Discussion question:

[RETIREDFAN1]

37 minutes ago, LumRaiderFan said:

I think that is what I said. 

"If you confess and believe, I mean really believe (not just saying you do) the repentance has already taken place through the Holy Spirit."

If you truly believe, you have been compelled by the Holy Spirit to repent.

I'll be fine C1...worry about someone else that doesn't know Scripture.

No, if you have been convicted by the Holy Spirit, who works through The Word, you will DO the action of repenting.......you didn't say anything near what Scripture says.......

 

 

[RETIREDFAN1]

45 minutes ago, LumRaiderFan said:

If someone does not do the things that God commands them to do, they weren't saved to begin with.

If doesn't mean you have to do them in order to be saved.

Are you saying if you accept Jesus into your heart but die on the way to the Church of Christ to be Baptized, or you never got the chance to evangelize you aren't going to make it to Heaven?

Is that what you are saying?

As I have already said, Salvation is a gift...you cannot do anything to earn it.

First, He says EXACTLY what He means.......you, on the other hand, contradict yourself in your first two statements above....

 

Yes, but I'm just repeating what My Lord said because I actually believe Him.......

 

as THE LORD has said, DOING WHAT HE SAID TO DO isn't earning a thing......here it is again, in case you missed it.....

 

Luke 17:10English Standard Version (ESV)

10 So you also, when you have done all that you were commanded, say, ‘We are unworthy servants;[

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] we have only done what was our duty.’”

 

 

 

 

[LumRaiderFan]

12 minutes ago, Colmesneilfan1 said:

First, He says EXACTLY what He means.......you, on the other hand, contradict yourself in your first two statements above....

 

Yes, but I'm just repeating what My Lord said because I actually believe Him.......

 

as THE LORD has said, DOING WHAT HE SAID TO DO isn't earning a thing......here it is again, in case you missed it.....

 

Luke 17:10English Standard Version (ESV)

10 So you also, when you have done all that you were commanded, say, ‘We are unworthy servants;[

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] we have only done what was our duty.’”

 

 

 

 

No contradiction at all...when you are saved you follow commandments...you don't follow commandments in order to BE saved.

Curious...can you answer the question about dying before you are baptized...are you going to Heaven?

[RETIREDFAN1]

10 minutes ago, LumRaiderFan said:

No contradiction at all...when you are saved you follow commandments...you don't follow commandments in order to BE saved.

Curious...can you answer the question about dying before you are baptized...are you going to Heaven?

It is a glaring contradiction.....the action of BELIEVING is commanded......so according to you, since you don't have to follow commandments in order to be saved, then you can be saved without believing.......your contradictions are showing......

 

I answered it......my Lord said that if that person had not been baptized, that person is lost.......I believe Him......

[LumRaiderFan]

4 minutes ago, Colmesneilfan1 said:

It is a glaring contradiction.....the action of BELIEVING is commanded......so according to you, since you don't have to follow commandments in order to be saved, then you can be saved without believing.......your contradictions are showing......

 

I answered it......my Lord said that if that person had not been baptized, that person is lost.......I believe Him......

So we are COMMANDED to believe?

What happened to free will?

No contradiction on my part.

Have a good day, C1.

[RETIREDFAN1]

1 hour ago, LumRaiderFan said:

So we are COMMANDED to believe?

What happened to free will?

No contradiction on my part.

Have a good day, C1.

Yes, we are commanded to believe.....you can choose not to by your free will, but that comes with eternal consequences........you are full of contradictions....just saying you are not doesn't change that.......

 

you  have a good day as well......

[5GallonBucket]

5 hours ago, LumRaiderFan said:

As does Romans 10:9.

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

It doesn't tack on anything else...if there were something else to DO, it would not be a gift, you would have earned it.

The works follow Salvation, but are not a requirement of it.

I'm good with that...if you aren't, OK.

And yes, the Church of Christ is a denomination.

there is two different types of Church of Christ a denomination one and a non denomination one.

SO are you saying the bible has contradictions. cause clear as day it says in Mark 16:15-16  ¹⁵ And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation. ¹⁶ Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.   also in Matthew 28:18-20 Jesus commanded it.

Gotta know the context in which it was written.

Romans 10:1   Paul is concerned about the salvation of the Jews. In both Romans and Galatians Paul is attempting to convince Jewish people that they no longer are under the Law of Moses. It is this emphasis, this argument, that reveals the meaning of Romans 10:9,10. 

Many gentiles go to this passage for a simple formula for salvation.

If this is what you believe, please tell my why Jesus commanded us in Matthew 28:18-20 as well as Mark 16:15-16. 

 

 

[5GallonBucket]

2 hours ago, LumRaiderFan said:

No contradiction at all...when you are saved you follow commandments...you don't follow commandments in order to BE saved.

Curious...can you answer the question about dying before you are baptized...are you going to Heaven?

I answered that question already.

[LumRaiderFan]

13 minutes ago, 5GallonBucket said:

I answered that question already.

I know, I got my answer.

Sure would be a shame to have a heart attack after accepting Christ on the way to the Church to get baptized...or not have gotten a chance to spread the gospel.

 

[LumRaiderFan]

11 minutes ago, 5GallonBucket said:

there is two different types of Church of Christ a denomination one and a non denomination one.

SO are you saying the bible has contradictions. cause clear as day it says in Mark 16:15-16  ¹⁵ And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation. ¹⁶ Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.   also in Matthew 28:18-20 Jesus commanded it.

Gotta know the context in which it was written.

Romans 10:1   Paul is concerned about the salvation of the Jews. In both Romans and Galatians Paul is attempting to convince Jewish people that they no longer are under the Law of Moses. It is this emphasis, this argument, that reveals the meaning of Romans 10:9,10. 

Many gentiles go to this passage for a simple formula for salvation.

If this is what you believe, please tell my why Jesus commanded us in Matthew 28:18-20 as well as Mark 16:15-16. 

 

 

Wonder why he says whoever does not believe and get baptized will be condemned.

You guys are getting Commandments for how we should handle ourselves AFTER salvation with requirements for Salvation.

Anyway, I am at peace and know where I am headed.

[RETIREDFAN1]

29 minutes ago, LumRaiderFan said:

I know, I got my answer.

Sure would be a shame to have a heart attack after accepting Christ on the way to the Church to get baptized...or not have gotten a chance to spread the gospel.

 

Hey, we agree.....it would be a shame, especially since he's had his whole life to SEEK The Truth.....to ASK about the Truth......

[RETIREDFAN1]

27 minutes ago, LumRaiderFan said:

Wonder why he says whoever does not believe and get baptized will be condemned.

 

Because belief is also a COMMAND....... 

[LumRaiderFan]

Just now, Colmesneilfan1 said:

Because belief is also a COMMAND....... 

Gotcha 

Wouldn't you say that only Christians are those that are subject to God's commandments and to be a Christian you would already believe.

The Great Commandment was not given to non-believers, right?

[bullets13]

On 3/23/2016 at 10:20 AM, Colmesneilfan1 said:

If the Holy Spirit didn't want it, it wouldn't be accepted......my example is the fictional version the Jehovahs Witnesses made......if the Holy Spirit didn't want anything 'ripped from the Bible" it would not be......

 

i dont know know what happened on my previous post to garble it up......I was quoting Titus 3:4-7

Titus 3:4-7English Standard Version (ESV)

4 But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared, 5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

 

 

so i can interpret and worship however i want, then, correct?  because if the holy spirit didn't want it that way, it would not be that way?

[RETIREDFAN1]

5 minutes ago, LumRaiderFan said:

Gotcha 

Wouldn't you say that only Christians are those that are subject to God's commandments and to be a Christian you would already believe.

The Great Commandment was not given to non-believers, right?

No, you don't "gotcha".......all men are subject to God's commands...those who DO WHAT HE SAID TO DO will be saved......those who do not, will burn.....

 

Acts 17:30-31English Standard Version (ESV)

30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent, 31 because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead.”

 

to become a Christian, you must hear, believe, and obey His Word....

 

the Great Commandment was given to the Jews in the Old Testament and to all disciples of Christ when He restated it in the New Testament......

 

[RETIREDFAN1]

6 minutes ago, bullets13 said:

so i can interpret and worship however i want, then, correct?  because if the holy spirit didn't want it that way, it would not be that way?

If you want to burn eternally.......that's your choice.......but if you want eternal life, you will DO WHAT GOD SAID TO DO.......we are not allowed to interpret God's Word.......We are to take it as He spoke it......

[LumRaiderFan]

3 minutes ago, Colmesneilfan1 said:

No, you don't "gotcha".......all men are subject to God's commands...those who DO WHAT HE SAID TO DO will be saved......those who do not, will burn.....

 

Acts 17:30-31English Standard Version (ESV)

30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent, 31 because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead.”

 

to become a Christian, you must hear, believe, and obey His Word....

 

the Great Commandment was given to the Jews in the Old Testament and to all disciples of Christ when He restated it in the New Testament......

 

I mean gotcha as in, I understand...lol.

Not that I agree with your order of things, but I understand.

[RETIREDFAN1]

Just now, LumRaiderFan said:

I mean gotch as in, I understand...lol.

Not that I agree with your order of things, but I understand.

Lol.....oh..... Ok........:)

[westend1]

2 hours ago, Colmesneilfan1 said:

If you want to burn eternally.......that's your choice.......but if you want eternal life, you will DO WHAT GOD SAID TO DO.......we are not allowed to interpret God's Word.......We are to take it as He spoke it......

I don't think God even spoke English.   Those are not his words.

[mat]

We have the ten commandments and the two greatest commandments and I think it's safe to say that in some form we all have faltered in keeping them. Thank God for his grace.

Matthew 22

³⁶ “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

³⁷ Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’^[

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] ³⁸ This is the first and greatest commandment. ³⁹ And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[

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] ⁴⁰ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

[mat]

Furthermore, a healthy debate between Christians can be a good think. However, a debate on a public forum visited by some that don't believe or are questioning Christianity can be very counter productive. If the Christians can't even agree on their own religion it isn't very appealing to others. JMO, even though I'm sure there's scripture to support my view.

[LumRaiderFan]

11 hours ago, mat said:

Furthermore, a healthy debate between Christians can be a good think. However, a debate on a public forum visited by some that don't believe or are questioning Christianity can be very counter productive. If the Christians can't even agree on their own religion it isn't very appealing to others. JMO, even though I'm sure there's scripture to support my view.

You are exactly right.

[bullets13]

21 hours ago, Colmesneilfan1 said:

If you want to burn eternally.......that's your choice.......but if you want eternal life, you will DO WHAT GOD SAID TO DO.......we are not allowed to interpret God's Word.......We are to take it as He spoke it......

every time you go to church you're getting a man's interpretation of God's word.  Every church interprets differently, and every church thinks their interpretation is right.  

[bullets13]

17 hours ago, mat said:

Furthermore, a healthy debate between Christians can be a good think. However, a debate on a public forum visited by some that don't believe or are questioning Christianity can be very counter productive. If the Christians can't even agree on their own religion it isn't very appealing to others. JMO, even though I'm sure there's scripture to support my view.

i'm glad that you said this, because i read through the whole thread and was thinking to myself that nobody in their right mind would read this thread and feel like Christianity is something they'd want to be a part of.

[RETIREDFAN1]

42 minutes ago, bullets13 said:

every time you go to church you're getting a man's interpretation of God's word.  Every church interprets differently, and every church thinks their interpretation is right.  

No, when you go to a congregation of the Lord's Church, you don't get an interpretation because God doesn't allow for that......

 

2 Peter 1:19-21English Standard Version (ESV)

19 And we have the prophetic word more fully confirmed, to which you will do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts, 20 knowing this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture comes from someone's own interpretation. 21 For no prophecy was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

 

So, if you are getting anything but the pure, unadulterated Word of God, you are in the wrong place......all of the errors, false teaching, and confusion come from men trying to interpret God's Word instead of faithfully accepting it as He revealed it to us.......