High School Girls Officiating

[Jdad]

Hate to play devil's advocate all the time but here goes:

First, the game has changed.... but here is how.

1.  Conditioning (Speed).  Players train year round now... they are in shap and they can run.  This leads to more possessions, which leads to more fouls called.. (It also leads to more opportunities for missed calls.)

2.  Conditioning (Strength)  Players lift weights.  Fouls are harder because players are stronger.  The rule book says that a foul is any action that gains the defenisve player an unfair advantage.  If the offensive player is stronger and can absorb contact, it probably won't be called.

3.  Emphasis on athletes, not just basketball players.  I coach and I will take a gifted athlete over a shooter any day.  I can teach shooting, I can't teach hustle, speed, height, etc.  I am sure other coaches are the same way... so each team will always have a few "unskilled" players who are good athletes.  These players tend to play a little more reckless than the typical basketball player.

4.  Coaching.  Most high schools have one basketball coach, with an assistant or two pulled from other sports.  In gilr's sports, it usually works this way.... Head Coach, football coach / volleyball coach.  The lower level coaches don't know how to teach fundamentals.  At HJ we are lucky to have 3 "basketball minded coaches"  on the boy's and girl's side.

5.  Timing.  If there is a shortage of officials (and there is.... our AD had to call the9th and JV games vs. Hamshire)  They should schedule girls games on different nights than the boys games.  This would allow a greater pool of officials, as well as allow fans to see both teams play.  (Or schedule them at the same site for lower classifications)  * I know this would never happen though due to UIL rules about games on school nights.

Finally,

6.  Attitude....  If you look for blame... you can always find it.... and the officials are an easy target.  I always tell our girls that Officials DO NOT MAKE US:  make bad passes, miss free throws, forget plays, not hustle... etc.  These are the things that make a team win or lose over the course of a game.....  Look at HJ's losses, poor rebounding, free throws, etc lost those games not calls.

*On a side note, I may be one of the hardest coaches in this area on officials, but I think the officials do a decent job.  I have had to call some games, and literally every 5 seconds there is a judgement to be made.  It is a tough job to do well and I think the guys who put on the stripes and call games in this area try to do a good job.

-Mike

First who changed the game.

your qoute about the athlete says fundamentals are not required.So we should quit teaching them and teach hully gully all the time. And the rest of your points apply to boys. Girls are different they listen and try to do what their coach tells them. The best teams I've had the prvilidge to watch was the 2004-2005 Orangefeild team and a team from Wimberly. They had the best fundamentals in passing. defense and all around game that I've ever watched. They played the way the game was intended.They where athletes but they didn't play out of control.Watching the college level like Baylor, Texas, Duke, Tennessee they all have one thing in common, they are all on the same page, they all have great fundametals and they are the best at the sport. Girls shoot better free throw percentage than boys on a average. They also shot 3 at a higher % the main difference is the dunk.The reason this post gets so emotional is I believe most of us want the game to be the same game we love to play.

[hjhawks]

JDad.... come on...You know me better than that.....

The athletes part......  you can teach an athlete fundamentals.....  it is much harder to teach a fundamentally sound player to be an athelete...

Also, I have coached girls and boy's at the varsity level... the statement that girl's listen and try harder is not true.. It totally depends on the player, their dedication, etc.

Also, I don't think that 3pt % is higher in girls basketball...

Regardless.... the discussion on officials is really pointless... If a coach doesn't want a particular official, they can scratch them.  That is really the best and only solution for high school athletics.  Do I wish it were better, yes.  BUT this is what we have and this is what we must work with.

[Guest bleed orange]

I agree with what you are saying but, the post I believe is how fiscal the games are getting.I may be wrong that's the impression I got. Also the only reason your point is valid is because most games are not decided by a few points. To say 2 or 3 bad calls can't change a 1 point game is wrong. Your theory is if you play perfect you win. No Ones perfect and you shouldn't expect your team to be. The game is changing from fundamentals and defense to playground hoops. You see to much of the And1 show where walking double dribble and defense are not part of the game.Its a great game and it should be played by the rules. When it is played the way it was intended it is a great sport.What are we teaching our kids? That rules are not always right.  By the way tonights game was well officiated and played hard by both teams. WOS played hard the entire game and HJ played hard and every player contributed.

Great post Jdad I agree 100%. There is to much lets go one on one instead of team ball. The NBA is the root of this evil. That's why I do not watch it. That's why the teams that play "team ball" win state championships or college national championships. Adrian McGowen broke the record for the most points scored in a career. She was from goodrich. Their offense was everyone spread out and she brought the ball down the court everytime and shot. We beat them like a drum.

[Jdad]

JDad.... come on...You know me better than that.....

The athletes part......   you can teach an athlete fundamentals.....  it is much harder to teach a fundamentally sound player to be an athelete...

Also, I have coached girls and boy's at the varsity level... the statement that girl's listen and try harder is not true.. It totally depends on the player, their dedication, etc.

Also, I don't think that 3pt % is higher in girls basketball...

Regardless.... the discussion on officials is really pointless... If a coach doesn't want a particular official, they can scratch them.  That is really the best and only solution for high school athletics.  Do I wish it were better, yes.  BUT this is what we have and this is what we must work with.

I miss spoke about the 3% I meant in college, at least thats what the announcer was saying the other night when I was watching a college girls game.

On the other part I didn't say work harder. I was saying they will follow the game plan better or at least the plays even if they don't work. The just depend on the coach a little more.

On the refs it don't matter who's right or wrong its still fun to talk about.

[Guest bleed orange]

I know we are getting off the subject  but it is good conversation. Jdad me and you are a like because we are old school. Two years ago China Springs won the state championship. They were not the most "Athletic" team but they were fundamentally sound and that is why they won. They believed in the system and played team ball. Actually WOS should have won it. They lost a girl to grades that hurt them but they cruised to the regional tournament with not problem and should have won without her. But they met another fundamentally sound team in Lorena that beat them in every phase of the game.

[Jdad]

Perfect example of team ball. Everyone has talked about Kolby Bryant shooting to much, not be a team leader. This year he is not scoring as much and getting his teammates involved and they are now one of the best in the west.He can score 60 and his team would loss and then score 20 and his team win.The other night he took one shoot in the first half and they lead the nuggets by 24. Different team, same personel.

[twilyms]

This post was never intended to be a discussion on whether refs were the cause of wins and losses. This is about fouls and obvious violations not being called. One small foul not called 2 minutes into the game. 3 minutes in, the retaliation foul is not called either. These girls are smart. By the end of the game, we are just short of a cage match. I arrived in the 4th quarter of the game last night and saw a couple double dribbles, at least 2 out of bounds and 5 or 6 foul calls missed (both ways I might add) and the officials were usually 10 to 20 feet out of position. The 4 step layup has become the norm. I saw a girl a couple of weeks ago that ate our lunch going to the basket, but if she would have only been allowed two-step layups, how effective would she have been? The refs aren’t causing teams to lose games, they are causing us to lose the pleasure of watching a game played with the grace and athleticism it was meant to be played.

[mamacat]

Had to say something, I was a ref several years ago.  Worked to get as good as I could.  Put in a couple of years doing Jr. high girls and boys, then started doing more High School F and JV games.  I was hoping to move up to varsity level when I started noticing I wasn't having fun anymore.  The coaches and, mostly, the fan abuse started to take its toll.  Now, I know that is part of what I was getting paid for, putting up with that, I understand I "missed a few", but after the hundredth time you hear "Three seconds....Three seconds", as the ball is crossing over midcourt...come on. 

The last game I called, girls JV, halftime score was 32-0.  During the 4th quarter my partner called 2 technicals on the team that would wind up winning 68-4.  One on a player and one on the bench(Coach).  Now we were letting some things go.  I didn't think it was getting out of hand, we were calling the obvious stuff, just letting the ticky-tack stuff go.  Maybe that was wrong, maybe we should have prolonged the humiliation for these young ladies.  Fouled a couple more of them out allowing more of their friends to show up and see.  We called it the way we saw it, that night.  During a time out in the fourth quarter, as I stood there getting blasted by the fans for my poor officiating, something clicked.  I was done.  Went home called and cancelled the rest of the season.  I had gotten to the point in my young life that I didn't think I deserved or cared to put up with that. 

As a result, when I go to a sub-varsity or Jr. high game now and see only 1 ref or 2 very bad refs, I never complain.  You reap what you sew.  Those guys are out there doing the best they can, we have to deal with it.  I believe there are a bunch of guys and girls out there who would love calling the game, putting up with the crowds, that's a different story.  Coaches are held to a standard.  It's their jobs.  If they go off on a ref and he T's him up and kicks him out, he's got to answer to the school administration.  I never had any problems with a coach getting after me, some were a little rougher than others, but hey, what are you going to do.  We were taught that being a ref is part time, don't do something that jeopardizes another persons job, mainly the coach.  I lived by that.  Just couldn't handle the fans.  That was my problem  The point is there are a lot of guys out there who are the same way.  Love the game, want to be a part of it any way we can.  Just don't want to listen to all the crap coming from the stands.  As a result the pool of available referees is watered down.  Maybe I took it too personally.  Just my opinion.   

[hjhawks]

VERY WELL SAID MAMA CAT!

[mamacat]

actually that was mama cat's husband!!