Uvalde School Shooting, 21 Dead

[tvc184]

On the KFDM Facebook page, a guy is reporting that officers entered the school 40 minutes before the shooter arrived and took their children out.

1. where does such nonsense come from?

2. How many people will now report that as “fact”? 

[Unwoke]

3 hours ago, Unwoke said:

Then what seems to be the problem with these 100% Democrat controlled cities with the strictest gun laws?

Like - Chicago, NYC, LA, Baltimore, Detroit, Washington DC, Philadelphia, Seattle, Portland, and on, and on, and on.

I will wait…..

Still waiting Bobcat…..Chicago the first city had 800 homicides in 2021, 90% of them were gun related. Chicago has some the strictest gun laws in the country. Like I said criminals love strict gun laws. Law abiding gun owners are not the problem. 
 

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[Dirty_but_Dazzling]

5 hours ago, Bobcat1 said:

The husband of the teacher murdered, just died of a heart attack.  They had four kids. 😢

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incredibly sad.

[LumRaiderFan]

5 minutes ago, Dirty_but_Dazzling said:

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incredibly sad.

Literally died from a broken heart, you are right, incredibly sad.

 

[Unwoke]

If you think the government that just spent two years masking, force vaccinating and threatening your children—driving up youth suicide rates and drug overdoses—

If you think that government wants gun control to keep them safe, you are utterly delusional.

Not one inch.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.

[LumRaiderFan]

14 minutes ago, Unwoke said:

If you think the government that just spent two years masking, force vaccinating and threatening your children—driving up youth suicide rates and drug overdoses—

If you think that government wants gun control to keep them safe, you are utterly delusional.

Not one inch.

I agree, there are Washington democrats that are glad that door was unlocked.

Sad, hard to believe, but absolutely true.

That’s who we’re dealing with.

[Boyz N Da Hood]

5 hours ago, Unwoke said:

Then what seems to be the problem with these 100% Democrat controlled cities with the strictest gun laws?

Like - Chicago, NYC, LA, Baltimore, Detroit, Washington DC, Philadelphia, Seattle, Portland, and on, and on, and on.

I will wait…..

Out of curiosity does these states you mentioned have high rate mass murders with assault rifles etc? Or school shootings? Or is it just criminals in the streets with pistols being idiots? 

[LumRaiderFan]

6 minutes ago, 45thSucks said:

Out of curiosity does these states you mentioned have high rate mass murders with assault rifles etc? Or school shootings? Or is it just criminals in the streets with pistols being idiots? 

Can you tell me what an assault rifle is?

[bullets13]

15 hours ago, CardinalBacker said:

I’m well aware that a rifle is just a tool made of iron and wood… it’s a hard heart that kills. 
 

I also understand the 2A as my right to protect myself from enemies… whether they are an intruder or a tyrannical government. AR owner here. 
 

But is there anything else that we should be doing legislatively? I’ve made a few personal suggestions (lock your guns, don’t sell them to strangers, etc…) but it seems like this kid followed the law, and even if this retailer (who I’m certain is losing quite a bit of sleep) hadn’t sold this rifle to this kid, the kid was going to get his hands on one sooner or later. 
 

Does anybody have any workable ideas or suggestions that would make these scenarios less likely?

In the novel I typed previously on this thread I stated that I think raising the age to buy high capacity rifles to 21 might help.  3 extra years of maturity, and 3 years away from the angst and emotions of high school would likely stop some of these shootings.  Stiffer penalties for anyone who allows a shooter access to firearms might help as well.  

[AHUDDLESTON]

So you are saying that 21 should be the age to get in the army and also when men have to register for the selective service.

[bullets13]

3 hours ago, Unwoke said:

Still waiting Bobcat…..Chicago the first city had 800 homicides in 2021, 90% of them were gun related. Chicago has some the strictest gun laws in the country. Like I said criminals love strict gun laws. Law abiding gun owners are not the problem. 
 

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I can answer this one for you.  To be clear, I’m pro 2A, don’t want guns banned, etc. etc.  But the reason that strict gun laws work in Australia and the UK is that they’re nationwide.  Guns in those countries have been greatly restricted, with many  banned, confiscated, and destroyed.  Chicago, NYC, and San Francisco’s laws, while stricter than the rest of the country, don’t even come close to the countries mentioned.  In Australia, for instance, one must demonstrate a legitimate need for gun ownership (self defense is not considered), must be licensed, every gun is registered, and there’s a very restrictive list of who can and can’t own them.  The types of guns you can own and their capacities are also greatly limited.  These laws are applicable nationwide.  In England one can get sporting rifles and shotguns with a license.  Handguns have been almost entirely banned, and as we all know, pistols account for the overwhelming majority of our gun crimes due to being easily concealable and much easier to use in a crime.  On the other hand, criminals in the US, no matter how strict the laws are in their cities, are just a short drive away from much more lenient gun laws.  There are also still legal means to buy guns in those cities, and a ready supply of legal guns to acquire illegally.  So while the cities you mention may have more laws on the books and harsher punishments for gun crimes, it’s impossible for them to actually keep criminals from getting them.  That said, attempting to ban guns at this point is akin to shutting the barn door after the horse is already out of the stable.  There are over 400M guns in circulation in the US.  Removing them from law abiding citizens will only put them in more danger from the criminals who will not turn theirs in.  As for your comparison, though, it’s apples and oranges, or as TVC likes to say, apples and rocks.

[bullets13]

43 minutes ago, AHUDDLESTON said:

So you are saying that 21 should be the age to get in the army and also when men have to register for the selective service.

I have no issue with that, but It’s a catch-22.  The government needs a steady supply of 18-year-olds with limited prospects to keep the armed forces well-manned, but an 18-year-old is not far removed (and often case not removed at all) from being an immature kid.  On the flip side, there are plenty of other things that 18-year-old soldiers have to wait to do until they’re 21.

[tvc184]

9 hours ago, BEARCPA said:

I wonder why DPS Sargent Estrada told the media differently yesterday if it wasn't true. 

Because the media and people want immediate answers and that was what had been reported at that time.

Maybe a year before I retired, we had an officer involved shooting where a suspect was killed. I arrived on scene within a couple of minutes. I quickly spoke to an officer who had spoken with a witness. The information that I received was it a man approached the officer and put his hand near his back pocket like he might have been going for something. No weapon was ever displayed but the officer shot him.

So I approached the chief and another commanding officer with that information. I was told practically immediately that that is not what happened. I was simply relaying the information but that information was so far from the truth. I later watched the car camera video and the officer’s  body camera video and the story I was told at the actual crime scene was so far from the truth. That video was later released to the public. 

The point is that I was on scene  within a couple of minutes and was given what appeared to be good information from an eye witness, through another officer, and it was complete nonsense. Had I spoken to the media at that time however, I might have repeated that completely bogus story. On occasion I have been the on scene spokesman and fortunately, not for officer involved incidents.

 That is why we do “investigations”.

Remember Michael Brown and “hands up, don’t shoot”. The FBI under President Obama and Attorney General Eric Holder had a year long investigation costing millions of dollars which concluded that the hands up don’t shoot, never happened.

Not so strangely, the DA and local and state police came to the conclusion within a couple of days.

[Dirty_but_Dazzling]

Cain killed Abel with a rock, THE LORD didn't get rid of all the rocks. HE blamed Cain, not the rock. We have a sin problem, not a gun problem.

[tvc184]

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[CardinalBacker]

5 hours ago, AHUDDLESTON said:

So you are saying that 21 should be the age to get in the army and also when men have to register for the selective service.

Don’t they keep the rifles locked away for the most part?

[Unwoke]

6 hours ago, bullets13 said:

I can answer this one for you.  To be clear, I’m pro 2A, don’t want guns banned, etc. etc.  But the reason that strict gun laws work in Australia and the UK is that they’re nationwide.  Guns in those countries have been greatly restricted, with many  banned, confiscated, and destroyed.  Chicago, NYC, and San Francisco’s laws, while stricter than the rest of the country, don’t even come close to the countries mentioned.  In Australia, for instance, one must demonstrate a legitimate need for gun ownership (self defense is not considered), must be licensed, every gun is registered, and there’s a very restrictive list of who can and can’t own them.  The types of guns you can own and their capacities are also greatly limited.  These laws are applicable nationwide.  In England one can get sporting rifles and shotguns with a license.  Handguns have been almost entirely banned, and as we all know, pistols account for the overwhelming majority of our gun crimes due to being easily concealable and much easier to use in a crime.  On the other hand, criminals in the US, no matter how strict the laws are in their cities, are just a short drive away from much more lenient gun laws.  There are also still legal means to buy guns in those cities, and a ready supply of legal guns to acquire illegally.  So while the cities you mention may have more laws on the books and harsher punishments for gun crimes, it’s impossible for them to actually keep criminals from getting them.  That said, attempting to ban guns at this point is akin to shutting the barn door after the horse is already out of the stable.  There are over 400M guns in circulation in the US.  Removing them from law abiding citizens will only put them in more danger from the criminals who will not turn theirs in.  As for your comparison, though, it’s apples and oranges, or as TVC likes to say, apples and rocks.

Like I said in my original post. Criminals love strict gun laws. I never said anything about the UK or Australia, Bobcat was making the ridiculous comparison. I don’t see the UK or Australia in our Constitution. I repeat….SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.

[Unwoke]

7 hours ago, 45thSucks said:

Out of curiosity does these states you mentioned have high rate mass murders with assault rifles etc? Or school shootings? Or is it just criminals in the streets with pistols being idiots? 

What’s an assault rifle? Those cities have the highest homicide rates that are gun related an the strictest gun laws in the US. Aren’t all criminals that shoot people for know reason wether it be on the street or a school idiots?

[CardinalBacker]

7 hours ago, LumRaiderFan said:

Can you tell me what an assault rifle is?

I can’t stand when people fall into superfluous arguments like “can you tell me what an assault rifle is” like it’s some catch-22 that’s going to help them win a debate. 
 

Can you define a school shooting? Because that’s what we’re talking about. 
You don’t have to know the difference between an AR15 and an AK47 to have an opinion on kids getting mowed down in class. 
 

If they ever do enact here, it will be because of gun people who sell bump stocks, scream “what part of SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED do you not understand?” or refuse to at least admit that there are a heck of a lot of innocent people losing their lives via .223/5.56 rounds. 
 

Just because the left wants to use these shootings as an excuse to disarm law-abiding gun owners (typically conservatives) doesn’t mean that the repeated mass shootings shouldn’t be addressed in any way. 
 

 

[Unwoke]

Couldn’t hurt.

 

 

[Unwoke]

6 minutes ago, CardinalBacker said:

I can’t stand when people fall into superfluous arguments like “can you tell me what an assault rifle is” like it’s some catch-22 that’s going to help them win a debate. 
 

Can you define a school shooting? Because that’s what we’re talking about. 
You don’t have to know the difference between an AR15 and an AK47 to have an opinion on kids getting mowed down in class. 
 

If they ever do enact here, it will be because of gun people who sell bump stocks, scream “what part of SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED do you not understand?” or refuse to at least admit that there are a heck of a lot of innocent people losing their lives via .223/5.56 rounds. 
 

Just because the left wants to use these shootings as an excuse to disarm law-abiding gun owners (typically conservatives) doesn’t mean that the repeated mass shootings shouldn’t be addressed in any way. 
 

 

Can you define the difference between the security our US Congress receives and our school children receive? The only way J6 protesters got into the Capitol building was someone press the button to open the magnetic doors to let them in. There’s other ways to address the problem rather than chip away at law abiding citizens rights to bear arms. Our Congress just sent 40 billion dollars to a country hardly anyone can find on a map. That money could have went to secure the school structure of schools across this country. I repeat it’s not a gun problem. It’s a heart problem and break down of the family structure problem.

[Unwoke]

 

 

 

[Hagar]

A big contributing factor, the closing of State Psychiatric Hospitals.  At one point in the 50’s there were more than half a million Americans confined to these Hospitals/Asylums (at great cost).  Now there are about 37,000 beds assigned for short term, acute in-patient units in general medical hospitals.  From the article - “The mass closure of State Mental Hospitals in the US coincided with the advent and popularity of neuroleptic medications, the patient rights movement, and the well intentioned, but poorly delivered, National transition towards community-based mental health care.”  IMO, the politicians saw a way to save buku money, and I think we’re seeing the cost.  Population in the 50’s avg about 170,000, about half of what it is now, and half a million were in Asylums.  The math says we should have close to a million in Asylums now, but they’re not.  They’re on the streets.  In the schools.  The meds aren’t working & the result is the insanity we see in America today.  Would the building of these Asylums stop all the crazies?  Of corse not, but it would stop much of it.  At this point, I’d bet it’s the most significant answer to our problem.  Jmo
 

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[Bobcat1]

11 hours ago, Unwoke said:

Still waiting Bobcat…..Chicago the first city had 800 homicides in 2021, 90% of them were gun related. Chicago has some the strictest gun laws in the country. Like I said criminals love strict gun laws. Law abiding gun owners are not the problem. 
 

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It's coming - I work. 

[Bobcat1]

4 hours ago, Dirty_but_Dazzling said:

Cain killed Abel with a rock, THE LORD didn't get rid of all the rocks. HE blamed Cain, not the rock. We have a sin problem, not a gun problem.

Are you quoting Hershel Walker....... 😄