US Postal Service...

[smitty]

Resolved: The US Postal Service should be eliminated.  It should be replaced with more efficient private industries.  Thoughts?

[tvc184]

I've already posted the solution and I honestly think it would work. 

 

Currently the USPS delivers six days a week to every (or nearly so) address. Cut the service to 3 days at each address. It will be Monday-Wednesday-Friday for half and Tuesday-Thursday-Friday for the other half. 

 

You can cut about 35% of the local carriers (or maybe 50% but I was being conservative). No need to cut support staff such as large trucks that deliver mail between post officers, aircraft, etc. By cutting a third of the carriers, it would save enough to make it more profitable or in their case, breaking even is good enough since they aren't privately owned. From my quick calculations it will save about $8 Billion a year or about 20% of their current budget. 

 

As far as the private industry doing a better job, I agree in most cases but is it true in this case? The USPS delivers mail for 49¢ for a first class letter (I think that is the current rate). I have never seen UPS or FedEx offer anything for 49¢ (much less cheaper if they can do it more efficiently) but maybe I missed it. 

[PNGFan]

I asked the post master in Port Neches if they gave testing to the postal workers because they can't read or know numbers. My mail carrier has been screwing up my mail for years. Told him now I know why they are bankrupt because the workers are idiots.

[Big girl]

Look at Fed Ex. They are always messing up and they are a private company.

[westend1]

Just cut out Saturday deliveries.  How much would that save?

[stevenash]

I've already posted the solution and I honestly think it would work. 

 

Currently the USPS delivers six days a week to every (or nearly so) address. Cut the service to 3 days at each address. It will be Monday-Wednesday-Friday for half and Tuesday-Thursday-Friday for the other half. 

 

You can cut about 35% of the local carriers (or maybe 50% but I was being conservative). No need to cut support staff such as large trucks that deliver mail between post officers, aircraft, etc. By cutting a third of the carriers, it would save enough to make it more profitable or in their case, breaking even is good enough since they aren't privately owned. From my quick calculations it will save about $8 Billion a year or about 20% of their current budget. 

 

As far as the private industry doing a better job, I agree in most cases but is it true in this case? The USPS delivers mail for 49¢ for a first class letter (I think that is the current rate). I have never seen UPS or FedEx offer anything for 49¢ (much less cheaper if they can do it more efficiently) but maybe I missed it. 

 Just because they deliver mail for 49 cents does not mean that truly reflects the cost.  They have defaulted on debt and are in very bad financial condition.  I would surmise that, to be profitable or at least break even, their true cost of delivering a first class piece of mail is north of 49 cents.  UPS and FedEx rates are more indicative of actual costs since they are for profit organizations

[tvc184]

 Just because they deliver mail for 49 cents does not mean that truly reflects the cost.  They have defaulted on debt and are in very bad financial condition.  I would surmise that, to be profitable or at least break even, their true cost of delivering a first class piece of mail is north of 49 cents.  UPS and FedEx rates are more indicative of actual costs since they are for profit organizations

 

The USPS is not intended to make a profit. With all that you stated, can a private carrier deliver a letter for 49¢ or less. 

 

Looking at a news report from the NY Times, the USPS loses between $800 Million to $1.5 Billion a quarter. That comes out to a worse case scenario of $6 Billion per year loss. My proposal could save up to $8 Billion per year or them actually making a profit. 

 

Also from the Times article, the USPS delivers about 38 billion pieces of mail per quarter. Raising the rates by 5¢ per piece, it will raise $1.9 Billion per quarter or almost $8 Billion per year, again more than making up for any loss. 

 

So even with an increase of 5¢ per article, can FedEx, UPS and others deliver a piece of mail for 54¢? 

[stevenash]

I am simply stating that the U.S. Postal Service, with its current cost structure is operating like Solyndra did.  They are "selling" their product for less than it costs them.  I dont know what it costs FedEx or UPS to operate.  All I know is that they arent coming to the trough every year for taxpayer subsidies/cash infusions.  USPS lost 15.9 billion in 2012 and 1.9 billion in its most recent quarter.  I cant answer whether or not UPS of FedEx can deliver for 54 cents per letter.  I am guessing that you assume that the 5 cent increase will not cause the volume of deliveries to fall off at all when making your profitability/break even calculations.  I also dont know what method you used to estimate the cost reductions but if they are accurate, I would be a big supporter of your proposed method.  Problem is, ( as it always is) government agencies are very incompetent when it comes to cost cutting or implementing operating efficiencies while private market enterprises accomplish them all of the time.  Until such time that USPS is not having to take in more taxpayer funding, the " cost" of what they are selling their product for is not really the cost.

[tvc184]

The question in the OP was about private industry operating more efficiently than the USPS. 

 

I fail to see how they can and I think my numbers are correct or nearly so. While the contract carriers may be good at delivering a limit quantity of parcel post items, they hardly deal with anything near the quantity of the USPS. 

 

I see a FedEx truck on my street about 15 times a year and a UPS truck about one a week. Even when I see those, they usually deliver to a single home and then leave. That is a far cry from stopping at virtually every address in the US six days a week. If they can deliver a first class letter at less than the USPS then let them do so, noting that the USPS delivers to all addresses for the same cost so a letter to Guam or Puerto Rico is still 49¢.  I am all for free enterprise and if FedEx, UPS and others can do that, feel free to jump on it. 

 

Lastly, since you are talking about efficiency...................

 

To put it in perspective, $16 Billion per year even at the cost of taxpayer's money (which in this case everyone actually benefits), is 0.004% of our annual budget. So even if you are paying $15,000 a year in income taxes, only $60 goes to the USPS to make up for their shortfall. Just think of it, you will only pay $14,940 instead. I would bet that most people reading this forum are not paying $15K per year in income taxes so their cost for the USPS would be less and sometimes a lots less than $60 per year. So for $60 or less for an entire year (a bit over $1 per week) you get delivery of any number of letters and packages, usually to your front door and six days a week. If we give FedEx $16B a year in tax dollars, can they deliver to every address, six days a week, including Guam, Puerto Rico, US Virgin Islands, etc.? No wait, they would have to do it cheaper so they need to do it for a lot less. 

 

I just don't believe it that it will be any more efficient in this case by contract carriers and even if so, only by a couple of pennies per item.  Out of all the stuff we pay for with our taxes, it seems like the USPS is the least offensive and has a benefit for virtually every person. Compare that to where other places our money is spent. 

 

A comparison with Solyndra is meaningless. Solyndra was a private company that tried to manufacture a product that would be used by a minuscule percentage of people. I got nothing out of Solyndra and likely would not have if had they made it. I benefit from the USPS daily and I would bet that you do also. 

 

And lastly, I ran FexEx for a 10 pound standard rate package from Houston to NY (no overnight or emergency delivery). It was $14.71. The same 10 pound package from the USPS Priority Mail is $10.65. Hmmmm............ 

 

Maybe if the USPS charged "private" for profit rates, they wouldn't be in the red. 

[TROJANSWIN]

Ups and FedEx actually take packages and charge customers, then send the package by USPS. They make money off the package by shipping with the postal service.

Also, do you know any other enterprise that if you go to them to pick up your mail, you have to pay a yearly fee, but if they bring it to you it is free? If they charged $5 a year to have mail delivered to your mailbox, I bet they would be out of the negative.

[smitty]

Ups and FedEx actually take packages and charge customers, then send the package by USPS. They make money off the package by shipping with the postal service.

Also, do you know any other enterprise that if you go to them to pick up your mail, you have to pay a yearly fee, but if they bring it to you it is free? If they charged $5 a year to have mail delivered to your mailbox, I bet they would be out of the negative.

What private business do you know that can lose billions and billions of dollars Per Quarter and still survive?   None!  So why should the postal service survive?  Private industry would take up the slack were needed.  Time and technology has pasted the postal service by.  It's time to eliminate it!

[tvc184]

What private business do you know that can lose billions and billions of dollars Per Quarter and still survive?   None!  So why should the postal service survive?  Private industry would take up the slack were needed.  Time and technology has pasted the postal service by.  It's time to eliminate it!

 

 

Then let the contract carriers deliver a package as cheap as the postal service and letters for less than 50¢ to every address. 

 

I still do not think it can be done. What happens if you eliminate them next week and half the country can't pay their bills without sending it FedEx at $10 for a letter and you have 12 bills to pay? 

[stevenash]

Until the USPS can operate at a break even rate, we do not know what the real cost of sending a letter is.  It certainly is more than what the advertised rate is.   If it wasnt, the USPS would not have defaulted on debt and would not have operated at such huge losses.  My contention is that the "real cost" of delivering a letter is more than 50 cents.  My only point about the Solyndra analogy ( and I still maintain it was valid) was that selling your product for less than it costs to manufacture, never works and never will.  I am not offering an opinion on whether or not the USPS should be eliminated, but the only way to run a business is to have it pay its own way.  Market forces(competition) insist that private industry control its costs.  Government agencies are not "accountable to the market" and therefore do not respond to the markets demands for increased efficiency and bureaucracy reduction.

[mat]

USPS needs to implement a hefty junk mail rate. 3/4 of the mail I receive is useless.

[Big girl]

I agree