West Orange Stark job open/HICKMAN APPROVED

[Reagan]

7 minutes ago, wo-s#1 said:

It’s like you got WOS blinders on…all the way from Silsbee lol.Really though Hick has the support and everyone loves him but he’s not ready to take over WOS,Toby won’t miss a beat and that’s the difference imo!

Won't miss a losing beat?!  Why would you wish that on WOS?!   9 years as a HC and has a losing record.  Remember -- facts don't care about your feelings!

[wo-s#1]

Just now, Reagan said:

Won't miss a losing beat?!  LOL!  9 years and has a losing record.  Remember -- facts don't care about your feelings!

Ok I’ll reword it,a beat at WOS…as stated several times in this thread the community wants him and that’s half the battle 

[ladybug33]

5 minutes ago, wo-s#1 said:

You typed it wrong or I’m reading it wrong but it looks like you’re at least somewhat agreeing with what I’ve been saying…It’s the truth too,I’ve seen people jump to LCM for a long time and for worse reasons!

No #1 I've just been talking and listening to family and friends. They want Coach Foreman. A lot of them do. It does not work out for some (player) who go to other schools because they are un-happy at WOS though.

[ladybug33]

16 minutes ago, Reagan said:

If n one has seen the list then we can't be sure these are the most qualified applicants.  If the list is not made available, then there is a strong possibility that agendas could be involved.  Not picking on WOS.  It happens everywhere!

Ok Reagan!

[One4All]

No matter how you spin it coaching will always be about helping young people. Help develop them as people not just athletes. 

I know what Tobe did at WOS under Hooks/CT . I also know what Hickman did under CT,  THERE is a BIG difference between the two 

[wo-s#1]

16 minutes ago, One4All said:

No matter how you spin it coaching will always be about helping young people. Help develop them as people not just athletes. 

I know what Tobe did at WOS under Hooks/CT . I also know what Hickman did under CT,  THERE is a BIG difference between the two 

Yelp

[WOSdrummer99]

36 minutes ago, One4All said:

No matter how you spin it coaching will always be about helping young people. Help develop them as people not just athletes. 

I know what Tobe did at WOS under Hooks/CT . I also know what Hickman did under CT,  THERE is a BIG difference between the two 

One was busy winning championships in track. And getting kids to Texas, Oklahoma, TT, A&M, and probably more that I'm forgetting.

What does Hickman do when not on the field... assistant principal?

[WOS1986]

I agreed with you, WOSdrummer99.

It is big difference. 

Assistant principal will not have time to spend on the field since will have big responsibilities at school with kids while real one such as Toby will more focus on athletes kids. Bond will be factor as well.

Therefore, Toby would be best choice. Record mean nothing because he know WOS program.

[ladybug33]

1 hour ago, WOSdrummer99 said:

One was busy winning championships in track. And getting kids to Texas, Oklahoma, TT, A&M, and probably more that I'm forgetting.

What does Hickman do when not on the field... assistant principal?

To be fair wasn't he on the team the last few times we won state?

[Reagan]

45 minutes ago, WOS1986 said:

I agreed with you, WOSdrummer99.

It is big difference. 

Assistant principal will not have time to spend on the field since will have big responsibilities at school with kids while real one such as Toby will more focus on athletes kids. Bond will be factor as well.

Therefore, Toby would be best choice. Record mean nothing because he know WOS program.

I hope for WOS' sake that whoever is making the hiring decision doesn't have this same feeling!  

[WOSdrummer99]

1 hour ago, ladybug33 said:

To be fair wasn't he on the team the last few times we won state?

Not sure, but so was everyone else. Toby has been on the sideline for every WOS state final appearance. Even back in the 80s as a ball boy. We always thought he was lucky to be a coaches son. Now this time should be his chance. There was no doubt why he called the last playoff games with Gary Stelly.

[wo-s#1]

6 hours ago, ladybug33 said:

To be fair wasn't he on the team the last few times we won state?

Pretty sure he has at least one 

[underdog15]

18 hours ago, WOSdrummer99 said:

One was busy winning championships in track. And getting kids to Texas, Oklahoma, TT, A&M, and probably more that I'm forgetting.

What does Hickman do when not on the field... assistant principal?

Come on Track lol REALLY 

 

WOS culture is built and inherited regardless of what comes Toby has been and Head and away from WOS so you learn new stuff and new ways so regardless of some think your not getting a 2012 version your getting a 2022 version. 

Hickman is in the program and has yet to sit in that HC seat so it’s a lot of questions behind but regardless who they hire LCM will benefit for sure 

 

[BEARCPA]

19 minutes ago, underdog15 said:

Come on Track lol REALLY 

 

WOS culture is built and inherited regardless of what comes Toby has been and Head and away from WOS so you learn new stuff and new ways so regardless of some think your not getting a 2012 version your getting a 2022 version. 

Hickman is in the program and has yet to sit in that HC seat so it’s a lot of questions behind but regardless who they hire LCM will benefit for sure 

 

I just don't buy the line that WOS' best athletes will flock to LCM if Toby isn't hired. Sure, WOS kids have transferred to LCM for various reasons for as long as I can remember, but its usually just marginal talent that couldn't cut it at WOS. I've lived in LC most of my life, but have had numerous friends and family members graduate from WOS, and there is WAY too much pride in the WOS football program for it to crumble like a lot of people are predicting if Hickman is hired . FYI I think Toby is the no-brainer choice for the program moving forward. 

[WOSdrummer99]

52 minutes ago, underdog15 said:

Come on Track lol REALLY 

 

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2008-2009 3A West Orange-Stark

2009-2010 3A West Orange-Stark

2010-2011 3A West Orange-Stark

[Mr. Thornton Melon]

On 1/4/2022 at 8:57 AM, dj said:

I'm with you!! I think Matthew is one of the most underrated coaches anywhere.he gets the most out of his players.and he keeps those kids focused.and they don't fear anyone.he gets the most out his players.there isn't many coaches in setx better than him

 

Isn't that just another way of saying the  players suck ? You are saying sub .500 is the best they are capable of doing

[Mr. Thornton Melon]

Can anyone give me a count on Hickman yard signs in or  around Orange ?

[ladybug33]

19 hours ago, WOSdrummer99 said:

Not sure, but so was everyone else. Toby has been on the sideline for every WOS state final appearance. Even back in the 80s as a ball boy. We always thought he was lucky to be a coaches son. Now this time should be his chance. There was no doubt why he called the last playoff games with Gary Stelly.

I repeat hire them both, no one coach will be able to match C.T. productivity anyways.

[dj]

1 hour ago, Mr. Thornton Melon said:

Can anyone give me a count on Hickman yard signs in or  around Orange ?

None !!

[WOSdrummer99]

3 hours ago, ladybug33 said:

I repeat hire them both, no one coach will be able to match C.T. productivity anyways.

One is already there. I wonder who TF has as a LB coach?

[Reagan]

22 hours ago, WOSdrummer99 said:

Not sure, but so was everyone else. Toby has been on the sideline for every WOS state final appearance. Even back in the 80s as a ball boy. We always thought he was lucky to be a coaches son. Now this time should be his chance. There was no doubt why he called the last playoff games with Gary Stelly.

One has to wonder though:  If Foreman did indeed apply and would accept if offered, that would be dropping down 2 classifications.  That's pretty well admitting he can't hang with the big dogs!  One CANNOT run from their record:  42 - 52!  No District Championships and no State Championships!  A word to the wise:  Caveat Emptor!   

[Separation Scientist]

I don't know him, and I don't have a dog in the hunt, but after reading through all this there seems to be a distinct familiarity bias at work here. 

What WOS, and all others in this situation should do is ask themselves "If this candidate was a total outsider, and not a homer or somebody with connections, would we still hire him?"

Maybe this guy is the best out there, I have no idea, but I would think it through. If he really is the guy, by all means proceed!   

   

[WOSdrummer99]

1 hour ago, Reagan said:

One has to wonder though:  If Foreman did indeed apply and would accept if offered, that would be dropping down 2 classifications.  That's pretty well admitting he can't hang with the big dogs!  One CANNOT run from their record:  42 - 52!  No District Championships and no State Championships!  A word to the wise:  Caveat Emptor!   

So if PNG's coach dropped down to Newton, you'd expect no change? Or would he be able to win, with more talent in a smaller division?

[WOSdrummer99]

8 minutes ago, Separation Scientist said:

I don't know him, and I don't have a dog in the hunt, but after reading through all this there seems to be a distinct familiarity bias at work here. 

What WOS, and all others in this situation should do is ask themselves "If this candidate was a total outsider, and not a homer or somebody with connections, would we still hire him?"

Maybe this guy is the best out there, I have no idea, but I would think it through. If he really is the guy, by all means proceed!   

   

I said with my 1st post on this topic, page 3, I think. That this should be the premiere job opening in the state this off season. But from the list of known candidates, it appears to be an inside job. And out of those 2, one has never been in the position before.

To answer you're question... No, and I doubt he would even be interested if this wasn't his Alma mater.

Why aren't more winning coaches from across the state being considered? The other 2 I heard about were combined 23-47 record.

[marshman]

Not sure I’m understanding all the talk about Tobys overall HC record. Let’s not forget he took over a horrible 0-10 Shoemaker team, so a good number of those losses was getting that program going in a different direction. I don’t think anywhere he’s been has the same consistent talent that comes through WOS.  Also Some coaches just fit in better in some areas than others. Happens at all levels