Lamar stadium wish list tops $18 million

[lu cards]

This is a great start. And THE RIGHT DECISION for Lamar and for bringing football back. Starting with a 30-35k seat stadium is simply not smart. Rice University has a stadium that seats 70k and they're lucky to get 3,500 people to show up. University of Houston seats around 30k. Again, even when they're winning it's a great day when 1/2 the stadium is full. You don't build an 85-story building in downtown Beaumont and you don't build a 30k seat football stadium either. People don't go to football games because there is a nice stadium they go because they like football, they support their team and their communities.

You want to compare apples to oranges. Ok, Houston is 1 year older than Beaumont. So why is Houston so much bigger.

Beaumont had spindletop yet Houston got the rewards. Why? because of the same type of thinking on this board. Houston built more

Hospital beds in the last 5 years then all of Beaumont in the last 90 years. Those hospitals brought jobs, that created jobs, that created

more jobs. Houston continue to grow. 2 years and counting, yet Beaumont is still debating the 3rd hospital. What is the excuse? 

There is a national nursing shortages, its best Beaumont wait until the shortage is over. Did Houston wait? 

"its best Beaumont wait until the shortage is over"/"Lamar should wait until it win"

BTW, the nursing shortage is pushing 25 years....

houston sucks.i dont want setx to become a houston.

[Guest coachacola]

Can't you see the big picture. Lamar is setting itself to be small time. Lamar is better off not playing football until it can get that 30-35k stadium.

What they are doing is tip toeing to football. No risk and no rewards. This is not a good stadium plan. Nobody is this area will pay to see FCS. Nobody will care for

a fancy high school stadium. 7,000 fans average by the second year. Even fewer the third year. Not a good plan.

Spending at least $18 million to start football does not strike me as wanting to be small time.  You can't build a big-time FBS program in a couple of years, and it takes a lot more than a 30K stadium to be big-time.  Lamar is building the infrastructure now so they can move up to a better conference and be able to go FBS in the future.  Nobody from Lamar has said that they plan to stay FCS, but Lamar does have to start out FCS.  Cardinal Stadium will be better than some FBS stadiums when the work is done.  You have to give this time, it doesn't happen overnight.

[UNLV]

I have a question for UNLV.

For all the complaining you do about Lamar not meeting "your" standards as to how they should start up their football program, my question to you would be how many millions have you donated to the cause? You expect them to have a Rolls Royce when they can only afford a Camry.

You seem the type to complain about a free meal.

Whats the point of donating millions?  Here is the deal, I'll donate millions when Lamar wins and when the stadium needs expanding. Deal?

[UNLV]

This is a great start. And THE RIGHT DECISION for Lamar and for bringing football back. Starting with a 30-35k seat stadium is simply not smart. Rice University has a stadium that seats 70k and they're lucky to get 3,500 people to show up. University of Houston seats around 30k. Again, even when they're winning it's a great day when 1/2 the stadium is full. You don't build an 85-story building in downtown Beaumont and you don't build a 30k seat football stadium either. People don't go to football games because there is a nice stadium they go because they like football, they support their team and their communities.

You want to compare apples to oranges. Ok, Houston is 1 year older than Beaumont. So why is Houston so much bigger.

Beaumont had spindletop yet Houston got the rewards. Why? because of the same type of thinking on this board. Houston built more

Hospital beds in the last 5 years then all of Beaumont in the last 90 years. Those hospitals brought jobs, that created jobs, that created

more jobs. Houston continue to grow. 2 years and counting, yet Beaumont is still debating the 3rd hospital. What is the excuse? 

There is a national nursing shortages, its best Beaumont wait until the shortage is over. Did Houston wait? 

"its best Beaumont wait until the shortage is over"/"Lamar should wait until it win"

BTW, the nursing shortage is pushing 25 years....

houston sucks.i dont want setx to become a houston.

That is not the point. Houston sees opportunity, Houston takes advantage of opportunity. SETX see opportunity, SETX lets it pass by

with the "its too risky" excuse. This is an opportunity for Lamar to correct stupid mistakes from the past. Lamar had a student population of 10,000

in 1970. "Its to risky, lets wait, lets think small, innovation is for other communities" has kept the population the same for nearly 40 years.

[UNLV]

Can't you see the big picture. Lamar is setting itself to be small time. Lamar is better off not playing football until it can get that 30-35k stadium.

What they are doing is tip toeing to football. No risk and no rewards. This is not a good stadium plan. Nobody is this area will pay to see FCS. Nobody will care for

a fancy high school stadium. 7,000 fans average by the second year. Even fewer the third year. Not a good plan.

Spending at least $18 million to start football does not strike me as wanting to be small time.  You can't build a big-time FBS program in a couple of years, and it takes a lot more than a 30K stadium to be big-time.  Lamar is building the infrastructure now so they can move up to a better conference and be able to go FBS in the future.  Nobody from Lamar has said that they plan to stay FCS, but Lamar does have to start out FCS.  Cardinal Stadium will be better than some FBS stadiums when the work is done.  You have to give this time, it doesn't happen overnight.

coach I know what your saying seems logical and in plenty of cases it is. Lamar football needs community support for it too work.

For community support, you need to excite the community. Just building any ole way will not excite the public, look at ford park.

The $7 million fieldhouse plans sound good. The remaining is nothing more than painting an old stadium. The suites will be cool only to those

who can afford them. This plan does nothing to make the community want to support Lamar. Everything is 1980's all over again, except with a new fresh

paint job. If nothing is new or innovative, our recruiting will also reflect this, our wins will reflect this, community support will reflect this. Without shock and awww, Lamar football will fail. Tonight I will post how it should be done. Gotta go.

[UNLV]

"Lamar football needs to wait until it wins before thinking outside the box. New, exciting, and innovative should be put off for tommorrow".

"This 'telephone' has too many shortcomings to be seriously considered as a means of communication. The device is inherently of no value to

us." -- Western Union internal memo,1876.

"Computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, forecasting the relentless march of . ... science, 1949

"Who the hell wants to hear actors talk?" -- H.M. Warner, Warner Brothers, 1927.

"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers." -- Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

"Airplanes are interesting toys but of no military value." -- Marechal Ferdinand Foch, Professor of Strategy, Ecole . ... Superieure deGuerre.

"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home." -- Ken Olson, president, chairman and founder of Digital. .... Equipment

Corp., 1977

"The wireless music box has no imaginable commercial value. Who would pay for a message sent to nobody in particular?" -- David Sarnoff's

associates in response to his urgings for investment in the radio in the 1920s.

"Who in their right mind would ever need more than 640k of ram!?" -- Bill Gates, 1981

"I have traveled the length and breadth of this country and talked with the best people, and I can assure you that data processing is a fad that

won't last out the year." -- Editor in charge of business books for Prentice Hall, 1957

"But what ... is it good for?" -- Engineer at the Advanced Computing Systems Division of IBM, ... 1968, commenting on the microchip.

"The concept is interesting and well-formed, but in order to earn better than a 'C,' the idea must be feasible." -- A Yale University management

professor in response to Fred Smith's paper proposing reliable overnight delivery service. (Smith went on to found Federal Express Corp.)

"I'm just glad it'll be Clark Gable who's falling on his face and not Gary Cooper." -- Gary Cooper, on his decision not to accept the leading role

in "Gone With The Wind."

"Heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible." --Lord Kelvin, president, Royal Society, 1895.

"If I had thought about it, I wouldn't have done the experiment. The literature was full of examples that said you can't do this." -- Spencer Silver

on the work that led to the unique adhesives for3-M "Post-It" Notepads.

"So we went to Atari and said, 'Hey, we've got this amazing thing, even built with some of your parts, and what do you think about funding us?

Or we'll give it to you. We just want to do it. Pay our salary, we'll come work for you.' And they said, 'No.' So then we went to Hewlett-Packard,

and they said, 'Hey, we don't need you. You haven't got through college yet.'" -- Apple Computer Inc. founder Steve Jobs on attempts to get

Atari and H-P interested in his and Steve Wozniak's personal computer.

"Professor Goddard does not know the relation between action and reaction and the need to have something better than a vacuum against

which to react. He seems to lack the basic knowledge ladled out daily in high schools." -- 1921 New York Times editorial about Robert

Goddard's revolutionary rocket work.

"Drill for oil? You mean drill into the ground to try and find oil? You're crazy." -- Drillers whom Edwin L. Drake tried to enlist to his project to

drill for oil in 1859.

"Stocks have reached what looks like a permanently high plateau." --Irving Fisher, Professor of Economics, Yale University, 1929.

"Everything that can be invented has been invented." -- Charles H. Duell, Commissioner, U.S. Office of Patents, 1899.

"Louis Pasteur's theory of germs is ridiculous fiction". -- Pierre Pachet, Professor of Physiology at Toulouse, 1872

"The abdomen, the chest, and the brain will forever be shut from the intrusion of the wise and humane surgeon". -- Sir John Eric Ericksen,

British surgeon, appointed Surgeon Extraordinary to Queen Victoria 1873.

"We don't like their sound, and guitar music is on the way out." -- Decca Recording Co., when rejecting the Beatles, 1962.

[Guest abovetherim]

Actually the Lamar field house could be larger than the one at UNT. Currently 42,000 square feet but with addition of an athletic administration suite, a VIP suite and a club room it would be as larger as UNT's.

Also, the $18 million wish list is a little off. It is easy to add it all up and see the "wish list" is well over $20 million.

A two-story, 42,000-square-foot athletics facility to replace Higgins Field House at the south end of the stadium, at a cost of $7.25 million.

New seats, bleachers and other improvements to the main bowl of Cardinal Stadium, at a cost of $1.5 million.

Upgrades to the concourse and amenities, such as restrooms and concession stands, at a cost of $2 million.

Artificial turf to replace the natural-grass playing surface in Cardinal Stadium, at a cost of $1.34 million.

$1.8 million for the suites, and about $2.2 million for the club area.

New press box per FEMA at $1.5 million.

One other thing since the cat is out of the bag, I know personally of $30 million in pledges for the athletic programs at Lamar. Now, this isn't all for football because Lamar will need to build softball and soccer stadiums, improve Vincent Beck and other athletic facilities.

I think Dr. Simmons isn't saying much until after Lamar is given the okay by the board of higher education.

[Guest abovetherim]

Items for the football complex.

1. Stadium seating $1.5 million

2. New Athletic facility $7.25 million

3. Concourse $2 million

4. Playing surface $1.34 million

5. Systems $1.4 million

6. Other cost $5.5 million

7. Press box $1.5 million

8. athletic administration suite $475,000

9. VIP suites $1.8 million

10.Club Room $2.2 million

Total $23.065 million

[AggiesAreWe]

"Lamar football needs to wait until it wins before thinking outside the box. New, exciting, and innovative should be put off for tommorrow".

"This 'telephone' has too many shortcomings to be seriously considered as a means of communication. The device is inherently of no value to

us." -- Western Union internal memo,1876.

"Computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, forecasting the relentless march of . ... science, 1949

"Who the heck wants to hear actors talk?" -- H.M. Warner, Warner Brothers, 1927.

"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers." -- Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

"Airplanes are interesting toys but of no military value." -- Marechal Ferdinand Foch, Professor of Strategy, Ecole . ... Superieure deGuerre.

"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home." -- Ken Olson, president, chairman and founder of Digital. .... Equipment

Corp., 1977

"The wireless music box has no imaginable commercial value. Who would pay for a message sent to nobody in particular?" -- David Sarnoff's

associates in response to his urgings for investment in the radio in the 1920s.

"Who in their right mind would ever need more than 640k of ram!?" -- Bill Gates, 1981

"I have traveled the length and breadth of this country and talked with the best people, and I can assure you that data processing is a fad that

won't last out the year." -- Editor in charge of business books for Prentice Hall, 1957

"But what ... is it good for?" -- Engineer at the Advanced Computing Systems Division of IBM, ... 1968, commenting on the microchip.

"The concept is interesting and well-formed, but in order to earn better than a 'C,' the idea must be feasible." -- A Yale University management

professor in response to Fred Smith's paper proposing reliable overnight delivery service. (Smith went on to found Federal Express Corp.)

"I'm just glad it'll be Clark Gable who's falling on his face and not Gary Cooper." -- Gary Cooper, on his decision not to accept the leading role

in "Gone With The Wind."

"Heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible." --Lord Kelvin, president, Royal Society, 1895.

"If I had thought about it, I wouldn't have done the experiment. The literature was full of examples that said you can't do this." -- Spencer Silver

on the work that led to the unique adhesives for3-M "Post-It" Notepads.

"So we went to Atari and said, 'Hey, we've got this amazing thing, even built with some of your parts, and what do you think about funding us?

Or we'll give it to you. We just want to do it. Pay our salary, we'll come work for you.' And they said, 'No.' So then we went to Hewlett-Packard,

and they said, 'Hey, we don't need you. You haven't got through college yet.'" -- Apple Computer Inc. founder Steve Jobs on attempts to get

Atari and H-P interested in his and Steve Wozniak's personal computer.

"Professor Goddard does not know the relation between action and reaction and the need to have something better than a vacuum against

which to react. He seems to lack the basic knowledge ladled out daily in high schools." -- 1921 New York Times editorial about Robert

Goddard's revolutionary rocket work.

"Drill for oil? You mean drill into the ground to try and find oil? You're crazy." -- Drillers whom Edwin L. Drake tried to enlist to his project to

drill for oil in 1859.

"Stocks have reached what looks like a permanently high plateau." --Irving Fisher, Professor of Economics, Yale University, 1929.

"Everything that can be invented has been invented." -- Charles H. Duell, Commissioner, U.S. Office of Patents, 1899.

"Louis Pasteur's theory of germs is ridiculous fiction". -- Pierre Pachet, Professor of Physiology at Toulouse, 1872

"The abdomen, the chest, and the brain will forever be shut from the intrusion of the wise and humane surgeon". -- Sir John Eric Ericksen,

British surgeon, appointed Surgeon Extraordinary to Queen Victoria 1873.

"We don't like their sound, and guitar music is on the way out." -- Decca Recording Co., when rejecting the Beatles, 1962.

So, what's your point?

Oh, I know, you get what you pay for. Only thing is, your not paying for it.

[Guest abovetherim]

I don't see why anyone would be upset about the renovations at Lamar. LU will have the finest facilities in the SLC and UNLV I have a quick question for you. If Lamar wasn't thinking of a possible move to FBS in the future 5-10 years away why would they build a home locker-room for 100 athletes?

I think once you see the facilities you will be impressed. Honestly, the upgrades will have Cardinal Stadium as the finest facility in the SLC.

[AggiesAreWe]

I don't see why anyone would be upset about the renovations at Lamar. LU will have the finest facilities in the SLC and UNLV I have a quick question for you. If Lamar wasn't thinking of a possible move to FBS in the future 5-10 years away why would they build a home locker-room for 100 athletes?

I think once you see the facilities you will be impressed. Honestly, the upgrades will have Cardinal Stadium as the finest facility in the SLC.

Don't you get it, Abtr? UNLV demands champagne when he's been offered free beer.

[DP#1FAN]

Where do we get the free beer?  Ha ha

[fatelvis04]

Yea, I want free beer too! Sure I don't drink beer, but if it's free I could manage... 

[WOS95]

ill take a nice cold beer anyday over champagne.  ;D

[HouTexan]

mmmm....beer.

[Green Menace]

After looking as what I've seen, I think they've got the right idea here. What they're talking about will give them a nice, reasonable facility and should allow for expansion should the need arise in the future for it.

UNLV, man, I just can't agree with ya. FCS is the way to go. Beaumont likes teams that WIN and a Lamar FCS team is going to be competitive a lot faster than an FBS team.

I think Lamar is approaching this the right way.  Lamar's goal is to be the best in FCS as soon as possible.  They should aspire to be the next Appalacian State, Georgia Southern, Delaware State, Montana, etc.  Speaking of Montana Univ, anyone look at their FCS stadium?  They just about sell it out for every game!  Sure, probably the only game in town up there in the frozen tundra.  The Grizzlies have a very successful program.

[Guest coachacola]

Good to see you posting again Rim.  And UNLV, I know you want the best for Lamar and SETX.  I think Lamar is on the right track and you've just got to have some patience.  The '90s were hard on Lamar and you can't fix it all at once.  But with $20 to $30 million coming to Lamar athletics, in 5 years Lamar will be in a great position to move up.

A nice cold beer would be nice too!

[AggiesAreWe]

Good to see you posting again Rim.  And UNLV, I know you want the best for Lamar and SETX.  I think Lamar is on the right track and you've just got to have some patience.  The '90s were hard on Lamar and you can't fix it all at once.  But with $20 to $30 million coming to Lamar athletics, in 5 years Lamar will be in a great position to move up.

A nice cold beer would be nice too!

The voice of reason. Pay attention UNLV, coachacola knows best.

[fatelvis04]

I got a stupid question. When did Lamar drop football? I'm too young (23) to ever remember them having it, so...

[BearWolf]

1989

[Guest coachacola]

I found this old thread by abovetherim talking about Old Dominion's plan to renovate their 20K seat stadium for $24.8 million.  Here's their end zone facility with luxury seats:

Hopefully Lamar can get their VIP suites and Club Room built and having something similar to what they have.

Link: http://www.setxsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=25269.0

[UNLV]

I don't see why anyone would be upset about the renovations at Lamar. LU will have the finest facilities in the SLC and UNLV I have a quick question for you. If Lamar wasn't thinking of a possible move to FBS in the future 5-10 years away why would they build a home locker-room for 100 athletes?

I think once you see the facilities you will be impressed. Honestly, the upgrades will have Cardinal Stadium as the finest facility in the SLC.

"the finest facilities in the SLC "  ewwww, kinda like said the nicest apartment at Carver Terrance.

Above, play along for arguement sake. Let say Lamar is playing FCS right now. Lets LAMAR finish the season 10-1 and average home

crowd of 17,000. If Lamar wanted to move up today, Where would Lamar go?  SEC?  Big 12?  CUSA? WAC? Sunbelt?

I'm guess you said Sunbelt. Those other conferences would never invite Lamar today or in the future. The Sunbelt might be willing

to take 1-3 teams. There will be as many as 5 teams,6 if you count Lamar, for those 3 spots.

1.USA

2. UTSA  market size advantage over Lamar

3. TSU  school size advantage over Lamar

4. La tech might bite the bullet and go

So you see, Lamar would be at the bottom of the lkist.

Once those spots are filled, what option does Lamar have left to join FBS Conference? 

coach maybe you or your sidekicks could answer this question.

[UNLV]

Sorry about the sloppy illustration, but it makes my point. The stadium needs to be made into

a complete bowl. The ends do not need to be as large as the sides, as illustrated. This would

give a college feel, instead of high school. It'll make the endzones louder, advantage Lamar.

Larger crowds, larger exposer, smaller number jumping off the bandwagon after the first season.

The stadium will look and feel different from the 1980's.

Cost; using concrete stands $3 - $5 million. Aluminum; half that.  This would not break the bank.

Leaving the stadium as is with a few upgrades including VIP's for the rich, will not put fans

in the stadium. Lamar football will fail again.

[TexasTerror]

That $30M that is being thrown around...is that about the capital campaign you guys are unleashing (where not all the $$$ is going to athletics)?

Or is that directly for athletics? What about the capital campaign? I'd assume the capital campaign would not go directly to athletics, unless your institution did not realize the importance of academics.

[UNLV]

After looking as what I've seen, I think they've got the right idea here. What they're talking about will give them a nice, reasonable facility and should allow for expansion should the need arise in the future for it.

UNLV, man, I just can't agree with ya. FCS is the way to go. Beaumont likes teams that WIN and a Lamar FCS team is going to be competitive a lot faster than an FBS team.

I think Lamar is approaching this the right way.  Lamar's goal is to be the best in FCS as soon as possible.  They should aspire to be the next Appalacian State, Georgia Southern, Delaware State, Montana, etc.  Speaking of Montana Univ, anyone look at their FCS stadium?  They just about sell it out for every game!  Sure, probably the only game in town up there in the frozen tundra.  The Grizzlies have a very successful program.

UNT has not won more than 3 games in football the last 3 years. Do you think UNT should drop down to FCS until UNT can compete in FBS?