Nederland Students Denied Their Diplomas

[tvc184]

Should Nederland change the rules? Sure, that’s OK. Maybe they could just recognize them by having them stand or mention it as they’re walking up to get their diploma.

However....

In several threads about this topic in different forums, including Facebook, there were mentions of lawsuits. I don’t think there are any grounds to force a school district to have a mandatory policy to allow future members of the military for example, to wear a different recognitions. There might be a double edged sword in the change of policy or a lawsuit to try to sue however. As long as no one complains everything will be OK. The allowing of certain recognitions outside of school functions could bring problems though.

Due to my interest and my job I have read many lawsuits over the years from both state and federal courts. I am talking about cases that went on to appeal all the way up to the US Supreme Court, the federal circuit courts or of the state appeals courts.  The problem arises from discrimination such as under the 1st Amendment and the 14th Amendment under “equal protection”. 

Here could be the potential problem. If the members of the military are a certified school function such as a junior ROTC then I do not think it will be an issue. If it is something they did outside of the school, it could cause issues if someone wishes to sue. This case a question brings up exactly that point because apparently one kid got the same punishment for wearing a Mexican flag the same way the military guys wore the sashes. At that point you get into freedom of expression issues and when you do, you cannot limit or in most cases cannot limit one person’s right  over the other. There can be limits for threats or some vulgar language, etc. from what I have seen. If a person says I wish to show my future in the military that has nothing to do with the school, can you then deny a person to say, I wish to show which country I came from or which political party I support? 

An easy example would be if a school district said you could wear a vote Democrat button to graduation but could not wear a vote Republican button (equal protection). That would be an obvious discrimination. There are in federal laws in place to ban discrimination due to sex, race, national origin, ethnicity, religion of age. If the same rules apply across-the-board, it is usually not discrimination. It is like the current issue with the masks and a private business. A private business has the right to set whatever rule they want to as long as the rule does not discriminate. It is OK to say everyone must wear a mask however they cannot say Muslims must wear a mask or people with weaves in their hair must wear one.

I was reading a case from California that went to a federal Court on appeal. A woman firefighter complained that a male firefighter in her unit was reading some kind of sexually oriented magazine like Playboy. He was not showing the pictures or that anyone could see and was merely reading it in his bunk. There was no claim of him making noises or any kind of lewd comments that would create a hostile work environment. It just offended the woman firefighter that she knew what he was reading. The fire department had a policy that when the firefighter’s duties for the day has been done, he/she could read non-work related material. I know that my Police Department generally bans reading for entertainment purposes and restricts reading to duty reading related. Firefighters have a somewhat different job where they might be on duty for 24 or 48 hours and have in many cases less restrictions.

So the fire department (I think LA or San Diego) told the male firefighter do not read the girly magazines. Poof!! Here comes the lawsuit. The male firefighter won his case. He was being discriminated against due to his sex and the government/fire department was improperly restricting what could be read. If I remember the decision correctly, the department could restrict reading to duty related or they can allow non-duty related but if they did, it had to be open. The fire department did not by policy get to approve what was read if it was not duty related. Can you imagine if the fire department said you can read Christian literature but you cannot read about Judaism? That in a fact is what they did against the male firefighter.

So my question is, if a school district allows the representation of something outside of a school function, can then limit what is allowed? Now if no one complains, they could do anything that they wish. There was a US Supreme Court ruling that says you will not have a prayer over the public address system such as as at a high school football game. We all know there is some school districts that continue to do this against that ruling. Why is that allowed? Because nobody has filed a claim. Once someone does, it will be an easy lawsuit to win, possibly with monetary damages.

I see there are claims that Lumberton and others allow such representation for a non-school function or opinion (the military sash example).  If someone wishes to file a lawsuit, and I can guarantee somewhere someone will, what will be the outcome?

[tvc184]

And what just popped up on Facebook on the KBMT website?

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A student in North Carolina was not given his diploma for wearing a Mexican flag.

Get ready for it. If you start exempting one person, you are going to have to exempt everyone. Will there be students wearing LBGTQ flags? Support Antifa buttons? Down with Israel banners?  MAGA caps? 

[SmashMouth]

5 hours ago, tvc184 said:

They get their diplomas, they were earned. They simply don’t give them the piece of paper that night but hold it for a few days in kind of a, “we told you so”. It is a punishment of inconvenience. 

Yep. A stupid one. 

[tvc184]

3 hours ago, SmashMouth said:

Yep. A stupid one. 

If they make rules, and the two kids in question signed contract saying that they would not do what they did, and they do not punish them, then what? To school rules become voluntary?

How many comments do we see on here where people say, we need to hold people, students, whoever accountable?

If this was anything other than the military, some of the same people protesting would be up in arms with the opposite opinion. Being in the military does not give you a pass or earn special privileges. Actually it should be quite the opposite.

[thetragichippy]

17 hours ago, tvc184 said:

I see there are claims that Lumberton and others allow such representation for a non-school function or opinion (the military sash example).  If someone wishes to file a lawsuit, and I can guarantee somewhere someone will, what will be the outcome?

My Son went to Evadale, which was a great decision, I love a small school and the individual attention he got. My point though, is Evadale said prayers at just about every function they had. I believe it is very common in the small schools. Trent's football team always made it past district, with one year getting close to State......The prayer was recited every game, and individual teams prayed on the field.  I will say in the four years Trent attended, I think their was one fight.......

[SmashMouth]

8 minutes ago, thetragichippy said:

My Son went to Evadale, which was a great decision, I love a small school and the individual attention he got. My point though, is Evadale said prayers at just about every function they had. I believe it is very common in the small schools. Trent's football team always made it past district, with one year getting close to State......The prayer was recited every game, and individual teams prayed on the field.  I will say in the four years Trent attended, I think their was one fight.......

Amen. They have America flags and Thin Blue Line flags and prayers at Lumberton football games. They said a prayer at graduation. 3 kids had military sashes and were asked to stand during and be recognized at graduation. I am aware that leaves them open to lawsuits. I’m just glad they do it anyway (for now at least). 

[Hagar]

I certainly don’t see a lawsuit, and I get the “follow the rules”.  I just hope Nederland changes it to allow the Military Sash.  If they don’t, don’t let your kid wear one.  Based on what’s going on in America today, you have to be strict with rules are it’ll get way out of hand.

[SmashMouth]

11 hours ago, Hagar said:

I certainly don’t see a lawsuit, and I get the “follow the rules”.  I just hope Nederland changes it to allow the Military Sash.  If they don’t, don’t let your kid wear one.  Based on what’s going on in America today, you have to be strict with rules are it’ll get way out of hand.

I would guide my son to follow the rules too. I’m just glad that some districts (Lumberton, for one) make common sense allowances.