Hamshire-Fannett 60 Hardin-Jefferson 70/FINAL

[catfever]

Silsbee is not in HF or HJ district.

[Who That]

39 minutes ago, Hooohead.com said:

So is Silsbee in the district with Both?...Cause if so i will be in Silsbee Monday to watch the Silsbee vs HJ game. 

Nope..🐅🏀

[Cardinal 1]

51 minutes ago, Hooohead.com said:

So is Silsbee in the district with Both?...Cause if so i will be in Silsbee Monday to watch the Silsbee vs HJ game. 

No Silsbee is in the other 4A district.

[whsalum]

23 hours ago, Cardinal 1 said:

Two staters went 8/25 total with 10 TOs while your other two went 11/20 total with 2 TOs and one of them had a bad shooting night from 3 and still had a 47% FG. You ride the mismatches in games and put the ball in the hands of your high percentage shooters. It may change from game to game, but not when you have a stud. They are always the mismatch that others must play off of them. HJ had Sears which opened up things for Davis and Malbrough, HF is trying to give everyone an equal opportunity which keeps back firing in tough or close games. But at the sametime you have to have players who want to win no matter what and who scores. Knowing your role which is based on your abilities and skills is a big problem for teams with a lot of talent. Everyone can't be "the man" or "the guy". You simply have to do what you do best that helps the team win. Ardoin #23 is my kid and that's why he can put up 20pts as well as numbers in every statistical category every game, because he does whatever the coach ask him to do at any given time during the game. When told to take over, he does. The freedom to simply do so was taken from him after some players and parents complained when he was dropping 25-30pts in games and responsible for them winning. Last year Rideaux didn't care who got mad, he played the best players that fit that game and ran the offense through the mismatches. If it was one player, that player got the ball every single offensive possession and the others played off them. A lot of parents didn't like him for that and he didn't care one bit. He won games period!

I think we watched two different games lol 

[Cardinal 1]

1 hour ago, whsalum said:

I think we watched two different games lol 

No you're just watching it as a fan and not a coach and can only see the game once 🤷🏾‍♂️.  Not sure what I said that you feel is wrong. Analytics are real numbers based on film not opinion. Based on this thread and others I can see why the transfer portal in college basketball went into the thousands 🤣. Opinions vs analytics, the numbers will always win in the end and tell the truth. 

[bullets13]

1 hour ago, Cardinal 1 said:

No you're just watching it as a fan and not a coach and can only see the game once 🤷🏾‍♂️.  Not sure what I said that you feel is wrong. Analytics are real numbers based on film not opinion. Based on this thread and others I can see why the transfer portal in college basketball went into the thousands 🤣. Opinions vs analytics, the numbers will always win in the end and tell the truth. 

Could also be that to some degree you’re watching it as a dad more than a coach.  

[5GallonBucket]

On 12/17/2021 at 9:48 PM, Jerry West said:

@Cardinal 1 it was a great game and I’m not sure who’s HF’s best player is.  Watching you guys against Nederland and now HJ, I think #2 and #23 are two of the top but tonight I thought #2 was the best player for HF.  
 

I noticed #23 didn’t seem to touch the ball much in the last 5 minutes.  Also didn’t think he helped himself out on the defensive end by defending,  seems like he just wants to play offense.  #2 played both sides of the ball.  So when looking at the game we must remember to be the best player you have to play both defense and offense.  

Again both teams looked good but HJ handled the 4th quarter when they needed.  My two cents, I’m a basketball connoisseur and old retired basketball coach, not as good as the two I saw coach tonight.

 

I ll 2nd that 2nd paragraph. Didn’t see the hj game but I did see the game against humble.

I was told to watch #23 ……Lazy defense especially in rotation and took some ill advised shots down the stretch against humble.  Body language didn’t seem right….didn’t seem in sync. Didn’t play the last 5 min of regulation but played in OT…which I found odd. 

maybe he just had a bad game🤷‍♂️…it happens

#2 was the only one that really stood out to me….especially his effort on both ends of the court

 

 

[whsalum]

3 hours ago, Cardinal 1 said:

No you're just watching it as a fan and not a coach and can only see the game once 🤷🏾‍♂️.  Not sure what I said that you feel is wrong. Analytics are real numbers based on film not opinion. Based on this thread and others I can see why the transfer portal in college basketball went into the thousands 🤣. Opinions vs analytics, the numbers will always win in the end and tell the truth. 

I’ll be the first to admit I’m watching as a fan. I’ll also agree you’re watching as a dad. # 23 has a ton of potential, especially on the offensive end. What I saw the other night was a player with very little big game experience that wasn’t quite sure how to step up in the moment. Defensively I wasn’t impressed with HF. I still stick by my pre season prediction. I think HJ is clearly the best club in the district. Once again we probably aren’t going to agree on any of this and that’s ok. That’s what these threads are for.

[Cardinal 1]

1 hour ago, 5GallonBucket said:

I ll 2nd that 2nd paragraph. Didn’t see the hj game but I did see the game against humble.

I was told to watch #23 ……Lazy defense especially in rotation and took some ill advised shots down the stretch against humble.  Body language didn’t seem right….didn’t seem in sync. Didn’t play the last 5 min of regulation but played in OT…which I found odd. 

maybe he just had a bad game🤷‍♂️…it happens

#2 was the only one that really stood out to me….especially his effort on both ends of the court

 

 

He didn't play the last 5 mins of the 3rd or the entire 4th quarter and didn't enter the game until middle of the OT, which is why they lost. The coach apologized for it and said it was on himself, he got caught up in the game and forgot to sub. Not sure what you mean by ill advise shots down the stretch as he wasn't in the game at all. As far as defense goes, his job and #5 are to protect the paint and backside help unless they are guarding an actual guard. It's not lazy defense, its help defense as they only time they guard their man fully is if they have ball. The rest of the time they are in help. Anyway he put up 10pts 5rebs 1stl and 1blk playing just half the game. You are correct in he had a bad shooting game going 0-4 from 3. He was tied for second leading scorer and second in rebounding only playing HALF THE GAME. The leading scorer only had 13pts. So what you're saying doesn't match the numbers as the player you said stood out to you had 9 TOs and just 10pts in over 30mins of play (he had a bad game because #23 was on the bench and is the other primary ball handler). Numbers don't lie, but apparently folks eyes do a whole lot.

[Cardinal 1]

1 hour ago, whsalum said:

I’ll be the first to admit I’m watching as a fan. I’ll also agree you’re watching as a dad. # 23 has a ton of potential, especially on the offensive end. What I saw the other night was a player with very little big game experience that wasn’t quite sure how to step up in the moment. Defensively I wasn’t impressed with HF. I still stick by my pre season prediction. I think HJ is clearly the best club in the district. Once again we probably aren’t going to agree on any of this and that’s ok. That’s what these threads are for.

You can't step up if you dont have the ball down the stretch and he scored the majority of their points in the second half. Nothing you can do when your teammates are jacking up shots outside of the offensive rotation and not moving the ball to the mismatches. Anyway he went 7/15 scoring 21pts 8rebs 2blks 1stl. The next two leading scorers went 4/12 and the other 4/11 with a combined 10 TOs and 9 total rebs. #5 Denson was the mismatch for us and only got 5 shots going 4/5. He was supposed to get the ball more down low and certainly down the stretch, but didn't. He needed at least 10 touches in this game in the post, but guys failed to follow the plan. Sears scored 24pts, Davis 21pts, and Malbrough 14pts and a big 10 rebs for HJ. #10 for HJ grab 10 rebs as well. I don't speak as a "dad" but as a 100% varsity coach who has been to 4 straight state tournaments and 2 state championships in his division. You are correct about one thing. HJ had the better overall team Friday night as the analytics shows it. They out rebounded HF by double digits and any coach worth his salt will tell you, control the boards and you win the game 9 out of 10 times guaranteed 

[Hooohead.com]

16 minutes ago, Cardinal 1 said:

He didn't play the last 5 mins of the 3rd or the entire 4th quarter and didn't enter the game until middle of the OT, which is why they lost. The coach apologized for it and said it was on himself, he got caught up in the game and forgot to sub. Not sure what you mean by ill advise shots down the stretch as he wasn't in the game at all. As far as defense goes, his job and #5 are to protect the paint and backside help unless they are guarding an actual guard. It's not lazy defense, its help defense as they only time they guard their man fully is if they have ball. The rest of the time they are in help. Anyway he put up 10pts 5rebs 1stl and 1blk playing just half the game. You are correct in he had a bad shooting game going 0-4 from 3. He was tied for second leading scorer and second in rebounding only playing HALF THE GAME. The leading scorer only had 13pts. So what you're saying doesn't match the numbers as the player you said stood out to you had 9 TOs and just 10pts in over 30mins of play (he had a bad game because #23 was on the bench and is the other primary ball handler). Numbers don't lie, but apparently folks eyes do a whole lot.

Are you serious...As a retired Coach i would Never apologize to a Parent for not subbing there kid. If anyone i would apologize to would be the player. I truly understand the heartfelt passion about how a parent feels about there baby but the day i have to talk down on my kids teammate because of what i think i know than i need leave the talking alone. Parents....your being recruited as well as your kid and the only part about a parent a Coach can see is character because they dont need you to play. I must admit ive seen almost every kid in this area play at one time or another and if i knew all parents could handle constructive criticism i would be honest but since i know some cant i just keep my 2 cents to myself and keep it moving. No matter what makes of this you as person are wrong for criticizing your sons teammate for personal belief cause it merits no personal gain. At the end of the day Coach is gonna play who he believes is gonna get it done and all your gonna do is drive a wedge in your son and his teammate's and with #2 being the primary ball handler he may not get the touches he wants or deserves because of your emotions. Please as a parent of an athlete...Stop..your really not making it easier on your child...In the words of KP...Carry On...

[Cardinal 1]

34 minutes ago, Hooohead.com said:

Are you serious...As a retired Coach i would Never apologize to a Parent for not subbing there kid. If anyone i would apologize to would be the player. I truly understand the heartfelt passion about how a parent feels about there baby but the day i have to talk down on my kids teammate because of what i think i know than i need leave the talking alone. Parents....your being recruited as well as your kid and the only part about a parent a Coach can see is character because they dont need you to play. I must admit ive seen almost every kid in this area play at one time or another and if i knew all parents could handle constructive criticism i would be honest but since i know some cant i just keep my 2 cents to myself and keep it moving. No matter what makes of this you as person are wrong for criticizing your sons teammate for personal belief cause it merits no personal gain. At the end of the day Coach is gonna play who he believes is gonna get it done and all your gonna do is drive a wedge in your son and his teammate's and with #2 being the primary ball handler he may not get the touches he wants or deserves because of your emotions. Please as a parent of an athlete...Stop..your really not making it easier on your child...In the words of KP...Carry On...

He apologized to his players. What are you talking about? 🤣 He admitted it was on him as any good coach would do. I've done it plenty of times as how can we teach accountability to these kids and not hold ourselves accountable for our mistakes. I didn't criticize anyone, others did, I simply stated statistics that explained losts while giving kudos to HJ kids for controlling the little things and following the game plan by their coach which anyone who really understands the game and how to analyze it unbias does. Our kids didn't at all as a team, follow what their coach laid out. The two kids you're mentioning are good friends and have been playing with each other since 8 years old during the summer and have already discussed the analytics with each other as they do after every game in order the get better. His dad and I have been friends for over 20 years. You can't have a bias mind when reading comments my man. You'll make assumptions that aren't accurate at all. I find it funny you came for me for correcting others assumptions about my kid using actual stats and facts but not them for their assumptions based on their personal opinions 🤔. As if telling spreading rumors about a kids character and play on the court without looking at the analytics which are easy to find on maxpreps is ok. Who are you anyway?

[DXTR]

War and Peace 

[Cardinal 1]

How about folks start practicing speaking facts about the games and players based purely on the analytics and not their own biases or opinions. Would cut out a lot of confusion and kill assumptions. If you don't know the specific numbers of the game, then don't speak specifically about any player other then to compliment. Criticism based on personal opinion and not the numbers is very dangerous and can escalate quickly as we can see in this thread. 

[Hooohead.com]

26 minutes ago, Cardinal 1 said:

He apologized to his players. What are you talking about? 🤣 He admitted it was on him as any good coach would do. I've done it plenty of times as how can we teach accountability to these kids and not hold ourselves accountable for our mistakes. I didn't criticize anyone, others did, I simply stated statistics that explained losts while giving kudos to HJ kids for controlling the little things and following the game plan by their coach which anyone who really understands the game and how to analyze it unbias does. Our kids didn't at all as a team, follow what their coach laid out. The two kids you're mentioning are good friends and have been playing with each other since 8 years old during the summer and have already discussed the analytics with each other as they do after every game in order the get better. His dad and I have been friends for over 20 years. You can't have a bias mind when reading comments my man. You'll make assumptions that aren't accurate at all. I find it funny you came for me for correcting others assumptions about my kid using actual stats and facts but not them for their assumptions based on their personal opinions 🤔. As if telling spreading rumors about a kids character and play on the court without looking at the analytics which are easy to find on maxpreps is ok. Who are you anyway?

I for no means came at you about yours or Analitics or stats...Stats dont show effort or heart and thats something no paper will ever show. And for you asking who i am doesnt matter because i know who i am and i know that your upset about the way things have been going ever since your full team has came back from football. I will tell you this....Not sure of your sons classification but Highschool juniors are whats on deck as far as recruiting goes. Seniors have had there last summer and if not a personal friend of the Coach who may be a college Coach HF will not be visited unless playing against a possible recruit. Enjoy the ride with your son and stop criticizing or get back into Coaching and make a difference. Its funny as well as this thread and im one to keep the blood pumping cause i know every kid at HF as well as HJ....Zebras have opinions 2...

[desethion]

I think this post has gone to far. These are kids/ not professional! Looking at analytics… Give me a shot chart.. so I can figure out if #2,4, 23, 5 took good shots/bad. I think I read 5 should have took at least 10 shots. So analysts please tell me where those shots should have came from. Who shot to many? Who took a bad shot? Who looked 5 off just to get a shot up? Who didn’t feed the post? As a coach I need you to be more specific because I wasn’t at the game but I know y’all will continue to discuss this until the next game. So share some film on here for us that just wants to validate your point or the opposition’s. Like HooHead said earlier college’s recruit parents and the kids. So y’all need to play right because so many kids can be stuck in the middle..because of opinion or stats.

 

just my thoughts Carry on.. I will be at the Silsbee/HJ game..How about y’all?

[Hooohead.com]

1 minute ago, desethion said:

I think this post has done to far. These are kids/ not professional! Looking at analytics… Give me a shot chart.. so I can figure out if #2,4, 23, 5 took good shots/bad. I think I read 5 should have took at least 10 shots. So analysts please tell me where those shots should have came from. Who shot to many? Who took a bad shot? Who looked 5 off just to get a shot up? Who didn’t feed the post? As a coach I need you to be more specific because I wasn’t at the game but I know y’all will continue to discuss this until the next game. So share some film on here for us that just wants to validate your point or the opposition’s. Like HooHead said earlier college’s recruit parents and the kids. So y’all need to play right because so many kids can be stuck in the middle..because of opinion or stats.

 

just my thoughts Carry on.. I will be at the Silsbee/HJ game..How about y’all?

Ill be there evaluating talent to help try and get a kid an opportunity to receive as much help financially towards his education in the near future. Im just a guy whos well respected with an eye for talent and word of honesty towards talent. Theres on an average of 3 to 5 kids whom have an opportunity to attend 1 of the power 7 conferences in Basketball in the Greater Houston area and im truthful as it gets with a College Coach and i dont go on potential or analitics. I Live in the Now era of hoops. Zebras 👀 it all...

[Cardinal 1]

13 minutes ago, Hooohead.com said:

I for no means came at you about yours or Analitics or stats...Stats dont show effort or heart and thats something no paper will ever show. And for you asking who i am doesnt matter because i know who i am and i know that your upset about the way things have been going ever since your full team has came back from football. I will tell you this....Not sure of your sons classification but Highschool juniors are whats on deck as far as recruiting goes. Seniors have had there last summer and if not a personal friend of the Coach who may be a college Coach HF will not be visited unless playing against a possible recruit. Enjoy the ride with your son and stop criticizing or get back into Coaching and make a difference. Its funny as well as this thread and im one to keep the blood pumping cause i know every kid at HF as well as HJ....Zebras have opinions 2...

Again I wasn't CRITICIZING AT ALL. I was correcting the opinions of others with statistics and facts they didn't know. So I take it that's your version of an apology for misunderstanding what I said and going on an unnecessary rant about coaches and parents 🤦🏾‍♂️. As far as HF being visited by a college coach, they already have and will have others.

[whsalum]

13 minutes ago, desethion said:

I think this post has gone to far. These are kids/ not professional! Looking at analytics… Give me a shot chart.. so I can figure out if #2,4, 23, 5 took good shots/bad. I think I read 5 should have took at least 10 shots. So analysts please tell me where those shots should have came from. Who shot to many? Who took a bad shot? Who looked 5 off just to get a shot up? Who didn’t feed the post? As a coach I need you to be more specific because I wasn’t at the game but I know y’all will continue to discuss this until the next game. So share some film on here for us that just wants to validate your point or the opposition’s. Like HooHead said earlier college’s recruit parents and the kids. So y’all need to play right because so many kids can be stuck in the middle..because of opinion or stats.

 

just my thoughts Carry on.. I will be at the Silsbee/HJ game..How about y’all?

I’ll be there to enjoy a basketball game. Something I’ve done for the past 60+ years. I hope it’s a good one. 

[Cardinal 1]

4 minutes ago, Hooohead.com said:

Ill be there evaluating talent to help try and get a kid an opportunity to receive as much help financially towards his education in the near future. Im just a guy whos well respected with an eye for talent and word of honesty towards talent. Theres on an average of 3 to 5 kids whom have an opportunity to attend 1 of the power 7 conferences in Basketball in the Greater Houston area and im truthful as it gets with a College Coach and i dont go on potential or analitics. I Live in the Now era of hoops. Zebras 👀 it all...

I can respect that, but still the same. Don't make assumptions and go off on rants when you didn't fully understand the comment or purpose. Just ask for clarity

[Hooohead.com]

Just now, Cardinal 1 said:

Again I wasn't CRITICIZING AT ALL. I was correcting the opinions of others with statistics and facts they didn't know. So I take it that's your version of an apology for misunderstanding what I said and going on an unnecessary rant about coaches and parents 🤦🏾‍♂️. As far as HF being visited by a college coach, they already have and will have others.

If thats what you take as an apology than Im truly Sorry for ruffling your feathers(Cardinal 1)....The point is: Analitics dont determine whether or not a kid can go. 2 way players keep college coaches with there jobs...Not Analitics 

[Hooohead.com]

8 minutes ago, whsalum said:

I’ll be there to enjoy a basketball game. Something I’ve done for the past 60+ years. I hope it’s a good one. 

Me 2

[Cardinal 1]

Will be a good game, but I got Silsbee

[Cardinal 1]

5 minutes ago, Hooohead.com said:

If thats what you take as an apology than Im truly Sorry for ruffling your feathers(Cardinal 1)....The point is: Analitics dont determine whether or not a kid can go. 2 way players keep college coaches with there jobs...Not Analitics 

Very true which is why he's getting phone calls from colleges. You have to be good in multiple areas on both ends. 

[Hooohead.com]

7 minutes ago, Cardinal 1 said:

Very true which is why he's getting phone calls from colleges. You have to be good in multiple areas on both ends. 

In my 20+ years of recruiting...Phone calls = Ive recieved your resume.....Offer means= i want you for the job....And if your holding out because of waitng for the BIG 1 at this point of his career they normally dont come cause his last summer has passed. Goodluck and enjoy the ride cause soon Highschool Basketball Season will be Over....A positive i can give tho is if your son has not committed and signed going into the summer he is eligible to Play 17u on any Circuit until he signs. Thats Nike, Adidas and Under Armour as well as independent circuits.