The Tale Of Two Football Cities: Port Neches-Groves And Nederland

[Reagan]

Since 1975, PNG has been to 4 State Title games and has won 1 State Championship.  Nederland has had 0 State Championship appearances.  These neighboring cities actually have basically the same types of kids.  So, what has been the difference?  Why hasn't Nederland been some-what able to match PNG in Title appearances?  Thoughts?!

[AggiesAreWe]

1 minute ago, Reagan said:

Since 1975, PNG has been to 4 State Title games and has won 1 State Championship.  Nederland has had 0 State Championship appearances.  These neighboring cities actually have basically the same types of kids.  So, what has been the difference?  Why hasn't Nederland been some-what able to match PNG in Title appearances?  Thoughts?!

Nederland doesn't have a Groves

[TheOutsider]

If you go back PNG has 3 titles & Nederland has 1. IDK the answer to your question.  I do think it's much harder to even get to the state game than most people realize.

[NHSBulldogFan]

33 minutes ago, Reagan said:

Since 1975, PNG has been to 4 State Title games and has won 1 State Championship.  Nederland has had 0 State Championship appearances.  These neighboring cities actually have basically the same types of kids.  So, what has been the difference?  Why hasn't Nederland been some-what able to match PNG in Title appearances?  Thoughts?!

Coaching and the school board...Other than Uncle Larry both have been a disaster for Nederland for the last 60 years

[navydawg31]

Community backing. PNG supports their kids in any and everything show up loud and proud. Nederland is very very fair weather and don’t want best for the kids. Look at how the bonds just recently got passed after all these years 

[PN-G bamatex]

2 hours ago, AggiesAreWe said:

Nederland doesn't have a Groves

Neither does PN-G, or at least not a whole one. Pull up the district lines and city limits on Google Earth.

Nederland ISD has all of Nederland, about a quarter of the city of Port Neches, all of Beauxart and Central Gardens and nearly all of the real estate in Port Arthur between FM 365 and Jimmy Johnson Boulevard. Port Arthur ISD has basically all of Groves south of Highway 73. PN-GISD only has what’s left of Port Neches and Groves, plus a sliver of Port Arthur around Lake Arthur Drive.

Add all that up, and PN-GISD and Nederland ISD have roughly the same amount of residents, which is why they typically have roughly the same amount of students. Just about every realignment that I’ve seen a student census, the difference between their high school student bodies has been roughly a hundred students (~7% of total student population) or less. Some years PN-G has been bigger, some years Nederland has been bigger. Demographically, the two districts are almost indistinguishable from each other.

I can’t believe I’m about to say this. Smitty has a point here.

[Coach85]

14 hours ago, PN-G bamatex said:

Neither does PN-G, or at least not a whole one. Pull up the district lines and city limits on Google Earth.

Nederland ISD has all of Nederland, about a quarter of the city of Port Neches, all of Beauxart and Central Gardens and nearly all of the real estate in Port Arthur between FM 365 and Jimmy Johnson Boulevard. Port Arthur ISD has basically all of Groves south of Highway 73. PN-GISD only has what’s left of Port Neches and Groves, plus a sliver of Port Arthur around Lake Arthur Drive.

Add all that up, and PN-GISD and Nederland ISD have roughly the same amount of residents, which is why they typically have roughly the same amount of students. Just about every realignment that I’ve seen a student census, the difference between their high school student bodies has been roughly a hundred students (~7% of total student population) or less. Some years PN-G has been bigger, some years Nederland has been bigger. Demographically, the two districts are almost indistinguishable from each other.

I can’t believe I’m about to say this. Smitty has a point here.

He isn’t saying anything about the number of students each school has. He is saying that the athlete’s at PNG come from Groves. Even the ones now that are from Port Neches. Most of their parents grew up in Groves. So they still have the Groves gene. Like it was said before in a different thread. Port Neches supplied the school and Groves supplies the athlete’s.

[AggiesAreWe]

12 minutes ago, Coach85 said:

He isn’t saying anything about the number of students each school has. He is saying that the athlete’s at PNG come from Groves. Even the ones now that are from Port Neches. Most of their parents grew up in Groves. So they still have the Groves gene. Like it was said before in a different thread. Port Neches supplied the school and Groves supplies the athlete’s.

Bingo

[HurricaneCal]

2 hours ago, Coach85 said:

He isn’t saying anything about the number of students each school has. He is saying that the athlete’s at PNG come from Groves. Even the ones now that are from Port Neches. Most of their parents grew up in Groves. So they still have the Groves gene. Like it was said before in a different thread. Port Neches supplied the school and Groves supplies the athlete’s.

That’s what people say about Crosby too!  Crosby supplied the school and Barrett provided the athletes.  I will say though sometimes it has some racial tones to it.

[navydawg31]

20 hours ago, AggiesAreWe said:

Nederland doesn't have a Groves

So who from PNG state team was from Groves that started… 

I know the answer just seeing if you know it. 

[AggiesAreWe]

Just now, navydawg31 said:

So who from PNG state team was from Groves that started… 

I know the answer just seeing if you know it. 

I have no clue.

My post was more of a joke but also off what lot's of people from that area have told me over the years.

[PN-G bamatex]

5 hours ago, Coach85 said:

He isn’t saying anything about the number of students each school has. He is saying that the athlete’s at PNG come from Groves. Even the ones now that are from Port Neches. Most of their parents grew up in Groves. So they still have the Groves gene. Like it was said before in a different thread. Port Neches supplied the school and Groves supplies the athlete’s.

I must have misinterpreted the post, then, because I've never heard anyone say that. I actually lived in Groves for the first six years of my life, before moving to Port Neches at the start of kindergarten. When I think back on our star athletes when I was in school, they were pretty evenly split. Port Neches may have had a slight advantage.

What I have heard more times than I can count - mostly from Nederland fans - is some version of, "PN-G has two towns and Nederland only has one, so y'all will always have the advantage." That always struck me as a poor excuse for losing, especially considering how much of Port Neches is in Nederland ISD. Most of the students at Highland Park Elementary are actually Port Neches residents.

[Reagan]

2 hours ago, PN-G bamatex said:

I must have misinterpreted the post, then, because I've never heard anyone say that. I actually lived in Groves for the first six years of my life, before moving to Port Neches at the start of kindergarten. When I think back on our star athletes when I was in school, they were pretty evenly split. Port Neches may have had a slight advantage.

What I have heard more times than I can count - mostly from Nederland fans - is some version of, "PN-G has two towns and Nederland only has one, so y'all will always have the advantage." That always struck me as a poor excuse for losing, especially considering how much of Port Neches is in Nederland ISD. Most of the students at Highland Park Elementary are actually Port Neches residents.

Well, whether or not the original Groves quote was in jest or not, it did get a "thanks" and a "like".  So, the feeling may be more prevalent than one might think.  But, I feel it's deeper.  From the described year of 1975, that's 47 years of Nederland football being left out of the joy and excitement of a State Championship experience.  I really haven't heard anything yet that would explain this 47 year deficit, again, with basically the same kids to draw from as PNG.  With a 4-0 record of State appearances in favor of PNG, there has to be something going on!  

[skipmeister]

Also, here is something interesting. I believe that Nederland residents are better educated. The percentage of the residents having a bachelor's degree are more than Port Neches and Groves. Does anyone agree with that? Although it mainly does not matter because many residents work in the petrochemical industry which may not require such degree. Here is the link and do your research: 

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[Reagan]

8 minutes ago, skipmeister said:

Also, here is something interesting. I believe that Nederland residents are better educated. The percentage of the residents having a bachelor's degree are more than Port Neches and Groves. Does anyone agree with that? Although it mainly does not matter because many residents work in the petrochemical industry which may not require such degree. Here is the link and do your research: 

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Curious:  are you making a general statement or are you trying to connect some dots here?  

[Coach85]

2 hours ago, PN-G bamatex said:

I must have misinterpreted the post, then, because I've never heard anyone say that. I actually lived in Groves for the first six years of my life, before moving to Port Neches at the start of kindergarten. When I think back on our star athletes when I was in school, they were pretty evenly split. Port Neches may have had a slight advantage.

What I have heard more times than I can count - mostly from Nederland fans - is some version of, "PN-G has two towns and Nederland only has one, so y'all will always have the advantage." That always struck me as a poor excuse for losing, especially considering how much of Port Neches is in Nederland ISD. Most of the students at Highland Park Elementary are actually Port Neches residents.

You must be living under a rock. It’s been said for many years that most of the better athletes are from Groves. I’m not saying every year but, you look on the field year in and year out there are more Groves boys or Port Neches boys who’s parents or one parent grew up in Groves that are starting.

[HurricaneCal]

So why you think Nederland always found a way to beat PNG during the past 10 years or so?

[Reagan]

3 hours ago, CougarCal said:

So why you think Nederland always found a way to beat PNG during the past 10 years or so?

It's just one of those oddities that happens between these two schools.  Nederland played PNG close this year.  But, was not indicative of the two different paths they actually followed.  

[dj]

On 1/5/2023 at 3:26 PM, Reagan said:

Since 1975, PNG has been to 4 State Title games and has won 1 State Championship.  Nederland has had 0 State Championship appearances.  These neighboring cities actually have basically the same types of kids.  So, what has been the difference?  Why hasn't Nederland been some-what able to match PNG in Title appearances?  Thoughts?!

Coaching !!

[PN-G bamatex]

11 hours ago, CougarCal said:

So why you think Nederland always found a way to beat PNG during the past 10 years or so?

PN-G is 5-5 versus Nederland over the last ten seasons.

[PN-G bamatex]

16 hours ago, Coach85 said:

You must be living under a rock. It’s been said for many years that most of the better athletes are from Groves. I’m not saying every year but, you look on the field year in and year out there are more Groves boys or Port Neches boys who’s parents or one parent grew up in Groves that are starting.

Must be a generational thing. That wasn’t the case when I was in high school.

[OneChance]

You guys are driving me crazy, it’s not Groves, it’s THE GROVES! You going to have to take the PNG off your name and just be Bamatex if you don’t know about the legacy of THE GROVES! The Groves Browns Pop Warner program had some of the meanest and baddest boys around for years and years!

[Tiger33]

2 hours ago, dj said:

Coaching !!

Nederland might be correcting that problem. 

[PN-G bamatex]

2 hours ago, OneChance said:

You guys are driving me crazy, it’s not Groves, it’s THE GROVES! You going to have to take the PNG off your name and just be Bamatex if you don’t know about the legacy of THE GROVES! The Groves Browns Pop Warner program had some of the meanest and baddest boys around for years and years!

You have any idea how many boxes of pecans I picked up out of my grandmother’s yard down in “the” Groves back in the day? 😉

[pine curtain]

On 1/6/2023 at 8:40 AM, AggiesAreWe said:

Bingo

that is like saying silsbee supplied the school and caneyhead supplied the athletes.... lol