Predictions For 20-4A This Year?

[D3zii]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.   But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment. 

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'. 

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Well Put..An thats Really True..

[PN-G bamatex]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.   But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment. 

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'. 

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Well Put..An thats Really True..

Thanks. I think I got it all in there. It wasn't a very easy concept to put on paper.

[TradinUp BH]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.   But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment.  

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'.  

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Since 2000 the following schools have won state, some multiple times and all have more than one high school.  Lamar Consolidated, Alamo Heights, Midland Lee, Katy, Mesquite, Denton Ryan, Galena Park North Shore, Tyler Lee, and Lewisville Hebron. Most of your 4A and almost all of 5A programs have different feeder schools and the coaches can't keep up with all of the kids because there is so many. For example, in Katy there is approximately 2,000 kids involved in youth football.  The coaches have no clue until high school. It computes to the more athletes you have, usually the better the program is going to be or you have an exceptional group of kids that can gel together in HS.  There are exceptions to the rule just like anything. ie, WOS, but even then when was the last time they won state.

[WTB]

Central didnt win the district last year Lumberton and Livingston shared the district title. Central also only returns 3 players and lost their head coach.

ive been reading this a few mins now and every post has ozen ranked really low....I was just wanting to know why everyone is counting this team out ....from seeing them in their spring game they seem to be on course to have a pretty good year...of course they lost a few big named players but they seem to have a solid group of kids....and i hear nelson is doing great in keeping them disciplined and motivated

I think the reason most are counting them out is the same some are discounting Vidor. I don't think it is right but a lot predict the future on the results of your past. I guess for some folks , respect must be earned.Lumberton went through it a couple years ago, they won week after week while evryone doubted them every week.The worst case I have seen for this was Nederland during the mid 90's. They couldn't get the respect they deserved.It took a couple years of winning before our local media gave them the respect that they had more than earned. You will just have to prove them wrong week after week to be taken seriously by some.

We won a district title.  We make the playoffs often.  We make a 4 round run in the playoffs and we still don't get respect.  You have to look at who these teams are trying to earn respect from.  Fact is that most of the local media is MC fans and will show respect to them most of the time. 

People fail to realize that Ozen up until 2005 was an elite team.  Which tell me that the fans that don't respect Ozen at all are obviously younger fans or didn't follow HS football untill recently. 

[steptoe]

has anybody heard of this kid in Lumberton named Sean Sparks? I was in lumberton Taco Bell and a bunch of people were goin on and on about him? He is mentioned in Texas football monthly, but not much on stats......maybe a late bloomer?

Apparently a big kid who's put on some size and runs in the 4.7's

[outanup]

I say Vidor,Ned,Ltown and Central. In no particular order.

[Bucof2010]

has anybody heard of this kid in Lumberton named Sean Sparks? I was in lumberton Taco Bell and a bunch of people were goin on and on about him? He is mentioned in Texas football monthly, but not much on stats......maybe a late bloomer?

Apparently a big kid who's put on some size and runs in the 4.7's

I know he's massive

[steptoe]

I read on another post hes 6' 2'' 235 and runs in the 4.7's power cleans 325, supposed to have agreat year

[Guest Pirate V Ball]

VIDOR

LUMBERTON

NEDERLAND

PNG

[PN-G bamatex]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.   But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment.  

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'.  

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Since 2000 the following schools have won state, some multiple times and all have more than one high school.  Lamar Consolidated, Alamo Heights, Midland Lee, Katy, Mesquite, Denton Ryan, Galena Park North Shore, Tyler Lee, and Lewisville Hebron. Most of your 4A and almost all of 5A programs have different feeder schools and the coaches can't keep up with all of the kids because there is so many. For example, in Katy there is approximately 2,000 kids involved in youth football.  The coaches have no clue until high school. It computes to the more athletes you have, usually the better the program is going to be or you have an exceptional group of kids that can gel together in HS.  There are exceptions to the rule just like anything. ie, WOS, but even then when was the last time they won state.

I never said that building a program was impossible in a district like BISD, just that it was very hard to do. The high schools you have mentioned also (as you pointed out) have far more kids than Central and Ozen and, while they do have several feeder schools, the students of those feeder schools have predesignated high schools. The size of each school as well as the predesignated high school make it far easier to make predictions and put together a well rounded team, accordingly.

[Bucof2010]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.  But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment. 

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'. 

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Your argument would be a lot better if you used a team that consistently wins (unlike PNG). What has PNG done any better than the three Beaumont schools?

[PN-G bamatex]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.   But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment. 

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'. 

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Your argument would be a lot better if you used a team that consistently wins (unlike PNG). What has PNG done any better than the three Beaumont schools?

Nederland is the perfect example of a single high school district with a great program, and that's a lot coming from an Indian. Dayton is another good example.

I've already explained why PN-G hasn't had any sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) over the last several years, and my explanation of that situation comes from both first-hand and second-hand experience. I've put my explanation of PN-G's problems below.

My previous posts have not been attacks on any of the BISD high schools (which is how I think some people are taking them) nor anyone's school for that matter. They're just explanations of my theory.

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

[pngfan1]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.   But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment. 

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'. 

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Your argument would be a lot better if you used a team that consistently wins (unlike PNG). What has PNG done any better than the three Beaumont schools?

The only team that has been consistent in 20-4A is Nederland.They haven't won the district consistently but have have by far been the most consistent as far as playoff appearances.The only year I remember them not making the playoffs in the past ten years was the year before last when we shared the district title with Lumberton.Neumann has got them in the playoffs even when they were not as talented.

[BMTSoulja1]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.  But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

Have it ever occured to you that kids change from middle school to high school?  You have coaches looking at the 6'1" athletic 8th grader when in reality, the skinny 5'4" kid will end of being the superstar in HS. 

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment. 

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'. 

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Since 2000 the following schools have won state, some multiple times and all have more than one high school.  Lamar Consolidated, Alamo Heights, Midland Lee, Katy, Mesquite, Denton Ryan, Galena Park North Shore, Tyler Lee, and Lewisville Hebron. Most of your 4A and almost all of 5A programs have different feeder schools and the coaches can't keep up with all of the kids because there is so many. For example, in Katy there is approximately 2,000 kids involved in youth football.  The coaches have no clue until high school. It computes to the more athletes you have, usually the better the program is going to be or you have an exceptional group of kids that can gel together in HS.  There are exceptions to the rule just like anything. ie, WOS, but even then when was the last time they won state.

I never said that building a program was impossible in a district like BISD, just that it was very hard to do. The high schools you have mentioned also (as you pointed out) have far more kids than Central and Ozen and, while they do have several feeder schools, the students of those feeder schools have predesignated high schools. The size of each school as well as the predesignated high school make it far easier to make predictions and put together a well rounded team, accordingly.

Have it ever occured to you that kids change from Middle School to High School?  You have this 6'2" kid in middle school that all the school are after.  In HS, is your kid tha was 5'4" in middle school that will end up being the star. 

[PN-G bamatex]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.   But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

Have it ever occured to you that kids change from middle school to high school?  You have coaches looking at the 6'1" athletic 8th grader when in reality, the skinny 5'4" kid will end of being the superstar in HS. 

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment. 

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'. 

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Since 2000 the following schools have won state, some multiple times and all have more than one high school.  Lamar Consolidated, Alamo Heights, Midland Lee, Katy, Mesquite, Denton Ryan, Galena Park North Shore, Tyler Lee, and Lewisville Hebron. Most of your 4A and almost all of 5A programs have different feeder schools and the coaches can't keep up with all of the kids because there is so many. For example, in Katy there is approximately 2,000 kids involved in youth football.  The coaches have no clue until high school. It computes to the more athletes you have, usually the better the program is going to be or you have an exceptional group of kids that can gel together in HS.  There are exceptions to the rule just like anything. ie, WOS, but even then when was the last time they won state.

I never said that building a program was impossible in a district like BISD, just that it was very hard to do. The high schools you have mentioned also (as you pointed out) have far more kids than Central and Ozen and, while they do have several feeder schools, the students of those feeder schools have predesignated high schools. The size of each school as well as the predesignated high school make it far easier to make predictions and put together a well rounded team, accordingly.

Have it ever occured to you that kids change from Middle School to High School?  You have this 6'2" kid in middle school that all the school are after.  In HS, is your kid tha was 5'4" in middle school that will end up being the star. 

That doesn't negate the need for a good program spanning from middle school through high school. Potential football players need to start learning the fundamentals early and it's a major advantage for coaches to know what they have coming up the ranks so they can start working with their best candidates and groom them to be really good varsity players as early as possible. Football starts before high school, and the more time a coach has to work with his potential starting players as well as his future team as a whole, the better. That's hard to do in a district where you really don't know what you're going to have to work with until the potential varsity player's freshman year.

[TradinUp BH]

Nederland has a nice program right now.  However, the historical information on this site says they have finished 1st once between 1996-2006.    If they were much larger than their competitors(think North Shore) their record would be more impressive.  That's all I'm saying.

You will have up and down years unless you are bigger than most of your opponents.  WOS is obviously a great program. I am sure there are other exceptions across the state, as well.   But even mighty WOS had four 4th place finishes in the 5 years before they dropped to 3A.

While size offers an advantage, it isn't everything. The program, the kids, and the coaching are what make up a good football team. Because of the structure of BISD, it's hard to put together a program and it's even harder to predict which kids each high school will get.

And PN-G's problem was its program for all those years.

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

You need a tiny big of  luck along the way for any kind of state or long playoff run.  This goes for all teams in all classifications that  have deep runs.  I'm not buying most of what you're saying.  Especially about your 'lucky streak' comment. 

I suppose I should be more clear. It's not that Central got to the playoffs and made that run on luck alone. It had the two of the big three components: kids and coaching. It was lacking in the program sector, which is understandable because of BISD's structure. When you've only got two of the three needed components, you'll have some success, but it'll be hard to sustain that success from year to year. Central won't be able to sustain its success over the years without a program, and you can't really build a program in a district like BISD. It'll have some spurts here and there, but no solid, sustained success. The same goes for Ozen and Westbrook.

BISD's structure.  Success here and there.  Spurts.  I think you have listen to some older guys (who knows nothing) to come up with this.  If Central or any BISD school is a hit an miss deal, then what the heck is PN-G?  They appear to be the same way.  They had a brilliant '99 season with Long at the helm and made it to state.  Since then, what have they done playoff wise?  I remember.  They lost to the eventual state champions (Lamar Consolidated) a few years ago.  So I guess it's safe to question PN-G's 'structure' and say that they are less than a hit and miss and only do good in 'spurts'. 

PN-G's problem was its program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, PN-G had a good coaching staff and good kids, but a bad program. Much like Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the combination of the first two components provided for some spurts (which depended more on the kids our team had from year to year than anything else, just like Ozen, Westbrook, and Central), but the lack of the third component made sustained success (meaning success for more than two consecutive seasons) virtually impossible.

The difference here is that PN-G has more potential for a program because, unlike Central, Ozen, and Westbrook, the coaches at PN-G know exactly who is coming up the ranks and their strengths and weaknesses as far out as 2-5 years before those players are on the varsity team, not counting any work that is done in football prior to the athlete's 7th grade year. That one difference is what makes us better-suited to create a program, which is what Coach Faircloth and his team are doing.

Central, Ozen, and Westbrook coaches have virtually no idea who they will be putting on varsity until the freshman year of the potential varsity player. This fact is what makes building a football program (or a program for any sport, for that matter) in BISD much more difficult than building a program in a district where each child's high school is picked the day said child enters kindergarten, such as PN-G or Nederland.

It's not that creating a program is impossible, but rather that it is easier to do and has a better chance of success in a single-high school district than in a district where there are multiple high schools and each child doesn't know what high school said child will be attending until the end of said child's eighth grade year.

Your argument would be a lot better if you used a team that consistently wins (unlike PNG). What has PNG done any better than the three Beaumont schools?

1999? Not trying to argue, but I threw that one at you, sorry ;D

[BigWolf10]

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

Holds true for MC to. We've Had more success at central than both MC teams with the exception of PNG's 89 and 95 runs. MC has just as many drouts. BISD does good IMO ;D

[PN-G bamatex]

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

Holds true for MC to. We've Had more success at central than both MC teams with the exception of PNG's 89 and 95 runs. MC has just as many drouts. BISD does good IMO ;D

That's not necessarily true with Nederland. It is true with PN-G because, as I stated earlier, PN-G has been in the same boat as Central and Ozen because, like Central and Ozen, PN-G had good kids and good coaches, but virtually no program. Nederland has had all of those components for quite some time now. My only point here is that it's harder to build a program in a district like BISD than it is in a district like PN-GISD or NISD. The fact that PN-G has lacked a good program for the last several years is virtually irrelevant to this argument because PN-G didn't have a program as a direct result of the actions of its coaches, not the difficulty associated with building a program in a district like PN-GISD, of which there is much less because of the structure of our district. We could have had a program, we just didn't (for absolutely no reason, I might add). BISD doesn't really have a district-wide program, but in their case, it's understandable because of the difficulty involved in building a program in a district like BISD.

It's probably better to look at it comparatively.

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Look at 2002-Present (I do this because 2002 was the first year that PN-G, Nederland, Central, and Ozen were in the same district).

School Name: Total Playoff Runs/Total Playoff Games/Average Number of Playoff Games per Playoff Run (2002-Present)

Central: 5/12/2.4

Ozen: 3/5/1.67

Nederland: 6/13/2.17

Port Neches-Groves: 3/6/2

School Name: 2002 Win Percentage (End of Season)/2008 Win Percentage (End of Season) [Net Gain/Loss]

Central: .5702/.5694 [-.08]

Ozen: .5926/.5304 [-.0622]

Nederland: .5802/.5827 [+.025]

Port Neches-Groves: .6189/.6189 [+0]

Based on the playoff information, the schools would be ranked as follows:

1. Nederland

2. Central

3. Port Neches-Groves

4. Ozen

Based on the net gains/losses in each school's win percentage, the schools would be ranked as follows:

1. Nederland

2. Port Neches-Groves

3. Central

4. Ozen

As we can see, the district with the predesignated high school and the program is the best of the mentioned four.

[BMTSoulja1]

Did some research and pulled up the Historical Archives, I see!  8) 8)

[Mr. Buddy Garrity]

[PN-G bamatex]

Did some research and pulled up the Historical Archives, I see!   8) 8)

Yup.

[BMTSoulja1]

You get kudos for backing up your opinion!  You're ok with me! 8)

[HonorPrideTradition]

PNG Bandkid...thanks for showing everyone that PNG teaches their students more than just football!!  Way to go kiddo you make us proud!

[BMTSoulja1]

PNG Bandkid...thanks for showing everyone that PNG teaches their students more than just football!!  Way to go kiddo you make us proud!

: : ...  I've given PN-G bandkid  his props, but I wonder why wasn't it you that didn't jump in and prove that point?  We've been having this argument for a few days.  looks like someone wanting to sulk in someones accomplishments to me...

[BigWolf10]

I think if Stump could conrtol his feeder school coaches and players, they would be vying for state titles instead of district runners up each year! Stump does a great job with what he has, but I think WB will continue to struggle beyond Bi-district because of some of the restrictions of the BISD. Just an opinion.

The Beaumont coaches have a struggle no matter what. I honestly believe that Central's run at the playoffs last year was a lucky streak, and what I mean by that is that they had the right combination of players and coaching, but such a combination is rare in a district like BISD. The fact that they had that combination last year was a stroke of good luck, a rare one at that. Every now and then, Ozen, Central, and Westbrook will have one or two consecutive playoff runs, but, because of the structure of the district, won't be able to sustain long term results.

Holds true for MC to. We've Had more success at central than both MC teams with the exception of PNG's 89 and 95 runs. MC has just as many drouts. BISD does good IMO ;D

That's not necessarily true with Nederland. It is true with PN-G because, as I stated earlier, PN-G has been in the same boat as Central and Ozen because, like Central and Ozen, PN-G had good kids and good coaches, but virtually no program. Nederland has had all of those components for quite some time now. My only point here is that it's harder to build a program in a district like BISD than it is in a district like PN-GISD or NISD. The fact that PN-G has lacked a good program for the last several years is virtually irrelevant to this argument because PN-G didn't have a program as a direct result of the actions of its coaches, not the difficulty associated with building a program in a district like PN-GISD, of which there is much less because of the structure of our district. We could have had a program, we just didn't (for absolutely no reason, I might add). BISD doesn't really have a district-wide program, but in their case, it's understandable because of the difficulty involved in building a program in a district like BISD.

It's probably better to look at it comparatively.

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Look at 2002-Present (I do this because 2002 was the first year that PN-G, Nederland, Central, and Ozen were in the same district).

School Name: Total Playoff Runs/Total Playoff Games/Average Number of Playoff Games per Playoff Run (2002-Present)

Central: 5/12/2.4

Ozen: 3/5/1.67

Nederland: 6/13/2.17

Port Neches-Groves: 3/6/2

School Name: 2002 Win Percentage (End of Season)/2008 Win Percentage (End of Season) [Net Gain/Loss]

Central: .5702/.5694 [-.08]

Ozen: .5926/.5304 [-.622]

Nederland: .5802/.5827 [+.025]

Port Neches-Groves: .6189/.6189 [+0]

Based on the playoff information, the schools would be ranked as follows:

1. Nederland

2. Central

3. Port Neches-Groves

4. Ozen

Based on the net gains/losses in each school's win percentage, the schools would be ranked as follows:

1. Nederland

2. Port Neches-Groves

3. Central

4. Ozen

As we can see, the district with the predesignated high school and the program is the best of the mentioned four.

OK I see your argument now. Good point, respect kid.