not due to China’s actions, the emphasis that its authoritarian system places on hiding bad news likely gave the disease a sizable head start infecting the world." I don't think it's even debatable that China caused this to get out of hand by hiding the virus until it was already well on it's way to being established all over the world, and underrepresenting it's seriousness. They knew well before the rest of the world that it was going to kill a lot of people, and how contagious it is. They lied about those numbers, and still do.

I respect your beliefs. As I've stated before, abortions aren't something I'm a fan of, but I do see them as a necessity in some situations. That said, excuses or not, what is your solution to taking care of all of these unwanted babies? I just looked it up, and there are over 800,000 abortions a year in the USA. So where do we put 2.4 million children under the age of 3? Or 9.6 million unwanted children under the age of 12? You can't tell a parent that they have to keep them after you won't let them abort them. Who's going to pay for these children? I know enough republicans (I'm one of them) who gripe about having to support kids who are with their biological mothers and on welfare because their parents can't afford them. What about when taxes are necessary to pay for the entire raising of kids from birth to 18 in federal or state care, with an average of 12-15M kids in care at any given time?

easy to say, but not as easy to make happen. for every unwanted baby that finds a loving home through adoption there are countless more that end up in horrible homes, foster care, or worse. Having gone through the adoption process, I can attest to the fact that there are lots of brand new babies available, and for only $20-30K, one can be yours! That said, add 500,000 unwanted babies a year into the mix, and it's gonna take about a month before you run out of homes for those babies. Then what, open state run orphanages? Federal orphanages? It's been my experience that the folks who care the most about unwanted, unborn fetuses are also the least interested in supporting those fetuses with their tax dollars after they're born. Most of them aren't lining up to take in other people's infants, either.

1000%. protest is fine, but when you're burning things you lose your credibility. When you stop emergency vehicles from responding to calls you lose your credibility. When you destroy your own neighborhoods you lose your credibility. When you're so upset about something that you feel the need to break into stores and do your christmas shopping, you lose credibility.

That is accurate. They're almost exclusively done before a fetus is viable. The vast majority of those occurring beyond four months occur due to the health risks of the mother. For example we had a family friend who terminated a pregnancy at 5 months because she found out she had liver cancer and would need chemotherapy. she had to choose between chemo and the baby. She had three living children, so she chose the chemo to try and avoid leaving them without a mother.

I think the majority of abortions are young women who make mistakes and realize that they're not ready to be parents. Personally, I don't like the idea of abortions. It's not something that sets well with me. But there are plenty of things that don't set well with me that aren't illegal. You ask when I'm okay with abortions: my personal opinion is that once an embryo is viable, and developed enough to possibly survive outside of the mother, that mother should no longer have an option to terminate the pregnancy. At 8 weeks an embryo is the size of a lima bean. I see that a lot differently than when a fetus is 5 months old and has a (very small) chance of survival outside of the womb. And how far do we take it? Most Catholics think birth control is a sin. Now, you asked me a question, and I answered, and I asked you a question and you deflected it. Your question was a very specific question of an unlikely scenario, but I answered. My question was specific and an unlikely scenario, and you avoided it: It's a yes or no answer: If your wife was raped would you want her to be forced to carry the child to term without the option of terminating the pregnancy?

I really think every city that wants to defund the police should get a week without them, and see how it goes. It's ridiculous. I'm all for weeding out bad police, and punishing police who break the law (not punishing police who make a reasonable decision in the moment that turns out to be a mistake), but the idea that cities are better off with out police is absurd. You can already see the effects on crime numbers in cities where police support is low. Officers are not proactive anymore. Why would you go out and beat the bushes and try to stop crime before it happens when you know that any time you do your job you could be tried and convicted in the media? Why would you do that when you might be attacked for being there? It's better to just wait for calls to come in and go after the fact and avoid confrontations.

It's tough because, while rioters are breaking many laws, the police don't have the support of the govt or the media to stop it.

Your very specific example is the thing that is least likely to happen. I literally know nobody who was about to have a baby with their wife and then found out that their wife secretly had an abortion. That said, I'm quite sure that if my wife was five months pregnant with our first child, and she came home and told me she'd had an abortion that I would be upset. That doesn't mean I think abortion should be illegal, although at 5 months I DO think it should be illegal. My wife and I can't have children, so I assure you I have a very real idea of how precious the process is. We adopted two little girls. When they're adults (or God forbid when they're teenagers), I hope that if they somehow end up pregnant and do not want to take the child to term, ESPECIALLY if they are raped or if having the baby could cause them some sort of health issues, that they have the option to terminate that pregnancy. Since I answered your question, let me ask you this... if your wife gets raped and becomes pregnant, do you want her to have the choice as to whether or not she has the baby? What about if having the baby could possibly kill her? Do you want her to have the option of terminating the pregnancy then?

Those times have at least been loosely related to the original topic. Start a new thread and I'll answer your question. I don't have any reservations talking about it.

Appreciated, but not necessary.

Start another thread, I'll have an honest discussion with you about it. We're really way off topic here.

Gonna have to agree to disagree on that one. Anyway, we're way off topic. I'm happy to discuss this in a different thread sometime. We haven't had a good abortion debate on here for quite awhile.

I hold both in the same regard.

Not sure where God addressed abortion in the bible. I have zero issue taking the life of a criminal who deserves it. I also have zero issue with someone deciding to terminate an embryo in their own body. To each his own.

My opinion on it is this... you had a bunch of nutjobs storm the capitol. One of them got killed in a highly publicized shooting. Since the officer wasn't charged with a crime, I don't at all blame them for doing their best to protect his identity. I'd think there's a very real chance of some other nutjob trying to come after him (the kind of person that would storm the capitol, maybe?). He was cleared by a grand jury. Knowing his identity doesn't do anything for anyone. If he'd been charged with a crime it would be out there.