madmen

Absolutely!

Luv, I am truly sorry if I offended you. I think you and I agree on many topics on this forum. I am the first to say let kids play. I do not care one bit what the score is. I do not believe a team should be punished for scoring over a 40 point differential. If a team gets beat, a team gets beat. Sometimes it's a butt kicking, sometimes it's not. It's football, just play. Nederland was punished (from what I understand) for supposedly breaking and ethics rule of bad sportsmanship. He did not intentionally run the score up on the other team. He was not trying to be malicious in letting his kids play ball and allowing them to do so at their very best. The board wants coaches to basically tell kids not to score to show sportsmanship. If that's the case, why would you advance the ball at 7 seconds left in the game when up by 14 points? Again, the "rules" either apply to everyone (including board members) or they apply to no one.

If you don't like the topic of discussion, do not participate on the thread. Calling people dumb is rude.

Hippy, I agree with you but I also believe the Board should follow the rules as well. One cannot pick and choose when to enforce or not enforce rules. If one person is held accountable, all should be. I am not saying this board is bad. I do however question some of their decisions and how those decisions came about. The Bylaws should me spelled out more clearly. The "Ethics Committee Rules" should be posted and spelled out more clearly.

Clearly the "spirit of the rule" of sportsmanship (intentionally "running up the score") is how Nederland broke the so called "rule". So how would that scenario be different? Only because the point differential was less than 40? "Running up the score" ("on the kids being beat by a superior team") is running up the score; no matter what the point differential is. At 7 seconds left in the game and up by 14.....kneel the ball, game over, and shake hands. As someone stated.... " STJFL Board members are held to a HIGHER STANDARD". So a STJFL Board member should have ended the game. Points earned didn't matter in this game for playoff seeding. No reason to score again at 7 seconds left in the game. Mercy rule not broken......the "spirit of the ethics rule" was.

" STJFL Board members are held to a HIGHER STANDARD".... Question: Let's say you have 7 seconds left in the game. Your team is up by 14 points and you have the ball. What is the proper ethical and sportsman like thing to do? Run the ball in for a touchdown or kneel the ball? Will post on another thread also.....

That's funny right there......

Stand....not sand. Bahaha!

Huge problem this world faces and has been facing....   Standing up/Fighting for what you believe.   I honestly hope I have taught my children to sand up for themselves and their beliefs, no matter if it is something petty like a football score. Our children are watching and taking notes. (Yes, most of these kids don't understand what is happening, but believe me, they are watching and LEARNING)   I also hope defense attorneys never stop ensuring investigations were properly conducted. Would hate to see freedom taken away from a person without being allowed to defend themselves.

What is the rule? Where is this rule written? Where does it say if you have a 40+ point margin the team in the lead will be penalized?   Curious....

And I respectfully value that opinion....   While I have never coach youth football, I have coached other sports and have had only one issue. When the complaint was filed on me, I was informed by the President of the league, allowed to respond in writing as well as defend my actions in person to the board. Witness named by both parties were also questioned in person by the Executive Board Members; everyone was questioned and heard. A decision was voted on; at that point both parties were given the result by the board. The process took two weeks however, I feel a thorough investigation and a complete course of action (from the initial complaint down to the "verdict") were administered by all.   I feel you and I agree on that.... hopefully a better investigation process will be addressed in the future.   The Rules/and or Codes of Conduct will always be up for debate; This is why we have boards and/or board members. I like black and white rules....no interpretations. Clearly this entire subject has shown us what a wide range of "understanding the rules" can be. And for those of us that volunteer our time, mind, and energy discussing thus topics, should not be individually attacked or ridiculed by anyone. Having served on numerous boards myself, I empathize.   One more thing, if I may....   I feel this 40 point ethics rule was implemented based on preventing intentionally "running up the score" in malicious manner. If a clean game was played without spiteful behavior or intentions; what is the harm? Leads to my rant regarding life lessons for our youth today.

thetragichippy, I respect your opinion. I am not trying to attack anyone, coaches, board members, nor yourself. I do however have two questions for you: In any situation that you might find yourself being accused of "breaking a rule" or law, would you want to be allowed to explain yourself and/or actions? • If your answer is yes, then why not allow these volunteers the same. The outcome may very well have been the same, but at least the accused would have been given the opportunity to address the board and/or accusers. Had the jury "all board members" heard all the evidence and testimony of all involved, what would the outcome have been; we will never know. Like I said before, the conclusion could have been the same, but I guarantee all parties (including coaches, parents, board members) would sleep a lot better and the complaints would diminish had the investigation process (in my opinion) been carried-out in a equal and fair manner. • If no, please, please, please hire an attorney to represent you if ever the need should arise. Do you not feel the "ethics" rules are too vague and unclear? Why or why not? I am open to persuasion. I for one like clear and less subjective Rules and/or Codes of Conduct. (It's either over the line or it's not...so to speak) As far as starting my own investigation, I have emailed all board members and not one response. If the coaches were in the wrong, then shame on them. Both sides should have been heard.... I hope in the future things will be changed. If not, youth sports will suffer.

Posted a couple of weeks ago on a different thread.....   "Rules are adopted to ensure equal opportunity, not equal outcomes. Codes of Conduct are set into place to protect all involved- children, parents, coaches, board members, referees…ect, within an organization. If you are going to enforce an “ethics” rule, then do so in a clear and definite manner and across the board, none of this case by case baloney. Investigate better and make the rules less subjective.     This is football people; you win some, you lose some. These kids are upset no matter if the score is 60-0 or 39-0; a loss is a loss. All athletes (and parents for that matter) need to learn how to win and lose with dignity. On the playground, kids learn that organically (playing to 11 sometimes results in a score of 11-0).   The purpose of sport is to primarily teach kids life lessons about success and about failure. The failure lessons may in fact be more important than the successes. Everyone wants their child to succeed, its part of being a parent, however, protecting your child from difficult situations only delays lessons that are very necessary. Those parents who consistently prepare the path for the child by confronting teachers and coaches, changing teams, changing leagues and changing schools are making life-long losers out of their children. Kids will grow into adults and experience grumpy co-workers and mean bosses. Constantly insulating kids from difficult situations and consistently cleaning up the mess they create defeats the purpose of sport. Remember you are a parent. You are not a friend, a manager, or an agent. Your job is to help create a competent, capable adult, not a dysfunctional child."       ***The job of a “board” is to protect all the athletes, not just “the ones being beaten by a superior team.” If a Code of Conduct is clearly broken, then address the situation and implement a fair and reasonable punishment. One cannot elect to choose which Code of Conduct and/or Rules are to be enforced (or not enforced) so that it benefits them. Either the rules are meant for everyone or they are meant for no one.   I am flabbergasted that no one has investigated the board that is handing down these punishments for rules that are so elusive. In every court of law, a person has the right to defend him/herself and produce evidence of their own.  It is my understanding that neither the Nederland nor Beaumont coahes have been allowed to execute either. Something smells fishy; and I dont like fish.

I personally, do not have a dog (pun intended) in this fight. However, I will say this:   Fact of the matter is, no one knows the whole story regarding this issue. Everything that is being said on this forum is opinions only. No one on this site was on the field and heard what each coach (from both sides) and the refs discussed. Not one person knows what the Nederland White Coaches were thinking regarding scoring that day, and that includes the STJFL Board.   Rules are put into place to ensure equal opportunity, not equal outcomes. If you are going to enforce an “ethics” rule, then do so in a clear and definite manner and across the board, none of this case by case baloney. Investigate better and make the rules less subjective.   This is football people; you win some, you lose some. These kids are upset no matter if the score is 60-0 or 39-0; a loss is a loss. All athletes (and parents for that matter) need to learn how to win and lose with dignity. On the playground, kids learn that organically (playing to 11 sometimes results in a score of 11-0).     The purpose of sport is to primarily teach kids life lessons about success and about failure. The failure lessons may in fact be more important than the successes. Everyone wants their child to succeed, its part of being a parent, however, protecting your child from difficult situations only delays lessons that are very necessary. Those parents who consistently prepare the path for the child by confronting teachers and coaches, changing teams, changing leagues and changing schools are making life-long losers out of their children. Kids will grow into adults and experience grumpy co-workers and mean bosses. Constantly insulating kids from difficult situations and consistently cleaning up the mess they create defeats the purpose of sport. Remember you are a parent. You are not a friend, a manager, or an agent. Your job is to help create a competent, capable adult, not a dysfunctional child.   I do not believe this coach intentionally or maliciously “ran the score up.” If he did, then shame on him, and he deserves the punishment given to him. Bottom line, quit judging these VOLUNTEERS( coaches and/or board members). All coaches can do is try to be as fair as possible, but telling kids not to score, hit, shoot, run fast or try hard comes with its own set of problems, not the least of which is potential injury partially caused by doing something different or playing "easier". So until all the facts are known, lets all keep our mouth shut and play some ball.   PS- Not everyone can afford to place their talented child on a select team; recreational may be their only option.