ChampionEagles

Let's all laugh while WE continue to lose!

I stand by what I said. I have not threw around any of the coaching. You want to make this out to be about me. Alright you do that. I still think getting beat by an offense two years running is worth questioning how do you do something about it. I have not said anything about the coaching of those defenses. You want to belittle me about working. As long as anyone works for what they have I cannot say anything negative towards them. I happen to not run the debarker but admire someone that can day in and day out to provide for their family. Your obviously superior to anyone in that position.

Go ahead and say what you will. It don't change the facts. If you cannot defense the spread/zone read your going home. That's what happened to Newton two years in a row. I would be proud to work on the debarker if it paid the taxes that paid the salary of the coaches. "We" should look at how to get to the title game. If the coaches don't care enough to face the reality of what has happened, maybe they should be on the debarker. I've tried to avoid saying anything about coaching, but it continually gets brought into this. Defensing should be the issue, not what coach is coaching the defense. You seem to be bent on making it about the coaches. Is this too close to home for you?

Daingerfield scoring 62 in the state title game wasn't due to the offense they ran? Give me a break.

"We" is "we" as long as I came through the program, my son came through the program, and I still live in and pay taxes in the district and support the program. How do you get that the football program is run by someone totally without any outside influences? Just because I don't coach in Newton I'm not entitled to any kind of opinion? If there is no "we" there is no program. Again Barbay wears the big hat. That's what he gets paid for by "we". Open to suggestion? Unless you've not been reading all the post, I'm still asking what defense can stop it. Four rounds deep ain't good enough. Nothing short of a state trophy is. That should be the goal set at the first of every year. Attainable every year, no. Goal set for it every year, yes. Anything less should be seen as not reaching(failing) one's goal. Not satisfied that you reached four rounds deep. And beaten by the same offense two years in a row at that fourth round I would say needs to be looked at why, instead of oh they have better athletes. Cop out. How do you stop those athletes in that offense? How do you not let those athletes in that offense out score your offense? "We've" not had that answer for the last two years. No one else in DII has either. If your a coach on Newton's staff it would seem to me that you would not be satisfied with four rounds deep instead of a state trophy or maybe you have the wrong job.

I'm saying you can't count on that. I've heard him say that, but also have heard him say things that contradict that. Just don't put that out as the gospel, it may not happen. As for the blame, he wears the big hat, it is his fault. If you get credit for the wins, you have to take the blame for the losses. I say again that he is a man, not a god. Until we figure out a defense to deal with the current problem, we are not going to get another state trophy anyways, in my opinion.

I started this thread thinking about defensing the spread/zone read and never intended to say anything about replacing coaches or adopting the offense. JC your insane about seeing coach Barbay leave. One day it will happen, but I don't think you have the crystal ball on this. He will when he wants. Newton fans are as fickel as they come. Now having said all that I still think this is the offense that is ruling high school football right now. If it is ran well with a few quality athletes it is deadly. I've not seen personally any defense that can take it down completely. There probably will be in the future, but not right now. My question still is do your programs start to try to defense it earlier in the season if the only place they will see it is in the playoffs? How do you do this? It appears to win a state title this is going to be a very relevant question about anyone's program in the Golden Triangle.

Good point about the 7 on 7. Seeing things repeatedly makes making the right choice easier. Hence a smarter QB as well as a better wide receiver. The more they do it the better they get. This still brings the question of how to defend it. The X's and O's as well as when to develop the defense. And I think everyone's opinion is valuable in some way if it is offered in a constructive manner. Karma +1 to T-daddy.

[quote name="~old_wildcat~" post="731249" timestamp="1260963113"]
Oh and I see the "smite-bug" has struck me again..I either made a sensible statement or reminded someone of a dumb one they made... ;D
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The smite thing is easy and it requires no thought. You don't have to put into words anything that makes sense or requires thought in any way and this is perfect for some people. ;D

The thing to me that is obvious is our local teams are playing each other and crowning a champion. When we get out of our area we run into this type offense and yes some of the teams have "stud" players, but so do we. I would classify LeFrederick Ford as a stud. Our same old defenses we used to get that far are pretty much beaten in warmups. My question is not advocating changing coaches and running down all the teams in the Golden Triangle. How can a team from the Golden Triangle advance in the playoffs against teams that run the spread/zone read well. Do we take our outstanding athletes and build a defense that can play against this offense early on in the year or wait and try to build something during the playoffs? Personally I don't think you can make that kind of adjustment late in the year. I would sure like to see the Golden Triangle return to being a dominate force in Texas high school football. This forum is strictly talk any way you cut it. I think now is the time for talking about these kinds of issues.

Congrats to the 22-2A representatives. First team Offense, Dustin West - Kirbyville, Second Team Offense, LeFrederick Ford - Kirbyville, Honorable Mention Defense, Josh Harris - Kirbyville, Honorable Mention Offense, Kelvin Bennett, Newton.

Some teams have not been in the playoffs enough to understand this question. If your satisfied to just try and win some games, you have a very limited view of football in the state of Texas. If you want your team to bring home one of those state champion trophies this is a very relevant question. I haven't said anything about replacing any coaches, yet this gets thrust into the conversation by someone that knows little about what I'm talking about. This discussion is about theory of offense and defense. If that is over your head, maybe you should decline to participate. And smite me some more.

You can't talk about anything openly without getting skewered by people that think your trying to tear down their team. There are all kinds of rules that these "experts" do not know about and will not take the time to find out about.

[quote name="DP#1FAN" post="730732" timestamp="1260893635"]
[quote author=ChampionEagles link=topic=63795.msg730718#msg730718 date=1260891998]
Is the answer to accept this offense is going to get it's points and try to out score it or to defense it some way to try to contain the score. I think your right in looking up and down the classifications and see the amount of state champions that have won using this offense. That's why my question about the golden triangle. Are we behind the times?
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Perhaps you should replace the coach up there and put this offense in yourself.  :D :D I have heard and read it all now!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Typical answer.

Is the answer to accept this offense is going to get it's points and try to out score it or to defense it some way to try to contain the score. I think your right in looking up and down the classifications and see the amount of state champions that have won using this offense. That's why my question about the golden triangle. Are we behind the times?

[quote name="DP#1FAN" post="730651" timestamp="1260881457"]
Who cares?  I can tell you somebody Kirbyville kick the crap out of. This whole topic is a joke!
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You can call it a joke, but the UIL takes all of this quite seriously. If the school buys the team a meal, by rule, it has to buy the band, cheerleaders, pep squad, and any other school entity involved the same meal. Years ago at Newton after all the away games we were fed chicken fried steak meals at restaurants. For a long time now the team packs and eats sandwiches that are prepared at the Newton school cafeteria and paid for out of the athletic budget.

It seems that the truth has irritated some on this board. You can smite me all you want, the truth is still the truth. Newton has lost two years running to this offense. Kirbyville has lost two years running to this offense. This is the truth not something made up. How does a good team get better? By fixing it's weaknesses. Newton and Kirbyville both had weak defenses playing this kind of offense. Is there a defense that can stop it? I think we have just as many good athletes as anywhere in the state. How do we move on to the next step?

It's won championships, too. Until someone comes up with an effective defense, I think we'll see more and more of it. Your exactly right in that it exposes every weakness on defense and that is what makes it so effective. I know that Newton, and I think Kirbyville, have thrown the ball more in the last 5 years than they did in the preceding 20. Just running regular pass defense against the spread/zone read and they are going to light you up if they have the quality athletes playing. The overall level of ability in high school athletics has definately increased in the last 20 years. Are we here in the Golden Triangle behind the times by not adopting this offense or are we going to wait until someone figures out a defense that will work against it?

Hey I'm not downing Kirbyville. I'm saying this offense is something that is being ran more and more. Silsbee ran a version of it, I believe. The defenses ran against it have not been very effective, including Kirbyville and Newton. Defensive line play, I think, is the key. If you can get across the line of scrimmage with pressure, and cover with your defensive backs, you stand a chance. If your weak in rush or break coverage it opens up. Is this offense the future? I don't think many high school teams have stopped any team that runs it well.

I believe as a MVP they are not then on any team. Kirbyville took all three MVPs. 

If Kirbyville had "stopped" it you would have won. My point exactly. Regardless of strength and atheletic ability this offense is set up to take advantage of whatever the defense ran against it. Muleshoe's version is only one more out there. There are several I'm aware of , but they are all versions of the same offense.

Both teams lost to teams that run the spread offense with the zone read. Neither teams defense could stop that offense. It's not seen in the golden triangle a lot and is seen across the state more. Is this the reason that no teams from the Golden Triangle have won a state championship game since Newton in 2005? This type of offense is very potent when ran correctly and a threat every play to score. Kirbyville and Newton had pretty good offense, but no answer on defense. Are more teams going to run this type offense in the coming year? What is the answer to defense it. Please this is not bashing of either program, but an observation. A lot of colleges run this offense currently.

The stadium at San Marcus has multiple Railroad tracks at the north end and they blow their whistles loudly and for a long time every time they go by. And there will be many passing during the day. Kirbyville supporters will need hearing protection for the game(I'm not kidding). IMO one of the worst placed stadiums I have ever been to. The rail traffic literally shakes the stands as the trains go by. I was never on the field, but I would think you could feel the same shake on the turf. Beautiful stadium in a really bad location. I will listen and support Kirbyville in Bon Wier.

Yup youse sho showd us. Thim Tgers arrrr grati!

Way to go Cats! Congrats on big win. One more game!