President Trump Orders Closure of All DIE Offices!

[tvc184]

4 hours ago, PAMFAM10 said:

I’ve seen it in my hiring process. As an interviewer and as an applicant Don’t care for what party this or that. Let’s just get rid of asking ppl if their white black or Hispanic. Credentials should be enough. And again Legacy applications should be removed also best man/woman available across the board.

Applying for a civil service job for a police or fire department requires everyone taking the same test, at the same time and at the same location. The tests are sealed until the testing process begins and the police or fire department doesn’t set the test. They do that because no one is supposed to even know what the questions are over until the test begins.

All hiring must come from the ranking of the test scores with no added points except a state mandated 5 extra points for an honorable discharge from the military.

Once the tests are scored, including adding the military points, the person(s) hired has to come from the ranking of the test scores. Whoever scored number one has to be put through the background investigation, the physical agility/obstacle course, interview, etc., before they can move on to the second place person from the final ranking. Anyone who is not hired has to be told why and they have I believe 10 business days to appeal the results to an outside board.

So legacy, who you know, your race, where you live, etc., has a much harder time being used because the state law forces the hiring process by test score and military service only  

 The cities in this area seem to have a strong dislike for that merit based process. The only way they can circumvent state law is by a contract with a police or firefighter union. The city governments are bound by state law on hiring and promotions. Promotions are based similar to the hiring process. The city civil service commission, volunteers appointed by the mayor, choose study material such as books that the promotional test will be based on. The departments have no say in the testing materials or the questions. The promotional materials must be made available to everyone for at least 90 days prior to any test and the test itself has to be given at least a 30 day notice. Again, everyone has to take the test at the same time at the same location which are graded on scene. There are no additional points given except for seniority, at least by my department civil service rules. The promotions must then be given by the final test scores. 

If both sides agree to allow a change in the law however, state law can be overcome. That sometimes puts the union in a good bargaining position. 

Again, the cities don’t seem to particularly like that process of merit based promotions. They want to put who they want in a position without being required to base it on anything.

That is why I asked, when people say that they want to take sex and race out of the equation by removing it from the applications, the state already has such a system for hiring and promoting of police and firefighters. The cities don’t seem particularly fond of that system. 
 

 

[thetragichippy]

14 hours ago, tvc184 said:

Applying for a civil service job for a police or fire department requires everyone taking the same test, at the same time and at the same location. The tests are sealed until the testing process begins and the police or fire department doesn’t set the test. They do that because no one is supposed to even know what the questions are over until the test begins.

All hiring must come from the ranking of the test scores with no added points except a state mandated 5 extra points for an honorable discharge from the military.

Once the tests are scored, including adding the military points, the person(s) hired has to come from the ranking of the test scores. Whoever scored number one has to be put through the background investigation, the physical agility/obstacle course, interview, etc., before they can move on to the second place person from the final ranking. Anyone who is not hired has to be told why and they have I believe 10 business days to appeal the results to an outside board.

So legacy, who you know, your race, where you live, etc., has a much harder time being used because the state law forces the hiring process by test score and military service only  

 The cities in this area seem to have a strong dislike for that merit based process. The only way they can circumvent state law is by a contract with a police or firefighter union. The city governments are bound by state law on hiring and promotions. Promotions are based similar to the hiring process. The city civil service commission, volunteers appointed by the mayor, choose study material such as books that the promotional test will be based on. The departments have no say in the testing materials or the questions. The promotional materials must be made available to everyone for at least 90 days prior to any test and the test itself has to be given at least a 30 day notice. Again, everyone has to take the test at the same time at the same location which are graded on scene. There are no additional points given except for seniority, at least by my department civil service rules. The promotions must then be given by the final test scores. 

If both sides agree to allow a change in the law however, state law can be overcome. That sometimes puts the union in a good bargaining position. 

Again, the cities don’t seem to particularly like that process of merit based promotions. They want to put who they want in a position without being required to base it on anything.

That is why I asked, when people say that they want to take sex and race out of the equation by removing it from the applications, the state already has such a system for hiring and promoting of police and firefighters. The cities don’t seem particularly fond of that system. 
 

 

This seems like a fair system, but I do see flaws using this for other jobs. I'm not sure a test can measure personality, drive or work ethic. In my company I have a good reputation for hiring good people that tend to stay around 5+ years. 
 

My secret is NOT using the company interview questions. People, even dumb ones, can google standard interview questions and find acceptable answers.   So, I come from around the desk, sit next to them and ask open ended questions. If they can engage in a conversation, I will learn more from them that way versus the company directed questions.

You would be surprised what you get from these "casual conversations" - I had one person tell me, once a week was an acceptable amount of days to call in.......They did not get hired.....

[Big girl]

On 1/29/2025 at 7:24 PM, tvc184 said:

No but apparently Asians are.

According to the Association of American Medical Colleges, almost 22% of medical school graduates are Asian. Their population in the US is reportedly 6%. So they are graduating doctors at a pace almost 400% higher than their population. 

 The White population is about 61% yet they are graduating only 55% of medical students so 10% lower than their population.

It seems like Asians are bumping everyone. 

My PCP is Asian, my dentist is Indian and my wife’s PCP and dentist are both Asian. My wife’s only surgery was from a surgeon who is Black. 

My younger brother recently had stents put in one of his carotid arteries by his cardiologist who is Asian as well as his pulmonologist.

Those darn Asians! 🤣

My brother’s neurologist is Black.

But hey, his PCP is White…..

So out of eight physicians from my immediate family members, five are Asian, two are Black and one is White. Neither I nor any of my family has ever claimed that we are dissatisfied with our care nor thought our physicians were DEI hires.

 That is awesome about your son. There was no need for affirmative action nor DEI anything, as it should be. Congratulations. 

Pick a white doctor then. 56% of doctors are white. You will have a lot to chose from.

[tvc184]

57 minutes ago, thetragichippy said:

This seems like a fair system, but I do see flaws using this for other jobs. I'm not sure a test can measure personality, drive or work ethic. In my company I have a good reputation for hiring good people that tend to stay around 5+ years. 
 

My secret is NOT using the company interview questions. People, even dumb ones, can google standard interview questions and find acceptable answers.   So, I come from around the desk, sit next to them and ask open ended questions. If they can engage in a conversation, I will learn more from them that way versus the company directed questions.

You would be surprised what you get from these "casual conversations" - I had one person tell me, once a week was an acceptable amount of days to call in.......They did not get hired.....

I wouldn’t suggest hiring or promoting by tests or certainly not as the main or only factor. It is fair however and I have seen what a government thinks about being fair and qualified, considering the topic.

Calling in…. 

When I retired I had almost 4,000 hours of sick time accrued. On average I called in sick a little over one day a year.

 I could have called in sick for almost two years…. 😎

[tvc184]

40 minutes ago, Big girl said:

Pick a white doctor then. 56% of doctors are white. You will have a lot to chose from.

If I was looking for a race I am sure that I could.

When less White doctors are graduating as compared to their race percentages in this country, it hampers the claim that they are bumping people out of positions.

Maybe it’s Asian privilege. 

[thetragichippy]

1 hour ago, tvc184 said:

Calling in…. 

When I retired I had almost 4,000 hours of sick time accrued. On average I called in sick a little over one day a year.

That is a bunch - I'm the same way, I rarely call in - only exception was covid....they made me stay home...lol

[tvc184]

1 hour ago, thetragichippy said:

That is a bunch - I'm the same way, I rarely call in - only exception was covid....they made me stay home...lol

We tried to stay home for covid but they said no. 🤔

[Big girl]

3 hours ago, tvc184 said:

If I was looking for a race I am sure that I could.

When less White doctors are graduating as compared to their race percentages in this country, it hampers the claim that they are bumping people out of positions.

Maybe it’s Asian privilege. 

So, minorities bump whites out because of "quotas". You are assuming that all whites are smarter than minorities. More white doctors are graduating when compared to Asians.

[thetragichippy]

22 minutes ago, Big girl said:

More white doctors are graduating when compared to Asians.

Ya think........lol

72.5% of the population in the US identify as white versus 7.2% identify as Asian......it should be no shocker there would be more white Doctors graduating than Asian.

It is math not discrimination....smh

[LumRaiderFan]

1 hour ago, Big girl said:

So, minorities bump whites out because of "quotas". You are assuming that all whites are smarter than minorities. More white doctors are graduating when compared to Asians.

🤦‍♂️

[Big girl]

1 hour ago, thetragichippy said:

Ya think........lol

72.5% of the population in the US identify as white versus 7.2% identify as Asian......it should be no shocker there would be more white Doctors graduating than Asian.

It is math not discrimination....smh

So why complain. Most doctors are white?

[Big girl]

Asian Americans are well represented in medical school, but they face challenges in academic medicine and leadership. They are also underrepresented in certain specialties and leadership positions. 

 

Representation

• In 2022, Asian Americans made up 28.7% of medical students in the US. 
   
• However, Asian Americans are underrepresented in leadership positions, especially senior faculty. 
   
• Asian Americans are also underrepresented in certain specialties, such as selective residency programs. 
   

 

Challenges

• Asian American medical students experience microaggressions, discrimination, and harassment. 
   
• They are also more likely to take a leave of absence from medical school. 
   
• They are less likely to be recognized for honors. 
   
• They are often excluded from discussions of racial discrimination and biased practices. 
   
• They are often categorized as the "model minority".