If you can read Rick Reilly!

[shorttexas1]

You ought to be able to read another opinion.  I wonder if my Caucasian brethren will bother to read Rolland Martin's rebuttal to Rick Reilly?  He did not defend Wise, he just responded to Reilly's one-sided article!  Rolland Martin is a CNN columnist, of African American decent and a Yate's HD alumni.......


http://www.rolandsmartin.com/blog/index.php/2010/03/11/rick-reilly-needs-grow-a-pair/.

[bullets13]

it's as equally one-sided as Reilly's, and while i have no problem with his perspective, i still completely disagree with it.    I'll respect the opinion of an eleven-time national sportswriter of the year winner over that of an admittedly biased Yates alum.  i also think that the "basic fact" that he's claiming reilly got wrong is actually right.  if i'm not mistaken, Yates tried unsuccessfully earlier in the season to break the 100 point record, and failed, but have now successfully done it later in the season.  it's really a pretty insignificant point, one way or the other, but seeing as it is martin's big finish, i felt the need to refute it.  i'll agree with Martin's assessment that the kids are class acts, as what i've seen and read would indicate that to be true.  i don't, however, recall anywhere in Reilly's article where he attacks the kids.  one thing that's bothering me: people keep bringing up 60 point wins in football and trying to compare it to what Yates is doing.  i still think that is BS. there are certain unwritten rules in every sport:  you don't pass when you're up big in football, you don't stretch out base hits or bunt men over when you're up big in baseball, you use one-touch passes or only score on crosses in soccer, YOU DON'T PRESS IN THE SECOND HALF WHEN YOU'RE UP BIG IN BASKETBALL.  What's the difference between a football team winning by 60 or 70 and Yates winning by 100?  I've never heard of a HS football team that was up 50 at the half that came out and kept airing the ball out to try and score as many point as possible.  If the 3rd stringers come in and run the ball the entire 2nd half and score a couple of touchdowns, no problem.  If you put in the backups, but let your backup QB pass for 300 yards and 5 scores in the 2nd half and score 100 points, you're a tool.  When you're 3rd string is just a shade weaker than your 1st string, and you have them press and TRY to run up the score as high as you can, that's classless (In My Opinion).  Whether you agree with Wise or not, quit trying to compare him to coaches in other sports who actually make an effort to control the score and keep the clock running.  

[ST413]

Well said Bullets.  One more thing on my mind here.  It was said somewhere in this discussion don't remember which thread or when that Yates was pouring it on for the national "title".  I am one of the limited number of us southast texans who have driven to houston and watched Yates play. Yes it was only one game.  What I saw was a team with some very good players who are great at what they do.  However they looked vulnerable in a half court game.  If they want this so called title, I feel they would need to be a team who excels in th complete game not just one facet of it.  I have no problems with the players at all.  What I have seen from them has not been negative in any way.  To make themselves a truly great basketball team,  I just feel they needed to be a more complete team,  meaning in al facets of the game.  They had plenty of chances to work on it. Why didn't they?  They may well have the team that could have won state playing that style as well but it would not have been as easy for them.  I do have to admit I am no Coach Wise fan.  After seeing him continue his press with huge leads and hearing his interviews,  I have the feeling like many others:  He is all about Me.  Yes he gives his players credit but I have yet to hear him give his opposition any.  Maybe he has and I haven't seen it but not to my knowledge.  So back to my question "Why hasn't Yates taken the opportunity to work on their half court game?"  Maybe it is truly that Wise wants his team to know never to let up,  but maybe it is also that he knows this is where he is vulnerable(not his team but himself as a coach).  Maybe he is scared that it will be shown that his weakness is setting up an offense or defense in the half court and making the adjustments necessary to excel in the half court game.  If so,  he has failed himself this year as he had the perfect opportunity to work on his weakness.

[CThoops]

[quote name="ST413" post="776482" timestamp="1268460671"]
Well said Bullets.  One more thing on my mind here.  It was said somewhere in this discussion don't remember which thread or when that Yates was pouring it on for the national "title".  I am one of the limited number of us southast texans who have driven to houston and watched Yates play. Yes it was only one game.  What I saw was a team with some very good players who are great at what they do.  However they looked vulnerable in a half court game.  If they want this so called title, I feel they would need to be a team who excels in th complete game not just one facet of it.  I have no problems with the players at all.  What I have seen from them has not been negative in any way.  To make themselves a truly great basketball team,  I just feel they needed to be a more complete team,  meaning in al facets of the game.  They had plenty of chances to work on it. Why didn't they?  They may well have the team that could have won state playing that style as well but it would not have been as easy for them.  I do have to admit I am no Coach Wise fan.  After seeing him continue his press with huge leads and hearing his interviews,  I have the feeling like many others:  He is all about Me.  Yes he gives his players credit but I have yet to hear him give his opposition any.  Maybe he has and I haven't seen it but not to my knowledge.  So back to my question "Why hasn't Yates taken the opportunity to work on their half court game?"  Maybe it is truly that Wise wants his team to know never to let up,  but maybe it is also that he knows this is where he is vulnerable(not his team but himself as a coach).  Maybe he is scared that it will be shown that his weakness is setting up an offense or defense in the half court and making the adjustments necessary to excel in the half court game.  If so,  he has failed himself this year as he had the perfect opportunity to work on his weakness.
[/quote]

Didn't Yates lose the last time they pulled the press? Why stop doing what you are good at? Why play the opposite style of what this group has practiced for years now? What Yates does as team makes sense to them. As for Wise, he is out to to make a name for himself and his team. Records, tropheys, and national buzz is what this team and this coach is out to get. Face it. Right or wrong by anyone's opinion.

People to need to let it go about Yates. Just have fun watching a great team play basketball at a high level. Isn't that what the game is about? Playing hard to achieve excellence?

[xLmCoog88]

[quote name="bullets13000" post="776473" timestamp="1268459598"]
it's as equally one-sided as Reilly's, and while i have no problem with his perspective, i still completely disagree with it.    I'll respect the opinion of an eleven-time national sportswriter of the year winner over that of an admittedly biased Yates alum.  i also think that the "basic fact" that he's claiming reilly got wrong is actually right.  if i'm not mistaken, Yates tried unsuccessfully earlier in the season to break the 100 point record, and failed, but have now successfully done it later in the season.  it's really a pretty insignificant point, one way or the other, but seeing as it is martin's big finish, i felt the need to refute it.  i'll agree with Martin's assessment that the kids are class acts, as what i've seen and read would indicate that to be true.  i don't, however, recall anywhere in Reilly's article where he attacks the kids.  one thing that's bothering me: people keep bringing up 60 point wins in football and trying to compare it to what Yates is doing.  i still think that is BS. there are certain unwritten rules in every sport:  you don't pass when you're up big in football, you don't stretch out base hits or bunt men over when you're up big in baseball, you use one-touch passes or only score on crosses in soccer, YOU DON'T PRESS IN THE SECOND HALF WHEN YOU'RE UP BIG IN BASKETBALL.  What's the difference between a football team winning by 60 or 70 and Yates winning by 100?  I've never heard of a HS football team that was up 50 at the half that came out and kept airing the ball out to try and score as many point as possible.  If the 3rd stringers come in and run the ball the entire 2nd half and score a couple of touchdowns, no problem.  If you put in the backups, but let your backup QB pass for 300 yards and 5 scores in the 2nd half and score 100 points, you're a tool.  When you're 3rd string is just a shade weaker than your 1st string, and you have them press and TRY to run up the score as high as you can, that's classless (In My Opinion).  Whether you agree with Wise or not, quit trying to compare him to coaches in other sports who actually make an effort to control the score and keep the clock running.  
[/quote]

[color=navy][b] B I N G O ![/b][/color]  ;)

[color=navy][b]Certain people commented on my response to our '06 FB playoff game with Yates with rose tinted glasses on to say the least. It's really pathetic that a thread has to be locked because people of ANY ethnicity feel the need to pull the race card out where it has no place being! Also, to those who wanted to point out we scored a total of 46 after being up 31-0 at the half...it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure if we were primarily a passing offense that we could have used Wise's mentality and continued to throw, throw and throw some more. Instead we took out starters and ran the ball primarily the second half and ONLY SCORED 15 points instead of 30 or even 40 more. Pick and choose parts of my posts out if you feel it's the only way to validate your position but make no mistake about it, you get it but you simply won't admit it. This is the last post I will make on this board in regards to Yates....I wish them luck in their game today but please just win any way you see fit and go away! Bash me, trash me or whatever silly thing you feel the need to do but I promise you wont hear a lick from me on this topic anymore.[/b][/color]

[ST413]

[quote name="dogs1218" post="776491" timestamp="1268466194"]
[quote author=ST413 link=topic=67270.msg776482#msg776482 date=1268460671]
Well said Bullets.  One more thing on my mind here.  It was said somewhere in this discussion don't remember which thread or when that Yates was pouring it on for the national "title".  I am one of the limited number of us southast texans who have driven to houston and watched Yates play. Yes it was only one game.  What I saw was a team with some very good players who are great at what they do.  However they looked vulnerable in a half court game.  If they want this so called title, I feel they would need to be a team who excels in th complete game not just one facet of it.  I have no problems with the players at all.  What I have seen from them has not been negative in any way.  To make themselves a truly great basketball team,  I just feel they needed to be a more complete team,  meaning in al facets of the game.  They had plenty of chances to work on it. Why didn't they?  They may well have the team that could have won state playing that style as well but it would not have been as easy for them.  I do have to admit I am no Coach Wise fan.  After seeing him continue his press with huge leads and hearing his interviews,  I have the feeling like many others:  He is all about Me.  Yes he gives his players credit but I have yet to hear him give his opposition any.  Maybe he has and I haven't seen it but not to my knowledge.  So back to my question "Why hasn't Yates taken the opportunity to work on their half court game?"  Maybe it is truly that Wise wants his team to know never to let up,  but maybe it is also that he knows this is where he is vulnerable(not his team but himself as a coach).  Maybe he is scared that it will be shown that his weakness is setting up an offense or defense in the half court and making the adjustments necessary to excel in the half court game.  If so,  he has failed himself this year as he had the perfect opportunity to work on his weakness.
[/quote]

[b][b]Didn't Yates lose the last time they pulled the press? Why stop doing what you are good at? Why play the opposite style of what this group has practiced for years now?[/b][/b] What Yates does as team makes sense to them. As for Wise, he is out to to make a name for himself and his team. Records, tropheys, and national buzz is what this team and this coach is out to get. Face it. Right or wrong by anyone's opinion.

People to need to let it go about Yates. Just have fun watching a great team play basketball at a high level. Isn't that what the game is about? Playing hard to achieve excellence?
[/quote]

Thank you!!  You just made my point.  When you have a 88 point lead at half practice what you aren't good at.  Make yourself even better.

[CThoops]

[quote name="ST413" post="776559" timestamp="1268498050"]
[quote author=dogs1218 link=topic=67270.msg776491#msg776491 date=1268466194]
[quote author=ST413 link=topic=67270.msg776482#msg776482 date=1268460671]
Well said Bullets.  One more thing on my mind here.  It was said somewhere in this discussion don't remember which thread or when that Yates was pouring it on for the national "title".  I am one of the limited number of us southast texans who have driven to houston and watched Yates play. Yes it was only one game.  What I saw was a team with some very good players who are great at what they do.  However they looked vulnerable in a half court game.  If they want this so called title, I feel they would need to be a team who excels in th complete game not just one facet of it.  I have no problems with the players at all.  What I have seen from them has not been negative in any way.  To make themselves a truly great basketball team,  I just feel they needed to be a more complete team,  meaning in al facets of the game.  They had plenty of chances to work on it. Why didn't they?  They may well have the team that could have won state playing that style as well but it would not have been as easy for them.  I do have to admit I am no Coach Wise fan.  After seeing him continue his press with huge leads and hearing his interviews,  I have the feeling like many others:  He is all about Me.  Yes he gives his players credit but I have yet to hear him give his opposition any.  Maybe he has and I haven't seen it but not to my knowledge.  So back to my question "Why hasn't Yates taken the opportunity to work on their half court game?"  Maybe it is truly that Wise wants his team to know never to let up,  but maybe it is also that he knows this is where he is vulnerable(not his team but himself as a coach).  Maybe he is scared that it will be shown that his weakness is setting up an offense or defense in the half court and making the adjustments necessary to excel in the half court game.  If so,  he has failed himself this year as he had the perfect opportunity to work on his weakness.
[/quote]

[b][b]Didn't Yates lose the last time they pulled the press? Why stop doing what you are good at? Why play the opposite style of what this group has practiced for years now?[/b][/b] What Yates does as team makes sense to them. As for Wise, he is out to to make a name for himself and his team. Records, tropheys, and national buzz is what this team and this coach is out to get. Face it. Right or wrong by anyone's opinion.

People to need to let it go about Yates. Just have fun watching a great team play basketball at a high level. Isn't that what the game is about? Playing hard to achieve excellence?
[/quote]

Thank you!!  You just made my point.  When you have a 88 point lead at half practice what you aren't good at.  Make yourself even better.
[/quote]

I thought you might like that  ;)

[shorttexas1]

It was meant to be the other side... It is debating, two different stances... It is good to watch CNN and Fox if you want to get both sides of the story (analogy)!  Just wanted to be informative!

[shorttexas1]

These kids know one way to play... If a team had good enough guards to put this team in the half court, Yates would lose.  Keeping them in the press allows them to mask that deficiency.  I am sure they could blow a twenty point lead as fast as they built one if they stop pressing.  I have said it over and over again that this is not the most talented team.  What I respect is Coach Wise putting together a scheme that allows this team with little true skill to be so dominant.

When I was coaching summer league back in 2001 I played the Silsbee/Kountze/Jasper team.  They did it to me and I did nort feel that they were wrong...  They dominated with a three-quarter court press.  They backed off late in the 4th when they were up by 40. The next time I played them we were more competitive but in the end we still lost by 15.  Half of the issue was that the kids kind of feared that team.  They were never sure of themselves, eventhough the scheme I created had worked, we were down 5 to start the 4th.  But the stigma was too much.  I feel that Yates has done the same thing to its opponents.  Kids and Coaches come in with a certain kinf of fear and make more mistakes than they normally would.  coaches over analyze and the kids are super nervous.  To me its good coaching.

[ST413]

Blowing a 20 point lead...OK but not 88 or some of the other huge leads they have had. Those are when they should be working on other things.

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="shorttexas1" post="776685" timestamp="1268518187"]
These kids know one way to play... If a team had good enough guards to put this team in the half court, Yates would lose.  Keeping them in the press allows them to mask that deficiency.  I am sure they could blow a twenty point lead as fast as they built one if they stop pressing.  I have said it over and over again that this is not the most talented team.  What I respect is Coach Wise putting together a scheme that allows this team with little true skill to be so dominant.

When I was coaching summer league back in 2001 I played the Silsbee/Kountze/Jasper team.  They did it to me and I did nort feel that they were wrong...  They dominated with a three-quarter court press.  They backed off late in the 4th when they were up by 40. The next time I played them we were more competitive but in the end we still lost by 15.  Half of the issue was that the kids kind of feared that team.  They were never sure of themselves, eventhough the scheme I created had worked, we were down 5 to start the 4th.  But the stigma was too much.  I feel that Yates has done the same thing to its opponents.  Kids and Coaches come in with a certain kinf of fear and make more mistakes than they normally would.  coaches over analyze and the kids are super nervous.  To me its good coaching.
[/quote]They still don't get t

[bullets13]

[quote name="RP3" post="776948" timestamp="1268595441"]
And they never will....I would not waste my time debating it with them....They will never get it because they were either on the losing end of butt kickings or have never played a day in their lives and therefore just hate winners, or don't understand anyway...Thats just a fact...They want to talk about class? Ever been to a baseball game when PNG plays Central? or Bellaire vs Wheatley in baseball in Houston? BUt because its BASKETBALL, it becomes "classless" all of a sudden.. I rest my case.
[/quote]

so if they were on the end of these butt kickings, and are still upset about them, would that mean that maybe these buttkickings actually DO have an effect on the athletes that suffer them?

[bullets13]

[quote name="RP3" post="777039" timestamp="1268615086"]
[quote author=bullets13000 link=topic=67270.msg776996#msg776996 date=1268607771]
[quote author=RP3 link=topic=67270.msg776948#msg776948 date=1268595441]
And they never will....I would not waste my time debating it with them....They will never get it because they were either on the losing end of butt kickings or have never played a day in their lives and therefore just hate winners, or don't understand anyway...Thats just a fact...They want to talk about class? Ever been to a baseball game when PNG plays Central? or Bellaire vs Wheatley in baseball in Houston? BUt because its BASKETBALL, it becomes "classless" all of a sudden.. I rest my case.
[/quote]

so if they were on the end of these butt kickings, and are still upset about them, would that mean that maybe these buttkickings actually DO have an effect on the athletes that suffer them?
[/quote]
Not to be cruel or harsh, but don't you guys think that if a person is STILL upset about losing a HIGH SCHOOL game as an adult, they probably needed psychological evaluation prior to? I would say yes.....Get over it. Everybody can't win, otherwise why take score? Everyone is playing with the same ball, by the same rules...Same classification even, according to the UIL.....Its like death, its a part of life. There are many other important things to focus on in your life other than a basketball game. ::)
[/quote]

i definitely see your point.  i've been fortunate enough, for the most part, to not be on too many "bad" teams.  i've still taken some shelackings over my lifetime, and although i certainly don't brood over them, i can remember how i felt at the end of those games.  i seriously can't say for sure how i would've handled losing a basketball game by 135 when i was in high school.  i imagine i would've been pretty upset about it, though.

[bullets13]

[quote name="RP3" post="777048" timestamp="1268615623"]
[quote author=bullets13000 link=topic=67270.msg777042#msg777042 date=1268615289]
[quote author=RP3 link=topic=67270.msg777039#msg777039 date=1268615086]
[quote author=bullets13000 link=topic=67270.msg776996#msg776996 date=1268607771]
[quote author=RP3 link=topic=67270.msg776948#msg776948 date=1268595441]
And they never will....I would not waste my time debating it with them....They will never get it because they were either on the losing end of butt kickings or have never played a day in their lives and therefore just hate winners, or don't understand anyway...Thats just a fact...They want to talk about class? Ever been to a baseball game when PNG plays Central? or Bellaire vs Wheatley in baseball in Houston? BUt because its BASKETBALL, it becomes "classless" all of a sudden.. I rest my case.
[/quote]

so if they were on the end of these butt kickings, and are still upset about them, would that mean that maybe these buttkickings actually DO have an effect on the athletes that suffer them?
[/quote]
Not to be cruel or harsh, but don't you guys think that if a person is STILL upset about losing a HIGH SCHOOL game as an adult, they probably needed psychological evaluation prior to? I would say yes.....Get over it. Everybody can't win, otherwise why take score? Everyone is playing with the same ball, by the same rules...Same classification even, according to the UIL.....Its like death, its a part of life. There are many other important things to focus on in your life other than a basketball game. ::)
[/quote]

i definitely see your point.  i've been fortunate enough, for the most part, to not be on too many "bad" teams.  i've still taken some shelackings over my lifetime, and although i certainly don't brood over them, i can remember how i felt at the end of those games.  i seriously can't imagine how i would've handled losing a basketball game by 135 when i was in high school.  i imagine i would've been pretty upset about it, though.
[/quote]
Oh, ABSOLUTELY!! I am certain that while it was happening and a few days after it probably stung like the dickens!!! BUT I hope your coach was able to get you guys to learn SOMETHING from the experience.....I just feel that the KIDS at YATES HIGH SCHOOL are being looked at as villans here in a way, which is why I felt obligated to speak on it...Coach Wise is not the only one feeling the tension of many here, but I would rather let him have to deal with it than those kids...I dont think it is fair to them at all.
[/quote]

that makes sense... i will say that i haven't seen much on here where anyone was trying to lay any of this on the kids, but as you say, i'm sure they're effected by the controversy.  didn't look like it bothered them too much at the state tourney, though :)