oldschool2

Greatest coach to have ever lived.

I know Coach Mac. Super guy and good coach. Congrats to him. Yes.. his previous job will get a TON of interest. Huffman is a good school and has good facilities.

If my job was to pick the next head coach at Tarkington and my job depended on it... and their criteria was to win a state championship as soon as possible, I'd probably have a realistic discussion with them about where their expectations need to be. Look.. it's obvious that you have some kind of thing for Briles. I agree that he's a great coach.. arguably deserving credit for bringing the spread offense to high school football. I will have to remind you that Hamlin did have some good seasons before he got there and also after he left. Which is how he got the Georgetown job (not a good two year stint). Then the Stephenville job. Stephenville has won two state championships long after he's been gone. Southlake Carrol was winning state championships before Dodge took over.. and Austin Westlake? I notice you didn't mention that he got fired from UNT and then went 8-12 over two seasons at Marble Falls before taking the WL job. That's 5 seasons of ..according to your standards ..pretty bad coaching. Point being.. let's assume that Tarkington even had a prayer of landing an established, big name coach. Which.. they don't. Anyway. Assume they did. What historical success would even make you think that a big name coach would make a difference? Here's some examples of schools that will draw big names due to their history of success and potential for even more: Mart, Canadian, Cameron Yoe, Newton, East Bernard, Celina, Pilot Point, Gilmer, Carthage, West Orange Stark, Stephenville, Aledo, Highland Park, Katy, Southlake Carrol, Lake Travis, Westlake, North Shore, Allen... and others. But Tarkington IS NOT on the list. I'm talking about schools with at least a history of deep runs sometimes.. no matter who the coach is. I know a lot of those schools are recent guests at the state championship game but SEVERAL of them have been there before. How many playoff games has Tarkington won in their history? You think that one coach can go there and win 6 playoff games in a row.. in the same year within a 5 year window? Come on... These coaching names that you're throwing around landed jobs of schools that were at least competitive before going there. Were the coaches good enough to bring it all the way? Possibly the reason. But that's not the case with Tarkington. Not right now and not yet. Probably not ever.

To clarify.. when a coach wins a title one year, but not the next.. it’s because it was against better coaches? I’m really trying to figure out your system of what makes a good coach. It’s difficult. Or.. as with every year.. teams lose seniors. Does that factor? Or is it that they became a worse coach or played better coaches? Or both? By the way.. I never got an answer about Phil Danaher. Elite coach or not?

Turf is also good for weather.. which benefits soccer also. With the amount of rainfall this part of the state gets on a yearly basis, it's sickening the amount of preparation time on the actual playing surface that's lost. Even soccer coaches would probably agree that it's better to practice/play on a turf field than not get to out of fear of tearing up the grass surface after inclement weather.

I almost threw up a little bit reading this... NOTHING better? I beg to differ. Anyone with grass still is considered ancient. It's 2022.

I actually like how much emphasis you’re placing on the gas/oil thing as if I said it was the only contributing factor. Any intelligent person would know that natural resources-jobs-population-money contribute to successes within the community. Including schools. Any intelligent person also knows it takes more than that (Sabine Pass). And that it takes more than numbers (Allen). But go ahead.. I’m glad you’re enjoying yourself. Relevant question: Is Phil Danaher “in the league” with Briles? I’m trying to get your exact requirements. Danaher has won more games than any Texas coach alive.. but not the last one. Or is that what it takes? There’s a lot of coaches nobody has heard of that won it all but never got close again. Even doing poorly afterwards. They in the league? Help me out so I know how to judge a good/bad coach.

Finney beat Briles. That, too, is fact. By the way, your rationale on the importance of record is a detriment to the quality of coaches. It's really what's wrong with parents/fans. Also... Odessa Permian isn't a great example to use in an argument that includes gas/oil booms.

Gotten worse? I'm going to need an explanation. If you're referring the 7-3 and 6-4 records.. you should look at the actual schedules. There's a nifty little website called maxpreps.com where scores and schedules can be looked up with pretty consistent accuracy for any team and any year. Losing two of the district games by 2 and 1 with a young, first year quarterback may not be considered "getting worse" to anyone with any football knowledge whatsoever. Maybe just individuals that base everything on records alone.. like you I'm guessing. Hey.. speaking of that. Just inform the next Tarkington guy to schedule cupcakes in the preseason. Maybe you're consider 5-5 as "turning the program around". Oh but then he'll just leave after having mastered that feat. Hmm... I don't know. Quite the predicament y'all have over there.

Makes sense. Speaking of Finney.. who is another excellent coach.. I believe he missed the playoffs this year despite his track record. Just goes to show that it takes more than coaching. Still gotta have horses in the stable.

Again.. I'll never take anything away from the knowledge of Art Briles or the success he's had in his career. You do understand, though, that Mount Vernon had some pretty good seasons before Briles got there.. right? And.. Briles brought a coach with him that had a kid living with him that was a pretty good player. If I remember correctly there was an issue with it for a while concerning the district committee. Anyway.. point being that Briles stepping into an already successful Mount Vernon job is a far cry from someone stepping into a Tarkington team. That's not personal.. it just is what it is.

Again.. I'll never take anything away from the knowledge of Art Briles or the success he's had in his career. You do understand, though, that Mount Vernon had some pretty good seasons before Briles got there.. right? And.. Briles brought a coach with him that had a kid living with him that was a pretty good player. If I remember correctly there was an issue with it for a while concerning the district committee. Anyway.. point being that Briles stepping into an already successful Mount Vernon job is a far cry from someone stepping into a Tarkington team. That's not personal.. it just is what it is.

Again.. I'll never take anything away from the knowledge of Art Briles or the success he's had in his career. You do understand, though, that Mount Vernon had some pretty good seasons before Briles got there.. right? And.. Briles brought a coach with him that had a kid living with him that was a pretty good player. If I remember correctly there was an issue with it for a while concerning the district committee. Anyway.. point being that Briles stepping into an already successful Mount Vernon job is a far cry from someone stepping into a Tarkington team. That's not personal.. it just is what it is.

I have no doubt that Art Briles has forgotten more about football X's and O's then most of us will ever know.. but.. Briles coached 6 different quarterbacks that went on to play D1. Including his own son (UT and UH). Unless he's bringing that kind of talent to Tarkington.. No.. he's not replicating the success early on.

A consistent coaching staff is a fraction of a fraction of what's necessary.

I didn't say their population was growing like Aledo. I said "as far as a major influence of population growth, new business, and new money". Three separate entities but obviously not all three playing a factor in the case of Carthage. However, the upgrades were definitely made and this level of winning happened pretty close to that. Did it not? Even still.. one of multiple variables playing into Carthage's unheard of dominance in high school football over the last decade+. The reasons why Carthage has done what they did can be argued until blue in the face, doesn't negate the fact that schools will try to replicate it but fail. There's still a common factor with Carthage, Aledo, Tarkington,.. some of the schools I just listed have had / will have skill kids go on to play big time D1 football. Tarkington does not at the moment. There are steps needed to be taken in order for schools such as Tarkington to get on the track of consistent success. Even in doing so, it will take time. Will the patience of parents/community allow for the growing pains that inevitably happen during this required time? We'll see. Just know this.. Surratt and Buchanan will be listed with the greatest coaches to have ever worn a whistle in Texas High School Football, but they couldn't go to most schools in the state for a decade and replicate what has been done in Carthage and Aledo. Even if they went together.

The indoor practice facility is something that most of the state doesn't have. And their turf field is equipped with a $100K+ screen.. if that's ok, then a vast majority of the state would aspire to meet your definition of ok.

Scratch the weight room.. I'm thinking of Tatum. Carthage still has a first class playing field and practice facility. Last time I checked those were part of the facilities.

I wasn't there when the facilities were built.. but I'm pretty sure they're more recent than 60 years.

Read the rest of the comment. New natural gas discoveries in certain parts of central and east Texas have resulted in great things for a lot of school districts. Carthage's indoor practice facility, turf stadium, state of the art weight room, jumbotron, etc.. just appeared out of nowhere? Those types of perks available to athletes and students bring/keep great players and great coaches.

They were also horrible before a major population shift to the area. Carthage and Aledo are in the same boat as far as a major influence of population growth, new business, and new money. Just as schools can go from dominant to irrelevant.. so can the opposite happen. In fact.. it absolutely happens. Carthage and Aledo have some of the nicest facilities in the state coupled with communities willing to pour as much money as possible into the athletics program. Is Tarkington willing to do that?

Of course. Every year there’s a school (or multiple) that wins the title that wasn’t the most talented. But.. doesn’t mean they were without talent. Tarkington has a long way to go before becoming a consistently successful (relatively) football program. A new hire isn’t going to change that overnight.. or even over the next however many years. A lot of variables are needed.

No.. you need to recount. SIX players played in at least 30 games (over 24). SIX. SIX players played exclusively in at least 15 of the games. SIX. My guess is that those 15 games are the ones that were relatively close. And it's not splitting hairs.. I said that elite teams did in fact play that few kids. You said my "basketball knowledge needs to be questioned". And that my "take on elite teams only playing 5 guys is borderline moronic". Those were your words.. even though I didn't say they play only 5 players. No matter. Anyone can read what was posted above.

Of course not. What needs to happen is to hire the best fit for the program as the hiring committee sees fit.. but then have realistic expectations and not give the guy a reason to leave after a year or two. Someone that will be excited about raising participation and having the players actually see benefit of bettering themselves. A culture change in the program can definitely make the kids at least think about going to the weight room instead of the deer stand. But even with a change in culture and attitude be realistic about what you're wanting.. especially compared to years past. Invest money into the coaching staff, facilities, and kids as a show of faith. Is it probable to do all of that and then beat schools with decades of that exact tradition that you'll strive to have? Maybe not.. but a true change couples with some strategic scheduling can definitely lead to some 4/5/6 or more win seasons. Maybe not every year but at least competitive in some of the losses. Success breeds success so take little wins in terms of change. It's going to take time.. And please, please, for God's sake.. stick with a coach for more than a season or two. Even if it costs a little money.. make it a goal for your 7th graders to graduate under the same leadership. Consistency is vital. Even during a rebuilding year.. just freakin suck it up and go with your choice. As long as he keeps the mentality he started with and stays excited with the process... then don't let a losing season be the reason to run them off. Unfortunately.. Tarkington has always been a, "my first head job" type place and people move on to greener pastures. But who knows.

300 unathletic kids can't beat 15 good athletes. Not on the football field.