mat

Maybe some flounder

[quote name="tvc184" post="1020606" timestamp="1308943773"] Private pier. [/quote] FYI - Posting fishing reports like this from a private pier really doesn't count as a fishing report. It's just braggin'  :)

The wind will dictate where you can fish. I read a good report about the Neches River.

[quote name="tvc184" post="1020606" timestamp="1308943773"] Private pier. [/quote] You guys are killin' me

[quote name="tvc184" post="1020568" timestamp="1308908087"] We probably put about 50 on the dock with 20 keepers. We lost about another 20 (at least) that dropped off the hook as we were lifting them out of the water onto the dock as we were about 6 feet above the water and a 3 foot rail. About 12 of the keepers were at least 17" with no really big ones except the mega-speck that OTB let go. NEVER NEVER NEVER try to pick a speck out of the water with your hands......  ;D It would have gone 4 pounds minimum. We thought it was a redfish. [/quote] Causway Pier?

I never said there was no place for any contract services in school maintenance. Of course you have to evaluate the value of certain things. The issue was contracting out the whole maintenance department. To do so is usually not practical or economical. True, industry and schools both have laws and regulations. The point is, there are many industry focused maintenance contract services but they can’t transition into education maintenance. There are very few education focused maintenance contract services out there. As bad as I hate to bring it up, when Nederland’s first bond failed construction costs were the highest they had ever been. In terms of value, now would be a good time to pass a bond because construction costs are quite low now and may not go any lower. A community’s school system plays a big role in successful growth. If a. family is relocating what is the one thing that determines where they choose to move? Schools

Smitty As I stated earlier, IF a maintenance department is run correctly and IF the department has the budget and has the support of admin it is more efficient and affordable than contracting out those services. Maintenance within a school system has a lot of state and federal laws and requirements that are totally different than the industrial world. It would require a specialty contracting service to perform school services. Most districts that resort to this type of service do it to alleviate the headache rather than for financial reasons. Thus, reinforcing the problems of a maintenance department that is not run correctly or not supported. A typical maintenance department handles way more than needed repairs. One of the most important values of school maintenance gets neglected by contract services or a poorly run department is the preventative maintenance that adds life to your building and equipment; saves money in the long run. Many maintenance departments have the ability to do small scale construct and renovations that save money and add value to the department. Something else that’s important; it’s important to know who you have working around you kids. I could go on but I really don’t like long winded posts (I guess it’s too late for that)

[quote name="smitty" post="1019203" timestamp="1308394826"] You can have in-house contractors that are there if/when needed.  But we wouldn't have to pay for benefits.  It's done were I work.  [quote author=mat link=topic=84302.msg1018982#msg1018982 date=1308314652] [quote author=Penny link=topic=84302.msg1018945#msg1018945 date=1308279649] Smitty is right on about contracting some maintenance activities, he is right, that is a lower cost way to maintain facilities.  He's right about the reduced overhead that you experience when you don't have full time personnel on the books.  That is not a popular position, but it is a fact.  However, Smitty, we can make these cuts, contract maintenance, have parents drive their kids to sporting events to avoid fuel, reduce administrators salaries, eliminate administration through retirements and attrition, which essentially comes down to have other people step up and take on more leadership and responsibility, which can happen actually with improved results.  Smitty, I have personally implemented and seen positive results from the very actions you are discussing.  But at the same time, I've also had to make multi-million dollar decisions over maintaining with cost, or replacing with capital, critical facilities for the long term good of an objective.  You cannot sway my opinion here.  I know where you are coming from, I've navigated this maze many times before.  I'm sorry, you can nitpick the semantics and the minute details of what is going on and at times, you are right, but the bottom line is the long term need and the big picture, REQUIRES a bond to reduce the cost of running this school district.  When it is said that a bond will reduce taxes, that is the point, paying for old broken facilities versus addressing them with a financed long term solution, is the most financially prudent decision.  A bond WILL REDUCE COSTS, which EQUATES to LOWER TAXES.... that's right Smitty, LOWER TAXES.  This isn't ignorant kids WANTING things, this is the decision of professionals who have analyzed the situation.  Can we make cuts, ABSOLUTELY, will it address the problem, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO.  The question is, do you want to address the issue, or make a point about how you personally think things should be done, at the expense of ELIMINATING this community.  I'm hearing your points, and yes, people in authority should listen to the ideas you have, but ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY, what you are suggesting, while at the heart good ideas, they WILL NOT address the LONG TERM needs of this community.  This is not up for discussion.  If the people of this community fall for the propoganda that killed the first bond, then we deserve to be buried with other short sighted failures from history.  There will be no upgrades of our sports or extra-cirricular facilities in the next bond.  It will be about building new schools.  Any upgrades to sporting facilities should be separately voted upon.   [/quote] In almost all cases it is not cheaper to contract out maintenance if a district’s maintenance department is run correctly and the department has the budget and support of the district. I can give plenty of info to support my opinion if needed. However, in some cases it could but more economical to contract some services such as food service or transportation. [/quote] [/quote] There’s a lot more to consider when maintaining a school district than maintaining a plant or any other type facility.

[quote name="Penny" post="1018945" timestamp="1308279649"] Smitty is right on about contracting some maintenance activities, he is right, that is a lower cost way to maintain facilities.  He's right about the reduced overhead that you experience when you don't have full time personnel on the books.  That is not a popular position, but it is a fact.  However, Smitty, we can make these cuts, contract maintenance, have parents drive their kids to sporting events to avoid fuel, reduce administrators salaries, eliminate administration through retirements and attrition, which essentially comes down to have other people step up and take on more leadership and responsibility, which can happen actually with improved results.  Smitty, I have personally implemented and seen positive results from the very actions you are discussing.  But at the same time, I've also had to make multi-million dollar decisions over maintaining with cost, or replacing with capital, critical facilities for the long term good of an objective.  You cannot sway my opinion here.  I know where you are coming from, I've navigated this maze many times before.  I'm sorry, you can nitpick the semantics and the minute details of what is going on and at times, you are right, but the bottom line is the long term need and the big picture, REQUIRES a bond to reduce the cost of running this school district.  When it is said that a bond will reduce taxes, that is the point, paying for old broken facilities versus addressing them with a financed long term solution, is the most financially prudent decision.  A bond WILL REDUCE COSTS, which EQUATES to LOWER TAXES.... that's right Smitty, LOWER TAXES.  This isn't ignorant kids WANTING things, this is the decision of professionals who have analyzed the situation.  Can we make cuts, ABSOLUTELY, will it address the problem, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO.  The question is, do you want to address the issue, or make a point about how you personally think things should be done, at the expense of ELIMINATING this community.  I'm hearing your points, and yes, people in authority should listen to the ideas you have, but ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY, what you are suggesting, while at the heart good ideas, they WILL NOT address the LONG TERM needs of this community.  This is not up for discussion.  If the people of this community fall for the propoganda that killed the first bond, then we deserve to be buried with other short sighted failures from history.  There will be no upgrades of our sports or extra-cirricular facilities in the next bond.  It will be about building new schools.  Any upgrades to sporting facilities should be separately voted upon.   [/quote] In almost all cases it is not cheaper to contract out maintenance if a district’s maintenance department is run correctly and the department has the budget and support of the district. I can give plenty of info to support my opinion if needed. However, in some cases it could but more economical to contract some services such as food service or transportation.

[quote name="smitty" post="1018956" timestamp="1308283002"] PS - How much do "free" lunches cost the school district?  There are ALWAYS areas of cutting that can be discussed!! [quote author=dawgnut link=topic=84302.msg1018916#msg1018916 date=1308274032] Enlighten us smitty you are always talking about other ways to handle the school finance situation, give us one alternative that has been tried in the USA that has worked successfully in a school district as large or larger than NISD. You always talk about the pro-bond folks coming up with a solution, let's hear one from you. But I forget, you only have questions not answers. [/quote] [/quote] Nothing. Free lunches are not funded by districts.

[quote name="smitty" post="1018928" timestamp="1308276300"] Before you raise taxes, you cut first!  Give me some cuts then I'll listen to any thing you got to say about bonds! [quote author=mat link=topic=84302.msg1018918#msg1018918 date=1308274884] [quote author=smitty link=topic=84302.msg1018897#msg1018897 date=1308268329] throwing money at something doesn't solve the problem either.  But that's what prevails here.  Just trying to get people to think here that there may be a different way.  But hardly any good suggestions yet from the pro-bonders.  But that's what forums are for.  To discuss solutions. [quote author=mat link=topic=84302.msg1018761#msg1018761 date=1308227960] Smitty, your view of education is skewed. It’s not all about reduced spending. Sadly, districts have had to become competitive for student enrollment for operating funds. Anything they can do to attract and maintain enrollment and attendance is necessary to just to maintain state funding. Cutting many of the programs you propose will result in a loss of enrollment which results in a lack of funds. It’s counter productive. Kinda like McDonalds cutting fries from the menu to reducing costs. [/quote] [/quote] I can offer you several bond options with supportive reasoning but I am certain you would not acknowledge any of it so I’m not going to waste my time. You do have a point though. You weren’t the lone opposition during the last bond. There were a lot of Nederland folk that weren’t on board. [/quote] [/quote] Smitty, please pay attention. NISD has already made budget reductions in the last few years. Once they know how much the state funding will get cut they will make additonal reductions accordingly. They are like all the other districts. There funding is not clear.

[quote name="smitty" post="1018897" timestamp="1308268329"] throwing money at something doesn't solve the problem either.  But that's what prevails here.  Just trying to get people to think here that there may be a different way.  But hardly any good suggestions yet from the pro-bonders.  But that's what forums are for.  To discuss solutions. [quote author=mat link=topic=84302.msg1018761#msg1018761 date=1308227960] Smitty, your view of education is skewed. It’s not all about reduced spending. Sadly, districts have had to become competitive for student enrollment for operating funds. Anything they can do to attract and maintain enrollment and attendance is necessary to just to maintain state funding. Cutting many of the programs you propose will result in a loss of enrollment which results in a lack of funds. It’s counter productive. Kinda like McDonalds cutting fries from the menu to reducing costs. [/quote] [/quote] I can offer you several bond options with supportive reasoning but I am certain you would not acknowledge any of it so I’m not going to waste my time. You do have a point though. You weren’t the lone opposition during the last bond. There were a lot of Nederland folk that weren’t on board.

[quote name="Old Three Balls" post="1018836" timestamp="1308250408"] 3 of us kept 18 trout, 2 reds, and 1 flounder last night.  not too bad :) [/quote] Keith Lake?

[quote name="shermdog" post="1018814" timestamp="1308240915"] I have a feeling that Smitty is in Austin working to "fix the budget".  I just got this email from a teacher organization, and if it passes you will not need to worry about passing a bond.  There will not be anyone to teach the kids. Here is a synopsis of the bills: Here is how [b]Senate Bill 8[/b] would hurt teachers and public schools:     Cuts teacher salaries in two ways:     Allows districts to order furloughs of teachers and administrators for as many as six non-instructional days and reduce salaries accordingly.     Permanently repeals the 2009 salary floor for returning teachers. This would allow districts to reduce pay for all teachers.     Freezes the state minimum salary schedule at 2010-11 levels.     Changes the deadline for notification of contract non-renewal from the 45th day before the end of instruction to the last day on which spring standardized tests can be administered. The same change applies to notification of termination of probationary teachers. This would give laid-off teachers less time to find jobs for the next school year.     Allows school districts to declare financial emergencies for purposes of imposing reductions in force at any time and eliminates seniority as a factor in determining dismissals when RIFs are implemented.     Repeals a terminated teacher’s right to a hearing before an independent hearing officer.     Adds another provision for districts to seek a waiver from the 22-1 class size cap for K-4. [b]And then HB 17:[/b] House Bill 17 by Rep. Bill Callegari of Houston, which also is on Thursday’s House calendar, would repeal the state minimum salary schedule for teachers, counselors, nurses and librarians. This would allow districts to set their own pay levels for all teachers, as long as they are paid $27,320. Read into that that a 20 year teacher could be paid $27,320.  WOW! Is that responsible? As I can see it, Smitty and the legislature is against [b]KIDS, TEACHERS[/b] and [b]SCHOOLS.[/b] Perception is reality.  I feel sorry for the students and residents of Nederland with people like this fighting against you.  To me the CARE stance is one of irresponsibility and selfishness.  The kids you educate today, are being prepared for jobs that do not even exist yet.  It makes me mad, when someone who has already reaped the benefits of an education, refuses to pay it forward and educate the next generation.   [/quote] It's disturbing to know some of the Bills/ideas that are floating around but it is too soon to get worked up about the details because not all of it has a chance to pass. At least I hope not.

[quote name="liltex" post="1018749" timestamp="1308203261"] Offshore once again 6-15 on a 12 hr 60-80 mile trip w/galveston party boat the New Buccaneer.It was a windy day w/some swells to 6' & steady 5's.We made the best of it but w/a stiff current and 82 anglers aboard it was a tangled mess most of the day.Fish caught that were legal length about 30 snapper w/2 over 10# and the rest small.7 kingfish-2 over 20#-1 warsaw grouper 24#.Alot of lost fish that cut mono leaders.We moved locations about 5 times and could not find real good action @ any.We had plenty of tacos(breakfast) that more than a doz.folk spewed out for chum early ride out first 40 mi or so then winds decreased a little.It was a bust out there today ::) :o 8) [/quote] They've been showing some good reports the last couple of weeks.

Smitty, your view of education is skewed. It’s not all about reduced spending. Sadly, districts have had to become competitive for student enrollment for operating funds. Anything they can do to attract and maintain enrollment and attendance is necessary to just to maintain state funding. Cutting many of the programs you propose will result in a loss of enrollment which results in a lack of funds. It’s counter productive. Kinda like McDonalds cutting fries from the menu to reducing costs.

[quote name="smitty" post="1018755" timestamp="1308214041"] How have what you have stated be considered painful?  A small cut here, a small cut there.  Maybe a dent.  But pretty soon it adds up.  The point is, NISD will survive these.  So the other point is -- why were not they done along time ago?  Humm???  [b]It's amazing the cuts that can be made and will never be missed[/b].  [quote author=Brubaker link=topic=84302.msg1018736#msg1018736 date=1308195367] [quote author=smitty link=topic=84302.msg1018713#msg1018713 date=1308178908] I've already stated a few.  I can, and will, name some more.  I just first need to know the diversity of thought from the pro-bonders.  All I'm getting so far is one trick pony's.  But I need to from you.  In this financial crisis, do you support touching extra-curricular activities?  [quote author=James Mosley link=topic=84302.msg1018533#msg1018533 date=1308092957] Smitty Can you give me, or us, 5 things you would cut that would solve all of Nederlands problems? Cut's that would put Nederland in a class by itself as a district leader. Simple 5 Waiting!!!!!!! [/quote] [/quote] Jardell, football coach took an administration position, he has not been backfilled.  Yeaman, softball coach to my knowledge has not been replaced after stepping down.  Charter bus expense along with travel budgets have been slashed as well.  I know these facts are tough to deal with Smitty, but here are some of the measures that an outsider is aware of, I'm sure there are more.  Fact remains, as painful as these cuts are to endure, they DO NOT make a DENT in the monies necessary to do what needs to be done.  Again, I want you to answer Dawgnut.  He is right, the bond would've lowered taxes.  I know that's hard for your narrow mind to comprehend., but that is afact, you go do your homework like you always tell us to do, and get  back to us.  I beleive it more everyday, like Penny said, YOU CAN't FIX STUPID.  Drop the act, and answer this question, but it will require you to put the kool aid down and drop the talking points.  The math as difficult as it may  be for some, is pretty simple.  [/quote] [/quote] Nobody said they wouldn't be missed. They're just neccessary in budget cruch time.

[quote name="smitty" post="1018531" timestamp="1308091446"] So, there hasn't been any cuts.  I think you just admitted to that.  So you take the easy solution and just raise taxes!!  No guts there!!    ;) [quote author=phunter308 link=topic=84302.msg1018108#msg1018108 date=1307925906] Smitty  30 + years of no new schools is a real big cut ,sacrifice or is it you do not have any facts to back up your bullsht. Everyone on here including people from other schools have shown that Nederland is in need of new facilities. The poor shape of the schools speak for them selves no disputing that. is it as you call it keeping up with the jones that our schools are in the shape they are. No throwing millions on repairs for a couple more years of life is not the answer. That would be like givn you a facelift but still the same bullsht keeps comn out and you wont live no longer. They have served thier just time and the citzens have got thier moneys worth for sure. I know nothing will change your outlook but I am reall interested in where you think cuts can be made ,specific cuts, and the dollar values of those cuts. I have yet in all the bullsht you tell any solutions. Give them to us so I can see where they can be made. I hope you can answer this truly without answering with a question. Try really hard please. I think our kids deserve the best no matter what. One day they may be the kids who decide what goes on in your life. [/quote] [/quote] As someone else posted, they have made budget cuts. This past year they reduced payroll by attrition, departure incentives and nonrenewal of some probationary comntracts. (among other things)

[quote name="smitty" post="1018542" timestamp="1308095773"] You, like many, are missing the point.  If it's such a critical need and you are truly concerned then you would do YOUR part by sending your part of the bond money.  Talking the talk but not walking the walk!      ::) [quote author=The-NHS link=topic=84302.msg1018537#msg1018537 date=1308093111] [quote author=smitty link=topic=84302.msg1018530#msg1018530 date=1308091239] Let me ask you one thing:  Did you figure out what your cost of the bond would have been and every year sent NISD a check for that amount?  We'll wait for your response!!     :-\ [/quote] Why would I send NISD a check every year when a bond wasn't passed? [b]I will gladly send a check when a bond passes.[/b] According to my awesome cellphone calculator I'm showing a little over 3,000. Whats your point? I'm not going to cut programs that are valuable to students and their education to fix window units so I'm not following you. I want a student facility overhaul and I'm not talking about turf and a scoreboard. I've answered your question once again. I eagerly await your enlightening reply. [/quote] [/quote] Silly silly silly. Even you know that nothing can be accomplished without collective resources. One person's check solves nothing.

Some districts had very high deductibles

[quote name="smitty" post="1016259" timestamp="1307153882"] Thanks for reminding me.  I'll check it. You hire more teachers BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT STUDENTS GO TO SCHOOL FOR!!  How can you in good conscious pour money into something like extra-curricular activities and at the same time lay off teachers?? [quote author=mat link=topic=84302.msg1016247#msg1016247 date=1307152254] [quote author=smitty link=topic=84302.msg1016223#msg1016223 date=1307142862] 1.7 mill is a lot of money.  [size=12pt][b]Wonder how many teachers we could hire[/b][/size] for what's REALLY important?  It's amazing how the status qua always wins for some.  I guess because it's easy!!    ;) PS -- I've got another question.  Thinking outside the box.  What is the maintenance budget fir NISD.  How many employees are there in this department.  Anyone know? [quote author=Penny link=topic=84302.msg1016067#msg1016067 date=1307074233] Okay, let's do this, let's cut the $1.7MM in extra cirriculars from the budget, and start making the necessary REPAIRS to 50 and 60 year old buildings.  In about 15 years or so, we'll have PATCHED these facilities up to a reasonable standard.... keep in mind, you're tens of millions spent and you haven't made a single IMPROVEMENT, you've only kept it from falling down around you.  All the while, anyone under the age of 60 who can get out of Nederland, will have done so, and NOBODY will be moving in to this town, because it still has OLD OUTDATED facilities and NO programs to kids who want to be ALL THEY CAN BE... we're just teaching Algebra and Conjugation at this point.  Now we have 70 and 80 year old facilities that we've MAINTAINED by cutting the programs that offer our kids a chance to enhance their education.  We've got OLD OUTDATED facilities, a shrinking tax base, plummeting property values, crime on the rise.... but thank God we didn't raise taxes a couple of hundred bucks.  Now you tell me, who needs to change their thinking here... who's the freakin IDIOT... cuz one of us is.   We pay the LOWEST tax rate in the area, I'm not going to WHINE and CRY because I have to pay for services rendered.  I'm not going to be a FREELOADER with absolutely NO VISION.  The bond that was proposed would've put us in a respectable tax rate compared to the rest of the area, not the highest.  Your ATTEMPT to paint this as a Government attempt to RAISE taxes is LAUGHABLE.  This isn't Washington, we get to see and DIRECTLY reap the benefits of the money that we contribute.  I know this is tough for you to diffentiate.  If you could enlightena and teach me on the points made above and how those are incorrect, I'm listening.  But the fact is that what you suggest WILL END this community.  End of Discussion. [/quote] [/quote] Bandkid posted the link of the NISD budget. Quit asking questions and do some of the research yourself like you do on political topics. I know; its just easier to ask the question. Answer this. If you cut extracurricular and save (according to you, which probably too high) $1.7 million, why would you hire more teachers? [/quote] [/quote] So its OK to over-staff by hiring more teachers?

[quote name="smitty" post="1016223" timestamp="1307142862"] 1.7 mill is a lot of money.  [size=12pt][b]Wonder how many teachers we could hire[/b][/size] for what's REALLY important?  It's amazing how the status qua always wins for some.  I guess because it's easy!!    ;) PS -- I've got another question.  Thinking outside the box.  What is the maintenance budget fir NISD.  How many employees are there in this department.  Anyone know? [quote author=Penny link=topic=84302.msg1016067#msg1016067 date=1307074233] Okay, let's do this, let's cut the $1.7MM in extra cirriculars from the budget, and start making the necessary REPAIRS to 50 and 60 year old buildings.  In about 15 years or so, we'll have PATCHED these facilities up to a reasonable standard.... keep in mind, you're tens of millions spent and you haven't made a single IMPROVEMENT, you've only kept it from falling down around you.  All the while, anyone under the age of 60 who can get out of Nederland, will have done so, and NOBODY will be moving in to this town, because it still has OLD OUTDATED facilities and NO programs to kids who want to be ALL THEY CAN BE... we're just teaching Algebra and Conjugation at this point.  Now we have 70 and 80 year old facilities that we've MAINTAINED by cutting the programs that offer our kids a chance to enhance their education.  We've got OLD OUTDATED facilities, a shrinking tax base, plummeting property values, crime on the rise.... but thank God we didn't raise taxes a couple of hundred bucks.  Now you tell me, who needs to change their thinking here... who's the freakin IDIOT... cuz one of us is.   We pay the LOWEST tax rate in the area, I'm not going to WHINE and CRY because I have to pay for services rendered.  I'm not going to be a FREELOADER with absolutely NO VISION.  The bond that was proposed would've put us in a respectable tax rate compared to the rest of the area, not the highest.  Your ATTEMPT to paint this as a Government attempt to RAISE taxes is LAUGHABLE.  This isn't Washington, we get to see and DIRECTLY reap the benefits of the money that we contribute.  I know this is tough for you to diffentiate.  If you could enlightena and teach me on the points made above and how those are incorrect, I'm listening.  But the fact is that what you suggest WILL END this community.  End of Discussion. [/quote] [/quote] Bandkid posted the link of the NISD budget. Quit asking questions and do some of the research yourself like you do on political topics. I know; its just easier to ask the question. Answer this. If you cut extracurricular and save (according to you, which probably too high) $1.7 million, why would you hire more teachers?

[quote name="smitty" post="1015143" timestamp="1306754563"] Shut down EDC?  Yes!!  Another waste of money.  Can you defend it with positive facts?  I'm willing to listen! What I'm gaining from you is that you LIKE to waste money.  And any discussion of what's REALLY important is foreign to you.  But stick around!  The teaching never stops!!  Whether or not one chooses to listen!!     ;) [quote author=Penny link=topic=84302.msg1014491#msg1014491 date=1306469097] OOOOPS, forgot to Smite you Smitty, my bad.  Okay, took care of that.  And, I so thank you for living in our little community.  Smitty, should we SHUT DOWN THE NEDERLAND EDC also? Just wonderin [/quote] [/quote] What is EDC?

[quote name="smitty" post="1014201" timestamp="1306406682"] I get it.  Unless someone has got to this person, maybe we'll have a "reasonable" bond issue.  But this remains to be seen.  Haven't had one yet!  Put it to a vote!! [quote author=dawgnut link=topic=84302.msg1014199#msg1014199 date=1306406283] [quote author=smitty link=topic=84302.msg1013994#msg1013994 date=1306328335] If you are confident, let's bring it to a vote!     ;) [quote author=dawgnut link=topic=84302.msg1013928#msg1013928 date=1306286141] smitty, how come your old "Don't Care" committee spokes person is now chairing the new bond committee? [/quote] [/quote] You missed the point smitty, you don't find it a little ironic when the person that was the mouth of the anti-bond group that hired an outside consultant to help destroy the last bond is now chairing the new bond committe? He still doesn't totaly get it, but he is learning. You can put all the money you want in maintenance of a 1956 Chevy and you still have a 1956 Chevy. You want to win races, you have to get a new car! But as always, you will not get the point because you don't want to get it, you are anti everything. [/quote] [/quote] A successful approach to planning a bond and it's passing is to recruit credible opponents of the bond to sit on the committee. By doing so the opponent becomes (as you like to put it on other threads) enlightened and the district also becomes more aware of the oppositions concerns. It’s a positive move. So, are you saying you would consider a reasonable bond?

[quote name="#1stangfan" post="1013121" timestamp="1305952820"] I never ran track but someone tell me exactly how much coaching is involved?  I am not trying to be funny but it seems like from the tack side of "track and field" it is "run like you are on fire".  Again...just wondering.  Because I had a good friend that would just show up at meets when I was in school and take home the goodies. [/quote] I understood your post just as you intended it. I don't know how others didn't.