oldschool2

Isn’t Lumberton going back up in classification?

He won a title 4 years before Murray.. then 3 in a row with him. So a great chance, huh? We’ll see. So they’ll continue winning the district championship and just keep getting further into the playoffs until they just win it all? I’m betting you wouldn’t bet on that.

What were the top 10 defenses? It’s my opinion that it takes both. You can give up 10 ppg and still lose if you can’t score.

Well.. it seems as though it comes down to pretty much one thing. I say that Tom Westerberg (elite coach according to your definition) won consecutive state titles because of Kyler Murray. It seems that maybe you think they were won because they had an elite coach.. and not because they had a kid who starts in the NFL right now. Luckily for us, you’re theory can be tested. According to your logic BH should be winning the state championship before too long.

Good point. And I probably don’t know football compared to a lot. Basketball is actually my thing..I just like football and the conversations in the football thread are more entertaining. but I do know that the equation for winning is players + coaches + schedule. It takes all three.

No question. But the decision is easier made when you have other weapons. Plus.. from what I understand, the kid was a problem all year. He missed the first half of their semifinal game the week before because of taking the ACT. To be honest, I’m not sure I would’ve let him go to begin with.

I’m not saying you’re wrong.. but it sure makes it easier when you still have your starting QB (Virginia Tech) and the opposing QB (Texas) is injured.

You may wanna fact-check that.

Mic drop. Next topic.

He's the closest thing to the coach being discussed. An elite coach (Westerberg) according to an aforementioned theory that came to a school that hasn't won a state championship in a long time. According to the person I'm conversing with, it should happen within 7 years or less. I was just making sure I was understanding him correctly.

So is an all American quarterback a requirement? Or comparable skill player.. I'm trying to grasp your thinking. Which you're entitled to, as mentioned above. I personally think it's silly to think that a team will win a state championship based solely on the head coach. But that's me. Answer the question I posed earlier to AAW. How long will it take Westerberg to win one at BH? The chances of him staying there for a long period of time are probably far greater than the chances of Briles staying at MV 6 or 7 years.

I'm glad we agree. Even the greatest of coaches need other factors other than their coaching ability in order to win a title. Or.. most people would agree with that.

I'm betting Briles leaves the first chance he gets. I just don't see him staying at MV very long. My opinion. A better question would be to ask how long it takes for Westerberg to win one at BH. It seems like a somewhat comparable situation to me.

I don't want to seem like I'm picking on a certain school or anything..but ok. So Art Briles or Scott Surratt could win state championships at.. Freer? Monte Alto? Tornillo? Tarkington? Chester (in 11 man)? Any Pasadena ISD school? If you really think so then we might as well stop debating. It would be pointless. I'm sure you also think that Tod Dodge could go from Austin Lake Travis to Travis High School (less than 20 miles apart) and win a title. Who, by the way, is an elite coach to your standards. Even though after winning 4 titles at Southlake Carroll went to UNT and got fired after going 0-30..or something like that. Like I said..ignorance. I'm not saying they aren't excellent coaches.. possibly the best in the business and undoubtedly know more about the game than most of us ever will. Briles is one of the innovators of the spread offense which changed the game. I'm just saying that winning a state title doesn't make you a better coach than someone that hasn't. Not exclusively. Which is what started this whole conversation. No I saw it. "LOL! You got a degree for that?!" I'm saying that what exactly are you talking about? What do my college degrees (which you have no clue about) have anything to do with my proving your ignorance? Because it doesn't take a degree of any kind for that. You don't even know that I have one. Speaking intelligently and using common sense isn't an indicator of a college education.

Not exactly sure what you're talking about ^.. but ok. It doesn't take a degree to realize that someone thinking that winning a state title (based on that) is an "elite" coach is IGNORANT. Oh look, another category. So we have elite coach, good coach, and now great coach. Let me ask you this, knower of all things coaching. Could Art Briles, Scott Surratt, or any other coach you want to add.. go to any school in the state and win a title? Or even make the playoffs?

The conversation in question.. (the one I was in), was comparing Coach Briles to his predecessor implying that because Briles had won state titles previously that he was automatically a better coach. But actually, no. My opinion on what makes a good coach is someone that gets the most out of their players or more. I think that wins/losses is a fraction of what makes someone good. I personally think some of the best coaches to have ever lived have never won a championship. It's easy to win with better players than the team you're playing against.

I halfway expected a response similar to that. So by your definition, Phil Danaher wouldn't be considered an elite coach? Even though he has won more football games than any other Texas high school football coach to have ever coached. Good to know. I'll be sure and send UIL and email asking them to put an asterisk by his name in the coaching Hall of Fame. Also, you do realize that there are quite a few coaches to have won a state championship and then never even gotten close again, right? Most of them, in fact. So.. were they only "elite status" that one year? Because I personally know of coaches that have won a state title and missed the playoffs in their careers after doing so. I just wanna make sure I'm understanding how to describe a coach when someone asks me. And yeah.. let's compare the game they played against each other, because that definitely closes the case. Not surprised by that response either, btw. Someone who thinks that winning a state championship makes someone a better coach than someone that hasn't would definitely think that the results of one game also proves that someone is a better coach. To be clear: I'm not pro Finney or anti Briles, just exposing some ignorance.

Is that your measuring stick for what makes a good coach?

Not just that.. Finney went to Winnsboro and took them further than Briles took MV. And as a 4 seed.

It takes a lot of years and a lot of good seasons to get to that many.

I saw on Instagram that the WH coach got his 700th win with this one.

Not when it comes to the skills required to be a good basketball player.. compared to skills required to be a good football player. No offense.. but just being fast, just being big, or just being strong means nothing on a basketball court. Any of the three can make you a stud on a football field, though. That’s what I meant.

Normally I agree with what you post.. but as a basketball guy.. not this time

I’ll go ahead and get the argument kicked off.. I went over the weekend for the first time. There is absolutely zero question that ALL UIL state football championship games need to be at Cowboys stadium. Wow.. what a venue. NRG or the Alamodome shouldn’t even be suggested. I have no doubt that every kid in the state would rather play there regardless of travel.

Bold move? You telling me that was the only choice? If a freshman is the backup then who was the backup last year?