If Lamar joins the SBC

[NorthoftheBorder]

[quote name="LUSportsFan" post="1398901" timestamp="1367189539"]
I think some good points have been raised in this thread.

First off, I'm one who thinks Lamar could and should move up to FBS as soon as possible.  [b]Most of the universities I consider as our direct peers and former rivals have already made the jump.[/b] such as ULL, LaTech, ArkSt, TxState, UTSA, North Texas, Western Kentucky, etc.  I also see a lot of universities that I would consider as peers who are currently making the jump like Georgia State, Georgia Southern and South Alabama.  Looking at the examples, I am not seeing universities a whole lot different from ours.  If they can do it, why can't Lamar?  I think there are several upsides to a well thought out move up.

This is primarily a sports forum, but part of improving the athletic resume for programs wanting to move up is through overall university reputation and perceived support for the University.  That's one reason I'm excited that the Investing in the Future campaign is at $102,095,373 out of the increased goal of $125,000,000.00 according to the LU University Advancement web page.

To make the jump, the University needs support of its alumni and from the surrounding community.  The same can be said for the University to increase its academic stature.  I'm a firm believer of giving back to the university.  I'm not a deep pocket donor, but collectively even every day folks like me can help a little considering there are over 75,000 alumni .  Just assuming 10% of us (7,500 alumni) make an average contribution of $200.00 a year, we collectively could help the University with $1,500,000.00 before corporate matches.  We can also get our companies to help support.  Many of the corporations in the local area have matching programs.  Like all the residents, those companies have a vested interest in a better educated workforce.  For those of us who have been transferred from the local area, we can make an impact also.

Matching gifts are a big thing.  Below is a partial list of corporations with local facilities.  It appears none will match for athletics.

ExxonMobil has a great program.  They offer a 3 to 1 match for employees as well as retirees (except retirees of Mobil Corporation).  The match is capped at $7,500.00 per year.  That means if an ExxonMobil employee made a contribution of $100.00, ExxonMobil would kick in an additional $300.00.  ($400.00 total)

Motiva offers a 1 to 1 match for employees.  The match is capped at $5,000.00 per year.

BASF offers a 1 to 1 match for employees.  The match is capped at $5,000.00 per year.

Chevron Phillips 1 to 1 match for employees.  The match is capped at $5,000 for employees and $1,500.00 for retirees.

Trinity Industries 1 to 1 match for employees.  The match is capped at $2,500 and needs prior VP approval.

Entergy - 1 to 1 match for employees.  The match is capped at $3,000.

Total Petrochemicals 1 to 1 match for employees.  The match is capped at $5,000.00.

Others include...

IBM - For employees, 1 for 1 match for cash.  University can get 2 for 1 match for equipment.  IBM also matches retiree cash contributions 1 for 2  (.50).

ConocoPhillips offers a 1 to 1 match.  The match is capped at $15,000.00.

Shell offers a 1 to 1 match.  The match is capped at $5,000.00.

BP offers a 1 to 1 match.  The match is capped at $5,000.00.

Apache offers a 1 to 1 match.  The match is capped at $10,000.00.

Chevron offers a 1 to 1 match.  The match is capped at $5,000.00.

If any of us have an interest in also supporting the athletic programs (scholarships, etc.), we could use the corporate match to leverage our general education support and kick in a little to the athletics program.

I really appreciate those large dollar donors who have stepped up to the plate.  I also think those like me should do our share.

Advantages are better quality of life for the area; making the area more attractive for prospective corporate investments as well as a better educated area.

I grew up in the area.  I went to Lamar and had a great experience.  I enjoy Lamar athletics.  I want the area and Lamar to succeed.  As one who has been out of the area for over 20 years, I see great untapped potential.  I can see what people in similar areas with an optimistic attitude have been able to accomplish.  I would like to see more people transition to a vision of We Can and away from a vision of We Can't.
[/quote]

Very Good Post!! I agree with you!

[UNLV]

[quote name="coachacola" post="1398755" timestamp="1367103469"]
[quote author=UNLV link=topic=111263.msg1398742#msg1398742 date=1367099475]
I understand. Too much DIESEL for ya.

There are people who can, and those who can not. Lamar has a long history of leaders who can not. And lets not forget the public that blindly supports the can not leadership. Hand shakes and pats on the back for just getting through the day or week or year or career.
[/quote]

What the hell have you done for LAMAR except talk about it on message boards?  Have you given millions of dollars to the school because that's what it takes to succeed at the FBS level.  You run your mouth on all these message boards but every time someone asks you about how much money you have given to LAMAR you just dodge the question.  So I'm asking you, how much have you donated to LAMAR over the years?  A rough estimate is all you need to tell us.
[/quote]I gave Lamar my time, money, and support since I was a little chick-a-dee. I w\as at UNLV wearing my  Lamar University sweater. I haven't made a million dollar donation to Lamar because Lamar  could use my money to do dumb things like dropping football. Did I dodge again?

[UNLV]

[quote name="usedtobe" post="1398660" timestamp="1367076137"]
[quote author=UNLV link=topic=111263.msg1398561#msg1398561 date=1367032976]
[quote author=SabineRavine link=topic=111263.msg1398496#msg1398496 date=1367026982]
LOL do you mean bankrupt and dropping sports in order to meet a continually dwindling budget resulting from fan apathy?
[/quote]You do understand Lamar dropped football, canceled sports, and dropped to the SLC by doing the opposite what I say Lamar should do.

If I was running Lamar, Lamar would be a $100 million research University with a campus population on 28k.
[/quote]

Well, by all means, get this post and your resume' to the Board of Regents as quickly as possible.  Surely they have no idea about your abilities or availability. ::)
[/quote]Let me dumb it down for ppl like you. I think we all saw how well Simmons ran Lamar, which means we can recognize good leadership from bad. Correct?

[Titletown2]

UNLV, if you could do all you say you could, you should've applied for the president's position while it was open. If you did apply, then the board of trustees thought you were full of s*** too!

[UNLV]

[quote name="Titletown2" post="1399008" timestamp="1367244399"]
UNLV, if you could do all you say you could, you should've applied for the president's position while it was open. If you did apply, then the board of trustees thought you were full of s*** too!
[/quote]I agree, they would never pick me. If you look at Lamar over the past 40 years, Lamar hasn't changed, grown, or improved significantly. I am not the type of president wanted for Lamar.

[SabineRavine]

You have a great self-concept of knowing what it takes to fix Lamar Athletics.  I'm curious . . . what career field do you work in?

[UNLV]

[quote name="SabineRavine" post="1399095" timestamp="1367260120"]
You have a great self-concept of knowing what it takes to fix Lamar Athletics.  I'm curious . . . what career field do you work in?
[/quote]hehe, setting traps eh?  I don't need to be a president of a university to recognized Lamar's short comings. All Lamar does is to play it safe. Any Star Trek NG fans on the forum. There was an episode whereas the Q gave the captain a chance to re-live his life over. In the new life the captain was conservative, never took chances, and passive. In the new life he never became a captain of a starship.
Well this is the history of Lamar University. And you fans defend it and attack ppl like me who disagree with Lamar's just getting by mentality.

[SabineRavine]

Thanks for avoiding the question - again.  And for using some comical logic, trekkie.

[UNLV]

Attacking the person and not the arguments gets us nowhere.

[Titletown2]

[quote name="UNLV" post="1399080" timestamp="1367254899"]
[quote author=Titletown2 link=topic=111263.msg1399008#msg1399008 date=1367244399]
UNLV, if you could do all you say you could, you should've applied for the president's position while it was open. If you did apply, then the board of trustees thought you were full of s*** too!
[/quote]I agree, they would never pick me. If you look at Lamar over the past 40 years, [b]Lamar hasn't [b]changed, grown, or improved[/b] significantly.[/b] I am not the type of president wanted for Lamar.
[/quote][quote author=Titletown2 link=topic=111263.msg1399008#msg1399008 date=1367244399]
UNLV, if you could do all you say you could, you should've applied for the president's position while it was open. If you did apply, then the board of trustees thought you were full of s*** too!
[/quote]

I'm sorry UNLV, I didn't emphasize the you"re full s*** part enough for you. When Jimmy Simmons became president Lamar had about 8,000 students, no football team, no women's soccer team, and no women's softball team. They also brought back the Marching Band and updated the Athletic facilities, to where they are among the best in the conference. Not to mention, a totally redone McDonald's Gym. They also had horrendous dorms. They now have Cardinal Village and the campus, it self looks 1000% better than it did when Dr. Simmons took over. This has led to Lamar have over 14,000 students. That's almost a 60% increase in enrollment. I would say that Lamar has changed, improved, and grown over the last 15 years, let alone 40. Again, I say you're full of it!

[UNLV]

[quote name="Titletown2" post="1399638" timestamp="1367419246"]
[quote author=UNLV link=topic=111263.msg1399080#msg1399080 date=1367254899]
[quote author=Titletown2 link=topic=111263.msg1399008#msg1399008 date=1367244399]
UNLV, if you could do all you say you could, you should've applied for the president's position while it was open. If you did apply, then the board of trustees thought you were full of s*** too!
[/quote]I agree, they would never pick me. If you look at Lamar over the past 40 years, [b]Lamar hasn't [b]changed, grown, or improved[/b] significantly.[/b] I am not the type of president wanted for Lamar.
[/quote][quote author=Titletown2 link=topic=111263.msg1399008#msg1399008 date=1367244399]
UNLV, if you could do all you say you could, you should've applied for the president's position while it was open. If you did apply, then the board of trustees thought you were full of s*** too!
[/quote]

I'm sorry UNLV, I didn't emphasize the you"re full s*** part enough for you. When Jimmy Simmons became president Lamar had about 8,000 students, no football team, no women's soccer team, and no women's softball team. They also brought back the Marching Band and updated the Athletic facilities, to where they are among the best in the conference. Not to mention, a totally redone McDonald's Gym. They also had horrendous dorms. They now have Cardinal Village and the campus, it self looks 1000% better than it did when Dr. Simmons took over. This has led to Lamar have over 14,000 students. That's almost a 60% increase in enrollment. I would say that Lamar has changed, improved, and grown over the last 15 years, let alone 40. Again, I say you're full of it!
[/quote]What happened before Simmons? Where would Lamar be had Lamar been doing those things you mentioned and more for the past 40 years?  You don't mind answering those 2 questions.

[LUSportsFan]

The advances during Dr. Simmons presidency have been great, but 40 years ago was a pretty good time for the University.  That may have been why UNLV selected that time frame.  1973 was in the second year of Dr. Gray's second term as president.  Things were going great for the University then.  As during Dr. Simmons presidency, there was a lot of expansion and improvements.  The problem is the period in between.  I think we took a big step back for too long of a time, especially after the mid to late 80's.

The last 15 years have been exciting and good years.  I'm not defending UNLV, but the late 60's through the mid 80's as well recent times are good benchmarks for the University.  I look forward to a continuation of the good years.  We need to do everything we can to avoid the steps back.  If we could turn back the clock, I would like to see how things would have been if we had not taken the backward steps.

Using the "wayback machine", LU football had an 8-2 record in 1974 (NCAA Division I - before the split).  Coach Martin's teams weren't enjoying the success they had in the late 60's when they were knocking off top 20 teams, but it wasn't that far removed and we all know what happened during Coach Tubbs and Coach Foster's time.  Gray Library was constructed in the mid 70's.  The old library was converted into the present Galloway building (Business).  Brooks / Shivers dorms were built during that time period.  They are not much now, but they were probably the equivalent of Cardinal Village back then.  The Cherry Engineering building was constructed during that period.  The Setzer Center was constructed during that period.  McDonald Gym was expanded.  Lamar enrollment was almost the same as, if not more, than A&M's main campus in the late 60's.  A benchmark point for A&M was the start of Earl Rudder's presidency.  I'm hopeful that progress made during Dr. Simmons benchmark will continue.

[UNLV]

The argument against me is the same trick Obama is using. Obama is spending trillions, but when he cut back a little, he call it a cut in the deficit. Well all Lamar is doing is getting back to where it was before. Nothing new. Lamar has a ways to go before it really start breaking new ground. Simmons has helped a lot, but not enough. When I have time, I will post what I would do.

[jdcurran235]

I bet the SBC does not expand this year.  I think JMU is out for this year, and MSU is not wanting to move up yet. Lamar would accept if invited but they will not get the invite and JSU is not ready. I bet they dont add anyone this year and wait for schools to be more prepared and more dominos to fall. The SBC needs to hope that there is not a total collapse with another conference shift and they become the the next conference to lose football.

[UNLV]

What will the SBC get by adding Lamar. Lone control of the football rich Golden Triangle, and area bigger than most SBC areas. 1 hour drive from Houston, an area bigger than most states in the SBC. Yet the SBC says pass. Something not right with that picture.

[UNLV]

You guys do not seem to understand the big picture.

Arkansas pop. is 3 million
Alabama pop. is 4.8 million.
Louisiana pop. is 4.6 million
Houston msa pop. is 6.6 million.

A whole state within the SBC and the SBC is not interested.
Houston/Beaumont area has more NFL players than Arkansas and Alabama.
Not interested.

Lamar does not own the Houston market. Neither does Ark st own the Arkansas market or USA the Alabama market or ULL the Louisiana market.

Texas Tech Lubbock MSA 290,000
ULL Lafayette MSA  277,000
USA Mobile MSA 412,000
Lamar BPT MSA 392,000
Baylor Waco MSA  234,000

SBC, Pass...we aren't interested.
Something is wrong.

[WOS95]

maybe the problem isnt Lamar..maybe its the Sun Belt Conference, who doesnt see the good things adding Lamar to their conference would do...

[LUSportsFan]

I think a lot of us get it; just don't understand it.

You see comments like [i]"...I think the worst case scenario is Lamar. That just makes the Sun Belt look desperate. Happily, they don't seem to be an option...".[/i]  The poster may have a private agenda, though.  His profile shows he supports North Texas.  He may not want more recruiting competition at his university's level.

I see mention that we're not ready, but universities like Missouri State (now) are.  With the exception of a football stadium expansion (which both universities would need), facilities are in place and are as good, if not better, than those of many current members and future members.

Comparing athletic expenditures using the USA Today database (provides history from 2006-2011), we compare favorably with members as well as candidates.

Lamar Athletics    $13,341,513

Missouri State      $13,829,559  (The Sun Belt fan site flavor of the day)
Georgia Southern  $11,245,505  (Received an invite recently)
Jacksonville St      $12,154,751    One of the names frequently mentioned
UL                          $13,946,204    Current Member
ULM                      $10,164,038    Current Member
Troy                      $15,246,720    Current Member
Appalachian St      $15,454,170  (Received an invite recently)
Arkansas St          $13,374,507  Current Member

Academically, we're in the same category as many of the current members (National University).  By another category, we're classed as a Doctoral Research University.  Three of the present and future members have the same classification except that they are designated as High or Very High Research Universities, classifications I hope we have plans to attain.  The remainder are classified as Masters universities.

[UNLV]

We can all agree the SBC is no SEC or PAC12. The SBC is at the bottom of the FBS and thinks it is too good for Lamar. Look at the numbers. Lamar fits the SBC profile currently in all sports except football. I find it very very very difficult to believe the SBC is not interested in Lamar, especially after adding Idaho. Put my bias aside, the logic and common sense is not there. Something else is in play if Lamar is not invited.

[UNLV]

[quote name="LUSportsFan" post="1402227" timestamp="1368026534"]
I think a lot of us get it; just don't understand it.

You see comments like [i]"...I think the worst case scenario is Lamar. That just makes the Sun Belt look desperate. Happily, they don't seem to be an option...".[/i]  The poster may have a private agenda, though.  His profile shows he supports North Texas.  He may not want more recruiting competition at his university's level.

I see mention that we're not ready, but universities like Missouri State (now) are.  With the exception of a football stadium expansion (which both universities would need), facilities are in place and are as good, if not better, than those of many current members and future members.

Comparing athletic expenditures using the USA Today database (provides history from 2006-2011), we compare favorably with members as well as candidates.

Lamar Athletics    $13,341,513

Missouri State      $13,829,559  (The Sun Belt fan site flavor of the day)
Georgia Southern  $11,245,505  (Received an invite recently)
Jacksonville St      $12,154,751    One of the names frequently mentioned
UL                          $13,946,204    Current Member
ULM                      $10,164,038    Current Member
Troy                      $15,246,720    Current Member
Appalachian St      $15,454,170  (Received an invite recently)
Arkansas St          $13,374,507  Current Member

Academically, we're in the same category as many of the current members (National University).  By another category, we're classed as a Doctoral Research University.  Three of the present and future members have the same classification except that they are designated as High or Very High Research Universities, classifications I hope we have plans to attain.  The remainder are classified as Masters universities.
[/quote]Would be interested to see their reaction if you posted these numbers on that forum.

[LUSportsFan]

We're about the same level in football as another invitee, Georgia State.  They started the same year we did and have comparable records playing equivalent competition.

Year      Georgia State      Lamar
2010        6-5                    5-6
2011        3-8                    4-7
2012        1-10                  4-8

[LUSportsFan]

[quote name="UNLV" post="1402233" timestamp="1368028251"]
[quote author=LUSportsFan link=topic=111263.msg1402227#msg1402227 date=1368026534]
I think a lot of us get it; just don't understand it.

You see comments like [i]"...I think the worst case scenario is Lamar. That just makes the Sun Belt look desperate. Happily, they don't seem to be an option...".[/i]  The poster may have a private agenda, though.  His profile shows he supports North Texas.  He may not want more recruiting competition at his university's level.

I see mention that we're not ready, but universities like Missouri State (now) are.  With the exception of a football stadium expansion (which both universities would need), facilities are in place and are as good, if not better, than those of many current members and future members.

Comparing athletic expenditures using the USA Today database (provides history from 2006-2011), we compare favorably with members as well as candidates.

Lamar Athletics    $13,341,513

Missouri State      $13,829,559  (The Sun Belt fan site flavor of the day)
Georgia Southern  $11,245,505  (Received an invite recently)
Jacksonville St      $12,154,751    One of the names frequently mentioned
UL                          $13,946,204    Current Member
ULM                      $10,164,038    Current Member
Troy                      $15,246,720    Current Member
Appalachian St      $15,454,170  (Received an invite recently)
Arkansas St          $13,374,507  Current Member

Academically, we're in the same category as many of the current members (National University).  By another category, we're classed as a Doctoral Research University.  Three of the present and future members have the same classification except that they are designated as High or Very High Research Universities, classifications I hope we have plans to attain.  The remainder are classified as Masters universities.
[/quote]Would be interested to see their reaction if you posted these numbers on that forum.
[/quote]

I'd post, but their site requires a .edu or company email address.  I'm retired and graduated a long time ago so I haven't set up an account.  All I have are the usual email addresses (gmail, yahoo, etc) and none of them are accepted.

[UNLV]

[quote name="LUSportsFan" post="1402237" timestamp="1368028839"]
We're about the same level in football as another invitee, Georgia State.  They started the same year we did and have comparable records playing equivalent competition.

Year      Georgia State      Lamar
2010        6-5                    5-6
2011        3-8                    4-7
2012        1-10                  4-8
[/quote]Yeah, but the argument for them is they won a FEW FCS NC.

[UNLV]

[quote name="LUSportsFan" post="1402238" timestamp="1368029021"]
[quote author=UNLV link=topic=111263.msg1402233#msg1402233 date=1368028251]
[quote author=LUSportsFan link=topic=111263.msg1402227#msg1402227 date=1368026534]
I think a lot of us get it; just don't understand it.

You see comments like [i]"...I think the worst case scenario is Lamar. That just makes the Sun Belt look desperate. Happily, they don't seem to be an option...".[/i]  The poster may have a private agenda, though.  His profile shows he supports North Texas.  He may not want more recruiting competition at his university's level.

I see mention that we're not ready, but universities like Missouri State (now) are.  With the exception of a football stadium expansion (which both universities would need), facilities are in place and are as good, if not better, than those of many current members and future members.

Comparing athletic expenditures using the USA Today database (provides history from 2006-2011), we compare favorably with members as well as candidates.

Lamar Athletics    $13,341,513

Missouri State      $13,829,559  (The Sun Belt fan site flavor of the day)
Georgia Southern  $11,245,505  (Received an invite recently)
Jacksonville St      $12,154,751    One of the names frequently mentioned
UL                          $13,946,204    Current Member
ULM                      $10,164,038    Current Member
Troy                      $15,246,720    Current Member
Appalachian St      $15,454,170  (Received an invite recently)
Arkansas St          $13,374,507  Current Member

Academically, we're in the same category as many of the current members (National University).  By another category, we're classed as a Doctoral Research University.  Three of the present and future members have the same classification except that they are designated as High or Very High Research Universities, classifications I hope we have plans to attain.  The remainder are classified as Masters universities.
[/quote]Would be interested to see their reaction if you posted these numbers on that forum.
[/quote]

I'd post, but their site requires a .edu or company email address.  I'm retired and graduated a long time ago so I haven't set up an account.  All I have are the usual email addresses (gmail, yahoo, etc) and none of them are accepted.
[/quote]The question I would ask if posted, "why does Lamar need a Athletic budget this big to play in the Southland?"

[LUSportsFan]

[quote name="UNLV" post="1402256" timestamp="1368031430"]
[quote author=LUSportsFan link=topic=111263.msg1402238#msg1402238 date=1368029021]
[quote author=UNLV link=topic=111263.msg1402233#msg1402233 date=1368028251]
[quote author=LUSportsFan link=topic=111263.msg1402227#msg1402227 date=1368026534]
I think a lot of us get it; just don't understand it.

You see comments like [i]"...I think the worst case scenario is Lamar. That just makes the Sun Belt look desperate. Happily, they don't seem to be an option...".[/i]  The poster may have a private agenda, though.  His profile shows he supports North Texas.  He may not want more recruiting competition at his university's level.

I see mention that we're not ready, but universities like Missouri State (now) are.  With the exception of a football stadium expansion (which both universities would need), facilities are in place and are as good, if not better, than those of many current members and future members.

Comparing athletic expenditures using the USA Today database (provides history from 2006-2011), we compare favorably with members as well as candidates.

Lamar Athletics    $13,341,513

Missouri State      $13,829,559  (The Sun Belt fan site flavor of the day)
Georgia Southern  $11,245,505  (Received an invite recently)
Jacksonville St      $12,154,751    One of the names frequently mentioned
UL                          $13,946,204    Current Member
ULM                      $10,164,038    Current Member
Troy                      $15,246,720    Current Member
Appalachian St      $15,454,170  (Received an invite recently)
Arkansas St          $13,374,507  Current Member

Academically, we're in the same category as many of the current members (National University).  By another category, we're classed as a Doctoral Research University.  Three of the present and future members have the same classification except that they are designated as High or Very High Research Universities, classifications I hope we have plans to attain.  The remainder are classified as Masters universities.
[/quote]Would be interested to see their reaction if you posted these numbers on that forum.
[/quote]

I'd post, but their site requires a .edu or company email address.  I'm retired and graduated a long time ago so I haven't set up an account.  All I have are the usual email addresses (gmail, yahoo, etc) and none of them are accepted.
[/quote]The question I would ask if posted, "why does Lamar need a Athletic budget this big to play in the Southland?"
[/quote]

Good Question.

By the way, Coachacola posted a link to an updated list of expenditures on the other board.

[url=http://bigredinsider.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=184&topic=38193.0]http://bigredinsider.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=184&topic=38193.0[/url]

Below are the revised amounts.

Lamar Athletics    $14,390,771

Missouri State      $13,761,264    (The Sun Belt fan site flavor of the day)
Georgia Southern  $11,335,102    (Received an invite recently)
Jacksonville St      $12,261,404    One of the names frequently mentioned
UL                          $17,532,577    Current Member
ULM                      $10,769,839    Current Member
Troy                      $16,504,664    Current Member
Appalachian St      $17,238,578  (Received an invite recently)
Arkansas St          $15,307,308    Current Member

[url=http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/schools/finances/]http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/schools/finances/[/url]