Christopher Columbus statue vandalized in Houston last night

[PhatMack19]

1 hour ago, westend1 said:

Yeah.  They did.  Look, you can google "cause of civil war" and try to pick out the most reputable looking sites and 9 out of 10 will say it was the issue of slavery that caused the south to try to secede.  I'll go with that.  I get that it makes southerners feel better to try and revise that history, but it's just not true.  Anyhow, I won't convince you and neither will all those historians so I am done with it. Believe what makes you feel good

Who controls the news and prints what fits their agenda?

[BS Wildcats]

1 hour ago, westend1 said:

Yeah.  They did.  Look, you can google "cause of civil war" and try to pick out the most reputable looking sites and 9 out of 10 will say it was the issue of slavery that caused the south to try to secede.  I'll go with that.  I get that it makes southerners feel better to try and revise that history, but it's just not true.  Anyhow, I won't convince you and neither will all those historians so I am done with it. Believe what makes you feel good

That's what you're doing, is it not?

[westend1]

26 minutes ago, BS Wildcats said:

That's what you're doing, is it not?

No. I read articles and try to get all the information I can. You should try it

[Englebert]

13 hours ago, new tobie said:

Who did neo Nazis and kkk vote for. Which candidate would slave owners have voted for. Slave owners were domestic terrorist. 

So you can't answer a question a 2nd grader could answer. Typical and expected.

[PAMFAM10]

3 hours ago, PhatMack19 said:

Read up on the Morrill Tariff.  That had more to do with the start of the war than slavery.  

Yeah but the left is the one tryna erase history... Find any credible historian that would agree slavery wasn't the number one issue for the civil war. Stop reaching and trying to make traitors sound like patriots defending their homes. 

My god we can't improve race relationships in this country if we cant even be honest about the root cause of the civil war. 

And the north had plenty of free territories yes a lot still owned slaves but it's a reason the Underground Railroad went north not south.

i mean who were y'all 3rd grade teachers who were y'all us history teacher they owe y'all explanations.

[PhatMack19]

1 hour ago, PAMFAM10 said:

Yeah but the left is the one tryna erase history... Find any credible historian that would agree slavery wasn't the number one issue for the civil war. Stop reaching and trying to make traitors sound like patriots defending their homes. 

My god we can't improve race relationships in this country if we cant even be honest about the root cause of the civil war. 

And the north had plenty of free territories yes a lot still owned slaves but it's a reason the Underground Railroad went north not south.

i mean who were y'all 3rd grade teachers who were y'all us history teacher they owe y'all explanations.

This is a good read

 

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[new tobie]

15 hours ago, BS Wildcats said:

obama's base wasn't much better.  they voted that dumbarse in twice

they would have voted him in a third time against this idiot we have if it were possible

[new tobie]

13 hours ago, 77 said:

you own people were the biggest slave traders there was!

 

you cant erase what happened but you do have to learn to live with it. vandalizing anything will not change history for me or you. One must be able to forgive the wrongs done to you are you will never have peace. I am not a young man by any means and I went to school all the way through with black kids that had the exact same opportunities I had. Was slavery bad you bet but it was  and and everyone should  learn not to repeat it and move on. All the nonsense only divides the nation more. By the way I think the nazis and the klan are cowards just like the blm and antifa . anyone that covers their face to supposedly rally is up to no good.

I have a great job that i have been at for 30 years, but in 1988 I didn't have equal oppourtunities as some whites. first of all the chemical plant had to hire and promote a black quota. don't believe in this practice, but if it wasn't in place blacks would be treated unfairly. Often the blacks that got promoted where the yes men. The vocal blacks would stay in place. The oppourtunities were and still are not equal.

[CardinalBacker]

2 hours ago, new tobie said:

I have a great job that i have been at for 30 years, but in 1988 I didn't have equal oppourtunities as some whites. first of all the chemical plant had to hire and promote a black quota. don't believe in this practice, but if it wasn't in place blacks would be treated unfairly. Often the blacks that got promoted where the yes men. The vocal blacks would stay in place. The oppourtunities were and still are not equal.

I'm glad that worked out for you. Integrating workplaces is a great idea, but I've never really agreed with the way Affirmative Action works in reality. Hiring a person based on their race seems wrong to me, regardless of the intentions. 

I hear what you're saying, but I don't understand when you say "the opportunities were not (I get that) and still are not equal."

At what point will you believe that opportunities are "equal" and all grievances can finally be laid to rest?

[baddog]

10 minutes ago, CardinalBacker said:

I'm glad that worked out for you. Integrating workplaces is a great idea, but I've never really agreed with the way Affirmative Action works in reality. Hiring a person based on their race seems wrong to me, regardless of the intentions. 

I hear what you're saying, but I don't understand when you say "the opportunities were not (I get that) and still are not equal."

At what point will you believe that opportunities are "equal" and all grievances can finally be laid to rest?

When the company has no whites working.

[new tobie]

9 minutes ago, baddog said:

When the company has no whites working.

Because a smart hard working black doesn't mean anything if he has the wrong affilliations or he is to vocal. affirmative action was started because of unfairness. The majority of anything will be unfair to the minority in some way, even if we are talking about animals

[CardinalBacker]

9 minutes ago, baddog said:

When the company has no whites working.

C'mon... it was an honest question. Re-read Tobie's post to which I was replying. It seems genuine enough to me. I can assure you that Tobie isn't working towards a future in which his company employs no whites. 

If we're ever going to get anywhere in this country on the race issues, people need to understand where the other guy is coming from. We don't have to agree, and we don't have to change each other's way of thinking, but just understanding where the other guy is coming from helps a lot. 

[baddog]

4 minutes ago, CardinalBacker said:

C'mon... it was an honest question. Re-read Tobie's post to which I was replying. It seems genuine enough to me. I can assure you that Tobie isn't working towards a future in which his company employs no whites. 

If we're ever going to get anywhere in this country on the race issues, people need to understand where the other guy is coming from. We don't have to agree, and we don't have to change each other's way of thinking, but just understanding where the other guy is coming from helps a lot. 

Couldn't agree more. Obviously, you haven't read as many posts from Tobie as I have. He has a genuine side as do I, but he is mostly on here to stir the pot. Ask other posters if you don't believe me. This is why I respond in kind to him. Tried having heart to heart discussions with him but both sides have to be perfectly honest. He is one who will never be satisfied. Work with a white man just like Tobie in that he always complains no matter what.

[CardinalBacker]

16 minutes ago, new tobie said:

Because a smart hard working black doesn't mean anything if he has the wrong affilliations or he is to vocal. affirmative action was started because of unfairness. The majority of anything will be unfair to the minority in some way, even if we are talking about animals

My wife works at a firm of about 100 people, and I think that only about two of them are black. There are some other people of color, but I won't pretend like their roster represents a cross-section of society as a whole. 

The funny thing is, you'll never guess who gets the promotions and raises. It's the "yes men" and those ones with the right affiliations. The "vocal" ones always seem to get passed over at promotion time. Things happen in her "segregated" office just like you describe them in your diverse workplace. She can't blame racism for the way promotions are handed out in her workplace, even though promotions seem to be handed out the same as they are at your job. 

I wish that I had a better answer to making sure hiring opportunities are equal. I don't agree with Affirmative Action, but it's what we have and it's what we'll do until somebody comes up with something better. 

[new tobie]

34 minutes ago, CardinalBacker said:

My wife works at a firm of about 100 people, and I think that only about two of them are black. There are some other people of color, but I won't pretend like their roster represents a cross-section of society as a whole. 

The funny thing is, you'll never guess who gets the promotions and raises. It's the "yes men" and those ones with the right affiliations. The "vocal" ones always seem to get passed over at promotion time. Things happen in her "segregated" office just like you describe them in your diverse workplace. She can't blame racism for the way promotions are handed out in her workplace, even though promotions seem to be handed out the same as they are at your job. 

I wish that I had a better answer to making sure hiring opportunities are equal. I don't agree with Affirmative Action, but it's what we have and it's what we'll do until somebody comes up with something better. 

We have affirmative action because the majority has never and never will be fair. 

[CardinalBacker]

20 minutes ago, new tobie said:

We have affirmative action because the majority has never and never will be fair. 

So in a few years, when white people total less than 50% of the US population, you'll be okay with whites getting preferential treatment as a "minority" group? 

The local news was talking a week or so about an elementary school in PA and they described it as a "minority majority" school. That must be a PC way of saying that the school is predominantly non-white. If I believe your way of thinking, then there is no way for a white educator or white student to be "treated fairly" at this school because "the majority (in this case, people of color) has never and never will be fair"

 

[PhatMack19]

1 hour ago, new tobie said:

Because a smart hard working black doesn't mean anything if he has the wrong affilliations or he is to vocal. affirmative action was started because of unfairness. The majority of anything will be unfair to the minority in some way, even if we are talking about animals

I have a friend that works at one of the big local refineries that gets tax breaks for having certain numbers of minorities.  One of their last big hirings he was ordered to go in a separate room and make sure this group passed the test.  He asked what they meant and was told "these people need to pass the test."  He basically did the test open book with class room discussion to make sure his separate group of chosen minorities passed.  Whitey was left in the public room taking the test by themselves with 1000's of others.  

 

I dont know about y'all, but if I'm working at a job where 1 mistake could kill or injure many people, I want the best, most qualified people working along side me regardless of skin color.  I don't care to put my life in the hands of people that need special favors in order to get jobs they aren't qualified for.