What is the best thing Bush did during his presidency?

[baddog]

The best thing Bush did was keep this country from being attacked again. I love how Sadaam Insane's two sons...udoo and poo poo were killed in a fire fight. They looked nothing like they did when alive. Sadaam looked appropriate with a noose around his neck. Good for him. The Taliban learned what a daisy cutter is and how well it can implode a mountain. Obama Bin Laden is probably dead. We haven't seen any ''in your face'' propaganda from him lately. I hope he died of kidney failure. I hear it's pretty painful. Or maybe he's under tons of rock in Afghanistan. Zarkawi (sp.) is dead too. Woo Hoo!!!

I guess now that someone is going to tell me how shameful I should feel about my attitude, and how I should be more politically correct and not hurt anyone's feelings. Nope. I'm glad Bush was president for 9/11. Otherwise we would be apologizing to the Saudis for having two skyscrapers in their way.

Unbelievable! But as I think about the history of this country, I guess I shouldn't be too surprised of this type of callous attitude towards human beings. Especially since they had nothing to do with the attacks in NY. You need prayer; and real bad.

Human beings?? I pray everyday that the world be rid of scum like this. I rejoice in their removal. It is what has to be done and a softy can't get the job done. I pray for you that their evil deeds never strike you or your loved ones.

Are the Kurds human beings? How about Afghan women? How about Daniel Pearl, Nick Berg, Paul Johnson, and that Korean guy??

[thetragichippy]

Typial SE Texas thought.... : :

That was a well thought out remark......... typical

That generally means, "I have no other comeback against the facts so I'll have to make some silly quip".

Exactly.  Notice how not one of them have refuted what you posted.

Why argue with the brainwashed Bush followers?....Waste of time...Thats the SE Texas way..  Once again if you folks think that the economic situation that we are in is not a DIRECT result of your boy George W., then you are dumber than I thought you were. HOW can you go back to the Clinton years and attepmt to blame THEM? Our economy was BOOMING during those years! Bush was a BULLY....Just like your forefathers were BULLIES back in their day...Thieves, liars, and backstabbers! ALL OF THEM....Sad. Wanna refute that fact? Didn't think you would. Just thought they could just TAKE what they wanted...JUST LIKE GEORGE W.

That's the most illiterate, ignorant, inaccurate and derogating post I have seen in a long time!

[Guest DickVitale]

If so, refute the fact that George W was a bully....Refute the fact that the reason we invaded Iraq was NOT really because of 9/11....It was for the OIL! Known fact...Refute the way this country was obtained and built. STOLEN...Go ahead...Thats what you WANT people to believe, that its just talk, but its history..Refute it....I dare you.

[tvc184]

.................................HOW can you go back to the Clinton years and attepmt to blame THEM? Our economy was BOOMING during those years! ....................

Yeah, let's bring up the Clinton years. He led a pretty decent economy.... which coincided with the first Republican controlled Congress in 40 years. Clinton could sign nothing that a Republican Congress did not send him.

Bush continued with that even with a slight recession at the end of Clinton's term and then the big financial hit of 9-11. After that, Bush and the Republican Congress again led the strong rally and the stock markets reached all-time record highs...... UNTIL... the Democrats took over Congress two and half years ago. Then it all came crashing down again. Remember, just like Clinton with the Republican Congress, Bush could not sign anything into law that a completely Democratic Congress didn't send him.

That's right DV. The first Republican Congress in 40 years led to the highest stock market rate and one of the best economies in history. I suppose you will conveniently dismiss that the biggest growth in history came under 12 years of a completely Republican controlled Congress. It continued until... well, until the Democrats took over Congress two years ago. You do remember two years ago when the Republicans lost control. The crashing of the banking system and then the bailouts came from a completely Democrat controlled Congress.

I'll guess that you didn't watch the congressional video that I posted from three years ago where the Republicans in open session of a committee said that the banking industry and in particular Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were in trouble. Barney Frank (D Chairman) and Maxine Waters (D Bimbo) praised the fine job that the manager of the two were doing. They were reported to be financially sound and it was nothing but Republican fear tactics. Oops, the Republicans were right three years ago when they said it was in trouble. The Democrats ignored what they were being told and the Kool-Aid Democrats were all too ready to claim that the Republicans were just using fear tactics. No way it could fail. Then when it did fail, they ignore the prior warnings like they were never told... except it is all on video... which I am sure the Democrats will ignore also.

I am sure that DV will have a very sound and highly thought out response like an "Oh yeah!!" or a "Says you!!".

[Guest DickVitale]

And George W had NOTHING to do with those decisions, right? Its Obama's fault, right? : :

[tvc184]

Let's knock off the personal attacks against other members. I have deleted two posts so far. One by DV and one by bb. Quit attacking each other and stick with the rules of the forum or the thread will be removed.

[tvc184]

And George W had NOTHING to do with those decisions, right? Its Obama's fault, right? : :

Not much of it was Obama's fault when he was in the Senate. He never showed up to vote.

[thetragichippy]

If so, refute the fact that George W was a bully....Refute the fact that the reason we invaded Iraq was NOT really because of 9/11....It was for the OIL! Known fact...Refute the way this country was obtained and built. STOLEN...Go ahead...That's what you WANT people to believe, that its just talk, but its history..Refute it....I dare you.

refute the fact that George W was a bully--------He stood up for what he believed.  Kinda like you are doing except with class   

Refute the fact that the reason we invaded Iraq was NOT really because of 9/11....It was for the OIL! Known fact --------- No fact, it was not for oil. If it was, where is it at? 

Refute the way this country was obtained and built. STOLEN --- like most country's, it was fought over. No different from most other countries.

[Gabe]

tvc you crack me up, you have for years now. (And I don't mean in a rude way against your posts) I mean by the way of your words.

[tvc184]

tvc you crack me up, you have for years now. (And I don't mean in a rude way against your posts) I mean by the way of your words.

;D

[BearBryant]

Typial SE Texas thought.... : :

That was a well thought out remark......... typical

That generally means, "I have no other comeback against the facts so I'll have to make some silly quip".

Exactly.  Notice how not one of them have refuted what you posted.

Why argue with the brainwashed Bush followers?....Waste of time...Thats the SE Texas way..  Once again if you folks think that the economic situation that we are in is not a DIRECT result of your boy George W., then you are dumber than I thought you were. HOW can you go back to the Clinton years and attepmt to blame THEM? Our economy was BOOMING during those years! Bush was a BULLY....Just like your forefathers were BULLIES back in their day...Thieves, liars, and backstabbers! ALL OF THEM....Sad. Wanna refute that fact? Didn't think you would. Just thought they could just TAKE what they wanted...JUST LIKE GEORGE W.

Post a fact to refute instead of sad, egotistical,  hate-filled rants.  All I can say is...............wow.

[PURPLE 4EVER]

Why argue with the brainwashed Bush followers?....Waste of time...Thats the SE Texas way..  Once again if you folks think that the economic situation that we are in is not a DIRECT result of your boy George W., then you are dumber than I thought you were. HOW can you go back to the Clinton years and attepmt to blame THEM? Our economy was BOOMING during those years! Bush was a BULLY....Just like your forefathers were BULLIES back in their day...Thieves, liars, and backstabbers! ALL OF THEM....Sad. Wanna refute that fact? Didn't think you would. Just thought they could just TAKE what they wanted...JUST LIKE GEORGE W.

If that is what you think of the USA...

THEN MOVE!

Truth of the matter...

BOTH PARTIES HAVE HOSED THE AMERICAN PUBLIC!

[PN-G bamatex]

Typial SE Texas thought.... : :

That was a well thought out remark......... typical

That generally means, "I have no other comeback against the facts so I'll have to make some silly quip".

Exactly.  Notice how not one of them have refuted what you posted.

Why argue with the brainwashed Bush followers?....Waste of time...Thats the SE Texas way..  Once again if you folks think that the economic situation that we are in is not a DIRECT result of your boy George W., then you are dumber than I thought you were. HOW can you go back to the Clinton years and attepmt to blame THEM? Our economy was BOOMING during those years! Bush was a BULLY....Just like your forefathers were BULLIES back in their day...Thieves, liars, and backstabbers! ALL OF THEM....Sad. Wanna refute that fact? Didn't think you would. Just thought they could just TAKE what they wanted...JUST LIKE GEORGE W.

Were these not your forefathers as well?

Back then, it wasn't called "bullying," it was called "nation-building." It was deemed acceptable and it was something that every nation on the planet did.

Can you prove that President Bush was a "bully"? Can you offer me one tidbit of evidence that might even remotely incriminate him? No, you can't. All you can offer is a few, very questionable "documentaries" that were directed and produced by some very questionable characters. It could be argued that the very same people who have given you these "facts" were the true criminals. It could be argued that they were the ones with the personal agendas, that they were the ones with their own interests in mind, and that they, or, at least, several others of the same political connotation, have played a bigger part in the recent decline of our nation than any other party or politician, including President Bush.

[stang4life]

Wow...finally threats of thread deletions...I was wondering if those were idle actions of the past.  A friend of mine were talking the other day and she mentioned that she had not been here in a while, but that she was shocked and somewhat appalled that all of the negative comments (mainly against the mother of the Laday man) were just allowed to stay on here when before if you put steroids and bc in the same sentence, you were either banned or at the very least your post was deleted.

The fact is that most feel that the "other side" is brainwashed.  Truth is each of us is swayed by our belief and support of which ever party we align ourselves with.  We are not all supposed to think alike...that's what is great about our being able to each have our own opinions. 

As far as the comments about how we came to America.  I've thought about this and we did bully our way into this country.  As far as the Indians not having anything showing what they owned...by whose standards?  Just because our forefathers came from lands where pieces of paper or boundary lines or whatever separated people's property...I don't think that that is how the Indians' way of doing things worked.  We did some pretty horrific things to "get our way" and before someone says they did too...naturally they did...they were defending THEIR homelands.  The way we took over is not so different than how some disgusting dictators in the last 70 years  that we have seen and defended against. 

And, before someone says if you don't like it, yadayadayada...I am proud to be an American, but I am not proud of everything we have done and I believe that that's ok.  As for the forefathers, yes...they were so insightful (still amazes me), but they were also a little cowardly that they drafted this amazing constitution that was the basis of what this country stands for.  Wait, I'll rephrase that...it was a constitution that guaranteed freedoms and liberties for some, but not all.  That cannot be downplayed.  They were not willing or able to do what was necessary to make it work...because, you can't write this document and guarantee every person freedoms and not include everybody...African-Americans, indentured whites, Native Americans, and women.  Not including EVERYBODY negates the whole purpose.  I can't make up for what I think were wrongdoings of anyone who oppressed another...I can pretty much tell you that my family was probably one of the indentured families, but I will admit that these were mistakes that should have never happened.

Anyway...these are just some of my independent opinions.  They really aren't related to the left side or the right side...just my side.

[tvc184]

Yep, we bullied our way in and took some land. As I said in another post, every piece of land ever owned by any person or the government was taken by somebody that lived on or used the land.

Every group of people and every race did it. Heck, even the American Indians did it to each other. So what's the big deal? That is the very way countries were formed from mere collections of huts, then cities and then countries. So yes, you are correct.

The Constitution does guarantee liberty for everyone. I see no slaves today. The fact is that many people back then knew slavery was abhorring, it was the law of the land in this part of England, of which we were a part at the time of the Revolutionary War. It is true that many people let it go because of political expedience. They may never have gotten the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution passed if they drew a line in the sand and said no slaves. If there had been no slaves, then there may have been no country. The Constitution that did not free everyone immediately, eventually did.

The Constitution did not create slavery nor did it condone slavery. It did leave slavery in place that was here long before the Constitution was ever thought up, before any war of indepence was ever contemplated and within 74 years of its signing, the country fought the Civil War that ended slavery. The United States of America (not counting the Confederate States) lost 140,000 soldiers killed during the Civil War. The USA lost more people in a battle to free the slaves than in World War I, the Korean War, the Vietnam War, the Gulf War, the Afghanistan War and the Iraq War combined. Think about that for a minute.

[Guest DickVitale]

Excellent post by stang and I will admit, tvc makes a fairly good point as well, but I have do disagree when you say that taking one's land is "no big deal". It is a VERY big deal...You don't see that as a wrong doing, tvc? Can you name a group of Africans that stole any land? What about on the Australian continent? You said it was a common practice and I sorely disagree with you...It was common among EUROPEANS, maybe, but it was not a common practice to bully land and cheat people out of what was already claimed. 

Its very funny how this culture has tried to rip everyone out of their own cultures and mold them into this European fairy tale.  For example, it is SO strange how every movie that portrays Cleopatra, shows her as this rich powerful white woman...She was EGYPTIAN...Last I checked Egypt is in AFRICA, and Cleopatra did NOT look like the one on the big screens or in the textbooks...However, this country was so adamant about hiding the truth, they want the public to believe that the QUEEN of EGYPT was a white woman..Thats just a single example, but this sort of thing has gone on for centuries, and yet today, the lies continue. Lets not even speak about how the Native Americans were ripped of THEIR culture.  When are we going to get the truth from this great country about what is real? No more fabrications...SLAVES BUILT this country, not the slave owners (your forefathers) It was built by SLAVES...Piece by piece, but you will NEVER see that part in a textbook for your kids to know the truth. Its time folks. Its time. And not taking away from what the anglo saxon race has done in their own right throughout history, because they fought and died for ALL our civil liberties too...But stop making excuses and tell the truth...I'm not a racist, just a realist...

[thetragichippy]

Excellent post by stang and I will admit, tvc makes a fairly good point as well, but I have do disagree when you say that taking one's land is "no big deal". It is a VERY big deal...You don't see that as a wrong doing, tvc? Can you name a group of Africans that stole any land? What about on the Australian continent? You said it was a common practice and I sorely disagree with you...It was common among EUROPEANS, maybe, but it was not a common practice to bully land and cheat people out of what was already claimed.  

Its very funny how this culture has tried to rip everyone out of their own cultures and mold them into this European fairy tale.  For example, it is SO strange how every movie that portrays Cleopatra, shows her as this rich powerful white woman...She was EGYPTIAN...Last I checked Egypt is in AFRICA, and Cleopatra did NOT look like the one on the big screens or in the textbooks...However, this country was so adamant about hiding the truth, they want the public to believe that the QUEEN of EGYPT was a white woman..Thats just a single example, but this sort of thing has gone on for centuries, and yet today, the lies continue. Lets not even speak about how the Native Americans were ripped of THEIR culture.  When are we going to get the truth from this great country about what is real? No more fabrications...SLAVES BUILT this country, not the slave owners (your forefathers) It was built by SLAVES...Piece by piece, but you will NEVER see that part in a textbook for your kids to know the truth. Its time folks. Its time. And not taking away from what the anglo saxon race has done in their own right throughout history, because they fought and died for ALL our civil liberties too...But stop making excuses and tell the truth...I'm not a racist, just a realist...

OK MR. Realist......

Fifteen Countries

There are currently fifteen African countries involved in war, or are experiencing post-war conflict and tension. In West Africa, the countries include Cote d'Ivoire, Guinea, Liberia, Nigeria, Sierra Leone, and Togo. In East Africa, the countries include Eritrea, Ethiopia, Somalia, Sudan, Uganda. In Central Africa, the countries include Burundi, Democratic Republic of the Congo, Rwanda. In North Africa, the country is Algeria and in South Africa, the countries include Angola and Zimbabwe.

The Base of the Wars

At the base of these wars is the rich natural resources each of these poor countries hold of timber, oil or diamonds, compounded in many cases by the foreign extractive industries presence, their opaque, unreported payments to the governments and the governments' opaque, unreported use of the money to create and fund wars. The wars serve the purpose of creating a distraction, as the countries and their fleeing, displaced citizens are robbed of their countries' natural resources, easily converted to cash, for the personal use and fortunes of ruling parties. Tribal conflict is deliberately antagonized, so it can be blamed for the conflict. See Countries in Conflict News for up to the half hour country-specific news.

Slave owners were your forefathers to Dick.  The Europeans purchased them from Aficans. Black people sold other black people.

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The slave trade in Africa existed for thousands of years. The first main route passed through the Sahara, tying in to the Arab slave trade. After the European Age of Exploration, African slaves became part of the Atlantic slave trade, from which comes the modern, Western conception of slavery as an institution of African-descended slaves and non-African slave owners. Despite its illegality, slavery continues in some parts of the world, including Africa.

And it's still going on today........good thing you live in the FREE USA!

[PN-G bamatex]

Excellent post by stang and I will admit, tvc makes a fairly good point as well, but I have do disagree when you say that taking one's land is "no big deal". It is a VERY big deal...You don't see that as a wrong doing, tvc? Can you name a group of Africans that stole any land? What about on the Australian continent? You said it was a common practice and I sorely disagree with you...It was common among EUROPEANS, maybe, but it was not a common practice to bully land and cheat people out of what was already claimed. 

Its very funny how this culture has tried to rip everyone out of their own cultures and mold them into this European fairy tale.  For example, it is SO strange how every movie that portrays Cleopatra, shows her as this rich powerful white woman...She was EGYPTIAN...Last I checked Egypt is in AFRICA, and Cleopatra did NOT look like the one on the big screens or in the textbooks...However, this country was so adamant about hiding the truth, they want the public to believe that the QUEEN of EGYPT was a white woman..Thats just a single example, but this sort of thing has gone on for centuries, and yet today, the lies continue. Lets not even speak about how the Native Americans were ripped of THEIR culture.  When are we going to get the truth from this great country about what is real? No more fabrications...SLAVES BUILT this country, not the slave owners (your forefathers) It was built by SLAVES...Piece by piece, but you will NEVER see that part in a textbook for your kids to know the truth. Its time folks. Its time. And not taking away from what the anglo saxon race has done in their own right throughout history, because they fought and died for ALL our civil liberties too...But stop making excuses and tell the truth...I'm not a racist, just a realist...

Here is a link to an article about warring tribes in Africa:

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Excellent post by stang and I will admit, tvc makes a fairly good point as well, but I have do disagree when you say that taking one's land is "no big deal". It is a VERY big deal...You don't see that as a wrong doing, tvc? Can you name a group of Africans that stole any land? What about on the Australian continent? You said it was a common practice and I sorely disagree with you...It was common among EUROPEANS, maybe, but it was not a common practice to bully land and cheat people out of what was already claimed. 

Its very funny how this culture has tried to rip everyone out of their own cultures and mold them into this European fairy tale.  For example, it is SO strange how every movie that portrays Cleopatra, shows her as this rich powerful white woman...She was EGYPTIAN...Last I checked Egypt is in AFRICA, and Cleopatra did NOT look like the one on the big screens or in the textbooks...However, this country was so adamant about hiding the truth, they want the public to believe that the QUEEN of EGYPT was a white woman..Thats just a single example, but this sort of thing has gone on for centuries, and yet today, the lies continue. Lets not even speak about how the Native Americans were ripped of THEIR culture.  When are we going to get the truth from this great country about what is real? No more fabrications...SLAVES BUILT this country, not the slave owners (your forefathers) It was built by SLAVES...Piece by piece, but you will NEVER see that part in a textbook for your kids to know the truth. Its time folks. Its time. And not taking away from what the anglo saxon race has done in their own right throughout history, because they fought and died for ALL our civil liberties too...But stop making excuses and tell the truth...I'm not a racist, just a realist...

Most notably, the British.

Here is a link to a list of indigenous Australian tribes that have fought over territory on the Australian continent for centuries:

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Excellent post by stang and I will admit, tvc makes a fairly good point as well, but I have do disagree when you say that taking one's land is "no big deal". It is a VERY big deal...You don't see that as a wrong doing, tvc? Can you name a group of Africans that stole any land? What about on the Australian continent? You said it was a common practice and I sorely disagree with you...It was common among EUROPEANS, maybe, but it was not a common practice to bully land and cheat people out of what was already claimed. 

Its very funny how this culture has tried to rip everyone out of their own cultures and mold them into this European fairy tale.  For example, it is SO strange how every movie that portrays Cleopatra, shows her as this rich powerful white woman...She was EGYPTIAN...Last I checked Egypt is in AFRICA, and Cleopatra did NOT look like the one on the big screens or in the textbooks...However, this country was so adamant about hiding the truth, they want the public to believe that the QUEEN of EGYPT was a white woman..Thats just a single example, but this sort of thing has gone on for centuries, and yet today, the lies continue. Lets not even speak about how the Native Americans were ripped of THEIR culture.  When are we going to get the truth from this great country about what is real? No more fabrications...SLAVES BUILT this country, not the slave owners (your forefathers) It was built by SLAVES...Piece by piece, but you will NEVER see that part in a textbook for your kids to know the truth. Its time folks. Its time. And not taking away from what the anglo saxon race has done in their own right throughout history, because they fought and died for ALL our civil liberties too...But stop making excuses and tell the truth...I'm not a racist, just a realist...

Are you suggesting that a white actress should not be allowed to play the part of Cleopatra simply because she is white?

[thetragichippy]

Careful PNG BAndKId.....you might drown them in facts....   

[tvc184]

................. Can you name a group of Africans that stole any land? ................

I'm sure that I could do a google search and come up with some examples of Africans taking land.

But I will leave you with this about Africans and the taking of something. When slave trade was big business, it wasn't white people going into Africa and trekking cross country capturing slaves. It was other Africans. Worried about land? How about people's lives? Black Africans captured and sold other black Africans for money. As despicable as slavery is, it was not a completely white venture but a collaboration between black tribal chiefs in Africa who captured and sold slaves for money to the (mostly) whites. Who is the most guilty party? Is it the people that bought slaves (many of whom were black themselves) or was it the people that went into the regions to capture them and turn them into slaves to be sold for profit?

While looking it up, I found quite interestingly, the first black African that was declared legally a slave in a court in what is now the USA was in 1654. A man named John Casor went to court in the Virginia colony and was declared the legal property for life of Anthony Johnson. Who was Anthony Johnson? He was a free black man.

[baddog]

Excellent post by stang and I will admit, tvc makes a fairly good point as well, but I have do disagree when you say that taking one's land is "no big deal". It is a VERY big deal...You don't see that as a wrong doing, tvc? Can you name a group of Africans that stole any land? What about on the Australian continent? You said it was a common practice and I sorely disagree with you...It was common among EUROPEANS, maybe, but it was not a common practice to bully land and cheat people out of what was already claimed. 

Its very funny how this culture has tried to rip everyone out of their own cultures and mold them into this European fairy tale.  For example, it is SO strange how every movie that portrays Cleopatra, shows her as this rich powerful white woman...She was EGYPTIAN...Last I checked Egypt is in AFRICA, and Cleopatra did NOT look like the one on the big screens or in the textbooks...However, this country was so adamant about hiding the truth, they want the public to believe that the QUEEN of EGYPT was a white woman..Thats just a single example, but this sort of thing has gone on for centuries, and yet today, the lies continue. Lets not even speak about how the Native Americans were ripped of THEIR culture.  When are we going to get the truth from this great country about what is real? No more fabrications...SLAVES BUILT this country, not the slave owners (your forefathers) It was built by SLAVES...Piece by piece, but you will NEVER see that part in a textbook for your kids to know the truth. Its time folks. Its time. And not taking away from what the anglo saxon race has done in their own right throughout history, because they fought and died for ALL our civil liberties too...But stop making excuses and tell the truth...I'm not a racist, just a realist...

tvc's, bandkid's, and hippy's posts covered most of this. I am only interested in if you are inferring that Cleopatra was black. If so, I wonder if they were slave owners? Took a long time and lots of people to build all those pyramids.

[thetragichippy]

Excellent post by stang and I will admit, tvc makes a fairly good point as well, but I have do disagree when you say that taking one's land is "no big deal". It is a VERY big deal...You don't see that as a wrong doing, tvc? Can you name a group of Africans that stole any land? What about on the Australian continent? You said it was a common practice and I sorely disagree with you...It was common among EUROPEANS, maybe, but it was not a common practice to bully land and cheat people out of what was already claimed. 

Its very funny how this culture has tried to rip everyone out of their own cultures and mold them into this European fairy tale.  For example, it is SO strange how every movie that portrays Cleopatra, shows her as this rich powerful white woman...She was EGYPTIAN...Last I checked Egypt is in AFRICA, and Cleopatra did NOT look like the one on the big screens or in the textbooks...However, this country was so adamant about hiding the truth, they want the public to believe that the QUEEN of EGYPT was a white woman..Thats just a single example, but this sort of thing has gone on for centuries, and yet today, the lies continue. Lets not even speak about how the Native Americans were ripped of THEIR culture.  When are we going to get the truth from this great country about what is real? No more fabrications...SLAVES BUILT this country, not the slave owners (your forefathers) It was built by SLAVES...Piece by piece, but you will NEVER see that part in a textbook for your kids to know the truth. Its time folks. Its time. And not taking away from what the anglo saxon race has done in their own right throughout history, because they fought and died for ALL our civil liberties too...But stop making excuses and tell the truth...I'm not a racist, just a realist...

tvc's, bandkid's, and hippy's posts covered most of this. I am only interested in if you are inferring that Cleopatra was black. If so, I wonder if they were slave owners? Took a long time and lots of people to build all those pyramids.

Come on Man.......You know the history books were written to cover up all the bad things in the world........    

[tvc184]

There's no dodging the history of slavery, land grabs and conquests. Anyone that portrays it as a one race venture however, is ignoring the truth. All have partaken in the feast.

[baddog]

Sorry guys. It seems we can't talk current affairs or 'recent' history without going back hundreds of years to serve other's agendas. I just decided to go back thousands.

tvc, hippy, and bandkid (is he just a kid?) make excellent points and are well rounded in their knowledge. I struggle at times with memory loss. I'll just jump in there when I see fit.

[thetragichippy]

Sorry guys. It seems we can't talk current affairs or 'recent' history without going back hundreds of years to serve other's agendas. I just decided to go back thousands.

tvc, hippy, and bandkid (is he just a kid?) make excellent points and are well rounded in their knowledge. I struggle at times with memory loss. I'll just jump in there when I see fit.

Baddog...you jump in there WHENEVER you want! This is a public forum and IMO all are welcome. Your right, we can't talk about current events because there is "a few" that try to blame everything on the past. There is one I have no hope for (actually 2), but BlueDove I think, just trys to get us to see things through his eyes. I hardly ever agree, because he bases his thoughts through emotion, but he keeps me on my toes.  BandKid is in high school(I hope, because if he's any younger.....) and I hope my son ends up with as much knowledge as he has. Also, don't be afraid to google.....you can get lots of information that way. Just make sure the information is factual and not an opinion.