Baytown Sterling is Open

[PlayActionPass]

21 minutes ago, justthefax said:

The records above show a cumulative 30-86 record over the past 5 years and there does not seem to be any playoff records.  Maxpreps shows a career win/loss record of 7/43 for the AD (Dr. Mulvaney).  They say the apple does not fall far from the tree.  With the hiring of Mr. Toomer and his abysmal record it seems that GCC has again settled for less than mediocrity.  It does not make sense why GCC would continue to hire personal relationships of the AD, when the AD has never been associated with a winning program and obviously cannot lead the programs into the winners side of the slate. 

 

To make matters even worse, where in the state of Texas ..  or maybe the entire USA do 2 different coaches, in two different schools, under ONE athletic director VOLUNTARILY resign in consecutive years.  I know probably 100 coaches that would give anything to be a head coach, but because AD's like Mulvaney hire the wrong guys, these other people never get a chance, and then get slapped in the face when those who do get the chance just walk away.

Proven Loser

[90yshallow]

Coaches with winning records already have jobs at this point in the year.  Their coach left late...sometimes you have to play the hand that you're dealt.  It's not as if Sterling has ever been a powerhouse anyway.  Nick Saban couldn't win at that place.

[PlayActionPass]

27 minutes ago, 90yshallow said:

Coaches with winning records already have jobs at this point in the year.  Their coach left late...sometimes you have to play the hand that you're dealt.  It's not as if Sterling has ever been a powerhouse anyway.  Nick Saban couldn't win at that place.

That's why you hire Coordinators with a vision and a plan.

[Alpha Wolf]

12 minutes ago, PlayActionPass said:

That's why you hire Coordinators with a vision and a plan.

and that are hungry, looking for that 1st chance to be a HC, to prove everyone wrong that passed on them.

[PlayActionPass]

5 minutes ago, Alpha Wolf said:

and that are hungry, looking for that 1st chance to be a HC, to prove everyone wrong that passed on them.

Places like Sterling are the perfect place for that too.

[90yshallow]

I agree with you but a lot of these admins want to check off boxes and hire some who won't make waves.

[PlayActionPass]

7 minutes ago, 90yshallow said:

I agree with you but a lot of these admins want to check off boxes and hire some who won't make waves.

Hence, proven losers.

[RidinTheRange]

1 hour ago, PlayActionPass said:

That's why you hire Coordinators with a vision and a plan.

Weren't "retread, proven loser" coaches that have been hired successful coordinators at one time?  Just because they got HC jobs where the gene pool is far inferior, or there is no structure to the JHs from a district standpoint, or the district gave less athletic time during the day because they lock kids up in double blocked Math/ English classes doesn't make them bad coaches.  They won big when they were coordinators with athletes, just like the guys your asking to hire, and they have experience running a program on top of that.  This is why they get hired.

 

You can't win without comparable numbers and some athletes... flat out.  Now, I've seen some guys that have been in places with athletes and all the advantages stated above screw it up.... Those are the coaches that don't get hired again!

[justthefax]

19 hours ago, RidinTheRange said:

Weren't "retread, proven loser" coaches that have been hired successful coordinators at one time?  Just because they got HC jobs where the gene pool is far inferior, or there is no structure to the JHs from a district standpoint, or the district gave less athletic time during the day because they lock kids up in double blocked Math/ English classes doesn't make them bad coaches.  They won big when they were coordinators with athletes, just like the guys your asking to hire, and they have experience running a program on top of that.  This is why they get hired.

 

You can't win without comparable numbers and some athletes... flat out.  Now, I've seen some guys that have been in places with athletes and all the advantages stated above screw it up.... Those are the coaches that don't get hired again!

Strong point Range.  However, you fail to think of one very strong point, which was mentioned earlier.  Most guys that get hired as HC, were hired because they knew someone, regardless of whether or not they were successful coordinators.  Having lived in the north Houston area for several years you will never be able to tell me that Aldine Nimitz does not have some talented kids.  The districts they have [played in over the past 10 years or so were not very strong and a coach that could relate to the kids and had a plan could be successful there.  You will not find that kind of athlete at Sterling.  So if he cannot win with really good athletes, how can he win without them?

After doing a little more research, I have been told this job was not even posted to the typical job boards that advertise jobs across the state of Texas.  Doesn't that speak to the idea that they were not looking for a great coach?  Are you going to tell me that a coordinator from Lake Travis would not be interested in making more money and being a head coach?  Or someone from Southlake, Cedar Park, West-Orange or any number of other programs?  I will never believe that argument.

[PlayActionPass]

19 hours ago, RidinTheRange said:

Weren't "retread, proven loser" coaches that have been hired successful coordinators at one time?  Just because they got HC jobs where the gene pool is far inferior, or there is no structure to the JHs from a district standpoint, or the district gave less athletic time during the day because they lock kids up in double blocked Math/ English classes doesn't make them bad coaches.  They won big when they were coordinators with athletes, just like the guys your asking to hire, and they have experience running a program on top of that.  This is why they get hired.

 

You can't win without comparable numbers and some athletes... flat out.  Now, I've seen some guys that have been in places with athletes and all the advantages stated above screw it up.... Those are the coaches that don't get hired again!

I guess I will copy and paste my response in this thread too, so maybe if you read it twice you might get it.

Yes, they were and if they have proven over various (more than ONE) stops that they don't have the ability to be HEAD COACHES and win some dang games then stop hiring them. Some guys are NOT head coach material. They may be good X and O guys, but there is more to being a head coach than offense or defense.

It is the JOB of the head coach to organize the entire program. If he cant hire coaches to get the Junior High program running smoothly then he probably doesn't need to be a head coach. If the gene pool is so bad then he probably shouldn't have taken the job in the first place. Locking kids up in double block English/Math classes has absolutely ZERO impact on what you do after school. Per the UIL, everybody in the state is allotted 45 minutes during the school day and 8 hours a week to practice after school with 90 minutes of full contact allowed.

Stop making excuses and get the job done, as a friend of mine likes to say, Just Win Baby!!

[RidinTheRange]

1 hour ago, PlayActionPass said:

I guess I will copy and paste my response in this thread too, so maybe if you read it twice you might get it.

Yes, they were and if they have proven over various (more than ONE) stops that they don't have the ability to be HEAD COACHES and win some dang games then stop hiring them. Some guys are NOT head coach material. They may be good X and O guys, but there is more to being a head coach than offense or defense.

It is the JOB of the head coach to organize the entire program. If he cant hire coaches to get the Junior High program running smoothly then he probably doesn't need to be a head coach. If the gene pool is so bad then he probably shouldn't have taken the job in the first place. Locking kids up in double block English/Math classes has absolutely ZERO impact on what you do after school. Per the UIL, everybody in the state is allotted 45 minutes during the school day and 8 hours a week to practice after school with 90 minutes of full contact allowed.

Stop making excuses and get the job done, as a friend of mine likes to say, Just Win Baby!!

What if you take a job and it’s the middle school Principal’s job to hire the JH coaches, and they don’t allow the HC to hire them because they think you’ll just “pillage them to the HS” when they’re ready, even further to add to the problem thy mix those athletics classes with PE kids to make the numbers work. This actually happens in the school business because of limited resources. Districts fault, not the HC. When your school is filled with a community of parents that don’t push their kids to come after school, the HC can make headway, but at some point you have to start setting a standard and that means getting rid of kids for not buying in. Guess what happens these days, they move to another school and give some BS sob story and become eligible by the DEC, or even easier they're raised poorly so they just quit... much easier option. There is a reason it’s the same schools making deep runs every year: favorable demographics, supportive families and communities, and districts committed to giving the program the resources to win. 90% of coaches that get jobs with those things available will win. Those jobs are rarer than you think. That’s the business of HS athletics. I appreciate your input, but you really don’t know how it works at all because you’ve obviously never been in it, but what do I know I’m just an old retired guy that never got a shot. Maybe I should agree with you!

[PlayActionPass]

10 minutes ago, RidinTheRange said:

What if you take a job and it’s the middle school Principal’s job to hire the JH coaches, and they don’t allow the HC to hire them because they think you’ll just “pillage them to the HS” when they’re ready. This actually happens! Districts fault, not the HC. When your school is filled with a community of parents that don’t push their kids to come after school, the HC can make headway, but at some point you have to start setting a standard and that means getting rid of kids for not buying. Guess what happens these days, they move to another school and give some BS sob story and become eligible by the DEC. There is a reason it’s the same schools making deep runs every year: favorable demographics, supportive families and communities, and districts committted to giving the program the resources to win. 90% of coaches that get jobs with those things available will win. Those jobs are rarer than you think. That’s the business of HS athletics. I appreciate your input, but you really don’t know how it works at all because you’ve obviously never been in it, but what do I know I’m just an old retired guy that never got a shot. Maybe I should agree with you!

Sounds to me like the Head Coach should have done his due diligence and not applied for those jobs.

I've been in enough places to know how the good ones work and how the bad ones work, and everywhere I have ever been the Head Football Coach had some input into who was hired at the JH, but you are right whn you say some places don't do what it takes to win, and probably never will. My response is don't apply for and don't take those jobs.

My point in this whole argument is why are Proven Losers continually getting hired for jobs? When they have proven they are going to lose regardless of the circumstances. Look at the most recent hires at some average schools who have hired Proven Losers. Why did those coaches get a shot and not a coordinator or former head coaches with an above .500 winning percentage?  

[RidinTheRange]

11 minutes ago, PlayActionPass said:

Sounds to me like the Head Coach should have done his due diligence and not applied for those jobs.

I've been in enough places to know how the good ones work and how the bad ones work, and everywhere I have ever been the Head Football Coach had some input into who was hired at the JH, but you are right whn you say some places don't do what it takes to win, and probably never will. My response is don't apply for and don't take those jobs.

My point in this whole argument is why are Proven Losers continually getting hired for jobs? When they have proven they are going to lose regardless of the circumstances. Look at the most recent hires at some average schools who have hired Proven Losers. Why did those coaches get a shot and not a coordinator or former head coaches with an above .500 winning percentage?  

You're correct, but you don't really know all that until you do it.  Like you stated,HC jobs are so hard to come by even the bad ones are hard to pass up

 

Copy and paste... work harder not smarter, when the response applies in two different posts.  It would be foolish to re-type the exact same response.

[PlayActionPass]

5 minutes ago, RidinTheRange said:

You're correct, but you don't really know all that until you do it.  Like you stated,HC jobs are so hard to come by even the bad ones are hard to pass up

Agreed, they are hared to pass up. And I can forgive one such abysmal job on a coaches record, but two or three or God forbid four? At some point losing becomes a trend that is the fault of the Head man. And why these guys keep getting chances is what I can't understand and NOBODY can explain to me. 

[RidinTheRange]

4 minutes ago, PlayActionPass said:

Agreed, they are hared to pass up. And I can forgive one such abysmal job on a coaches record, but two or three or God forbid four? At some point losing becomes a trend that is the fault of the Head man. And why these guys keep getting chances is what I can't understand and NOBODY can explain to me. 

I can agree with this, and the guy that keeps taking those jobs seems to be a glutton for punishment when he knows what it is about.  I don't think Coach Toomer applies to this description though.  He did about what everyone else did before and after at the schools where he has been the HC.  He beat some of the other Aldine schools, and he lost to the Spring schools.  Royal is typically pretty bad, unless they have Brandon Williams in the backfield.

 

 

[PlayActionPass]

Robert Toomer - next HFC at Baytown Sterling

Aldine Nimitz

2009   4-6

2010   2-8

2011   4-7

2012   7-4

2013   4-7

2014   2-8

Brookshire-Royal

2017   1-9

Why did this guy get the job?

[RidinTheRange]

I really have no clue to the specifics of the interview process, other candidates, and the ultimate decision of hiring him.  I can say this... he probably had more or similar HC experience than the other candidateswhich allows him to better answer questions about the process having already been through it first hand, a really good record as a coordinator, and he was able to sell him self as a leader and motivator to the interviewing committee.

[PlayActionPass]

And when you look at those records i have to question his scheduling ability.

With the Humble's of the world and a few other schools that would have happily played and lost to Nimitz, I'm not sure why the records are not better than they are.

[PlayActionPass]

Sometimes the difference in 4-6 and 6-4 are a couple of games against the "Weak Sisters of the Poor" and "The School for the Blind and the Deaf."

When your pretty sure you are going to be one and done in the playoffs, you should probably schedule some on those in Non-District to pad that record and make yourself a viable candidate for a better job. JMO, because we all know there are only two kids of coaches. Those that have been fired and those that will be fired. As a HC, you better win as many games as you can, regardless of who they are against. 

[RidinTheRange]

9 minutes ago, PlayActionPass said:

And when you look at those records i have to question his scheduling ability.

With the Humble's of the world and a few other schools that would have happily played and lost to Nimitz, I'm not sure why the records are not better than they are.

I agree... judge a HC on his non-district schedule that will give you a better tell about his W-L record with very similar opponents, unless he was in a situation where he was forced to play non-district games by his administration, or past rivalries, etc...

[Peppermint Patty]

1 hour ago, PlayActionPass said:

Robert Toomer - next HFC at Baytown Sterling

Aldine Nimitz

2009   4-6

2010   2-8

2011   4-7

2012   7-4

2013   4-7

2014   2-8

Brookshire-Royal

2017   1-9

Why did this guy get the job?

2011, 2012, 2013, and 2017 were all playoff appearances. Take that as you will, but in this day and age it's better than the alternative.

[oldschool2]

Is everyone assuming that there was just a large pool of choices for this job?  Coaches that are proven winners would never consider a job like this unless it’s literally the dead end of their career and money was the only driving force.

Amd for the record I’d bet that the OC at Austin Lake Travis would rather stay than become a HC at Sterling...lol.  Hopefully that was a joke.

[90yshallow]

7 minutes ago, oldschool2 said:

Is everyone assuming that there was just a large pool of choices for this job?  Coaches that are proven winners would never consider a job like this unless it’s literally the dead end of their career and money was the only driving force.

Amd for the record I’d bet that the OC at Austin Lake Travis would rather stay than become a HC at Sterling...lol.  Hopefully that was a joke.

Herman Boone could come in there and turn that place around in one season.

[PlayActionPass]

22 minutes ago, oldschool2 said:

Is everyone assuming that there was just a large pool of choices for this job?  Coaches that are proven winners would never consider a job like this unless it’s literally the dead end of their career and money was the only driving force.

Amd for the record I’d bet that the OC at Austin Lake Travis would rather stay than become a HC at Sterling...lol.  Hopefully that was a joke.

The list of applicants two years ago was pretty impressive, i think. I know it was posted on here. 

Can anyone re-post it?

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Applicants from Baytown Sun

Sheldon Bennight, varsity assistant — North Shore

Kirk Botkin, defensive coordinator — DeKaney

Gerald Cole, varsity assistant — Pasadena Memorial 

James Crocker, defensive coordinator — Friendswood

Tyler Crow, varsity assistant football — Plano West

JD Jordan, varsity assistant football — Deer Park

Jordan Curtin, teacher — Baines Middle School, HISD

John Eder, coach — Winston Salem State University

Damien Judge, head football coach — Madison

Derek Lewis, varsity assistant coach — Aldine Davis

Ricky Lock, head coach/AD — S.A. Southside ISD

Beck Neal, offensive coordinator — LaPorte

Jeff Nelson, former head coach — Beaumont Central

Thomas Peacock, former head coach — Venice HS, Florida

Patrick Robinson, offensive coordinator — Channelview

Joncody Roelof, recruiting analyst — UCLA

Randy Rowe, athletic director — Midland ISD

Jason Speight, head coach/AD — Anahuac

Robert Toomer, head coach/AD — Royal ISD

Eric Thompson, offensive coordinator — HISD Austin

Chuck Vincent, defensive coordinator — SA Southside, ISD

Lydell Wilson, former head coach — Katy Seven Lakes

Mark Crooms, defensive coordinator — Dickinson

Walter Fortune, varsity assistant football — Sterling

Daniel Fitzmorris, varsity assistant football — Sterling

Gary Brewton, assistant junior high coach — Horace Mann Junior High