KFDM COOP Posted October 11, 2006 Report Posted October 11, 2006 Interesting UIL Overtime Rule Little-known rule rears its head MacArthur earned two points against Irving to help tiebreaker scenario 11:49 PM CDT on Tuesday, October 10, 2006 By BRANDON GEORGE and RANDY JENNINGS / The Dallas Morning News Irving MacArthur's 40-32 overtime victory against Irving in their District 7-5A opener Sept. 29 has shed light on a little-known UIL overtime rule that plays a part in the district's tiebreaker system. After stopping Irving on its first overtime possession, MacArthur's Ron Brooks ran for a 12-yard touchdown to win the game. Though the game had been decided, MacArthur wanted to attempt a 2-point conversion to improve his team's position in the district's "positive points" tiebreaker procedure. But Irving coach Jim Bennett didn't send his team on the field to defend the try. Thus, the referee awarded MacArthur two points for the final margin of victory. In the Sept. 30 edition of SportsDay, the final score had been reported as a 38-32 MacArthur victory. According to the 2006 UIL football rule exceptions listed on the Texas Association of Sports Officials' Web site (www.taso.org), districts using the "positive points" tiebreaker system can agree to play the otherwise meaningless try. The referee may award the points if the team on defense refuses to defend the try. Head coaches must inform the referee before the game that the exception will be used. Otherwise, the game will be played under the NCAA tiebreaker system. Irving ISD athletic director Joe Barnett said Bennett and MacArthur coach Brian Basil met with the referee before the game and agreed to use the exception. Each UIL football district adopts its own tiebreaker rule to determine playoff berths if teams finish the season tied. Some districts use a plus-minus tiebreaker system, and others use only a "positive points" system that counts margin of victory in district games up to a certain number of points (14 in 7-5A). A few still rely on a coin flip. The plus-minus system counts margin of victory and defeat. Barnett and Grand Prairie ISD athletic director Fred Clausen said they were unaware of the rule until the Irving-Irving MacArthur game brought the issue to light. Clausen said he believes most high school football coaches aren't aware of the rule. __________________
Lucky Posted October 11, 2006 Report Posted October 11, 2006 I think it is STUPID to continue play after a team has allready won the game. They should have only been awarded the 6 points. They do not continue play in College or NFL !
fwcoa Posted October 11, 2006 Report Posted October 11, 2006 You must not be a coach, nor do you understand the tie-breaker system Lucky......how would you like to stay home from the playoffs because you were -1 on the points........what is stupid is that Irving didn't try to stop them.......wouldn't it be ironic if Irving was tied for 4th and lost out by 1 point in the tie breaker
Lucky Posted October 11, 2006 Report Posted October 11, 2006 You must not be a coach' date=' nor do you understand the tie-breaker system Lucky......how would you like to stay home from the playoffs because you were -1 on the points........what is stupid is that Irving didn't try to stop them.......wouldn't it be ironic if Irving was tied for 4th and lost out by 1 point in the tie breaker[/quote'] First let me say that the whole playoff thing is watered down with the 3rd place team ! When you have teams get in with 1 or 2 district wins somethings wrong. If you can't finish in the top two, you got no business going ! If I understand it right, they use all points from district play and not just overtime points ? I don't like teams running up a score just to get points. I think it demoralizes the weaker teams and shows poor sportsmanship on the teams trying to get points. If a team is good enough to get to the playoffs they shouldn't need to rely on points. If they need a tie-breaker then use penetrations or first downs. I have seen Dan Hooks kick field goals on 3rd down to keep from running up the score............BUT HE DONT NEED POINTS TO GET IN !
hjhawks Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 If you think only 2 teams should get in, answer this..... Do you think BC, Silsbee, Kirbyville, HJ, Orangefield, WOS, etc. could win the other 3A district with Liberty, Coldspring, etc?
Castor27 Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 If I understand it right' date=' they use all points from district play and not just overtime points ? I don't like teams running up a score just to get points. I think it demoralizes the weaker teams and shows poor sportsmanship on the teams trying to get points. [/quote'] Dear Lucky, We in Connecticut would love to have you as a citizen. Your views on football will fit right in with our esteemed state legislature. Please let us know when you decide to join us, so we can have a place set up for you. Sincerely, GOVERNOR M. JODI RELL P.S. If you have no idea what I am talking about please see This is the hidden content, please Sign In or Sign Up
tvc184 Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 I think it is STUPID to continue play after a team has allready won the game. They should have only been awarded the 6 points. They do not continue play in College or NFL ! But district championships and playoff spots are not determined by points like they are in high school. You are comparing apples and oranges.
Silsbee92 Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 If you think only 2 teams should get in' date=' answer this..... Do you think BC, Silsbee, Kirbyville, HJ, Orangefield, WOS, etc. could win the other 3A district with Liberty, Coldspring, etc?[/quote'] hjhawks, You cannot compare our two districts with others in the state. Three teams out of an Eight team district makes for a great playoff race. If you make the playoffs down here then you deserve a playoff spot. Even if you lose to a better team. With rich football history and intense rivalry existing here in Southeast Texas, every game in both our districts is a playoff game. As far as playing some of those teams you listed? Bring it on when the time comes. Playoff bound and ready to ball. Go Tigers.
AHUDDLESTON Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 Most districts limit the positive points for each game to between 14 and 21.
fwcoa Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 I would explain the points rule and how it works but you would not understand........I can tell that from your post about which points are counted........You sound like a pee wee coach........As far as the playoffs being watered down, in some cases it is........but in districts like the one I coach in, you make it, you definitely deserve it (and we have 4 teams make it).........The point system would come into play if only one team made the playoffs......You have absolutely no comprehension of how it works......I would suggest you not comment on something you do not understand......
JohnnyT60 Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 I don't think the conversion should be allowed if the game is over, and when the TD was scored the game was over. Essentially they got to score bonus points. That rule should be changed.
fwcoa Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 I guess none of you have ever been left out of the playoffs due to points.......every point counts when you are in a tight district race.......you all seem to be forgetting that the points that Irving gave up can come back to haount them...... here is how: If Irving Mac, Irving, and Grand Prairie are tied for 3rd......Irving Mac beat Irving by 8 so they are +8, Grand Prarie beat Irving Mac by 9, so they are +9.........at the end of the game, Irving is leading GP by 7......If Irving has just scored, now they have to go for 2 and get it to make the playoffs......if they had held Mac on the 2 point conversion, then all they have to do is kick the extra point to get in.......On the other side, if Mac was not able to go for 2, they would be left out because they didn't win the toss in overtime........
Lucky Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 If you think only 2 teams should get in' date=' answer this..... Do you think BC, Silsbee, Kirbyville, HJ, Orangefield, WOS, etc. could win the other 3A district with Liberty, Coldspring, etc?[/quote'] Life ain't fair ! You do what you can and move on !
gary-us-bonds Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 What if a district did the point spread for baseball. Let's say you goto extra innings tied, bottom of the 10th, one out, bases loaded, you get a walk to drive in the winning run... But wait...you want your other two outs still so you can tack on more runs to help you in your tiebreaker later on... That's what this football rule seems like to me. Just like in baseball in extra innings, once you score in overtime and the other team didn't score, game's over man. Shouldn't be any opportunity to add more points when the game is over. I don't know which scenario is more absurd, a team continuing to bat in the bottom of the 10th when they are already leading the game, or a team going for 2 in overtime when the game is already over.
fwcoa Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 Point well made.....I never looked at it that way......the only thing I can say is that in baseball, the last batteris not determined by a flip of a coin and you get to play the other team again.......I don't think HS baseball incorporates runs in a tie breaker system.....
JohnnyT60 Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 That's my point, the game was already over. I understand the point system, and capping it, so a team does not run up the score on a weaker opponent. But the game was over, and it resulted in bonus points, which is not fair to other teams in the district. What if those two bonus points result in a tie with another team in the district, and they win the toss. The other team will have been screwed by allowing two bonus points.
Lucky Posted October 12, 2006 Report Posted October 12, 2006 I would explain the points rule and how it works but you would not understand........I can tell that from your post about which points are counted........You sound like a pee wee coach........As far as the playoffs being watered down' date=' in some cases it is........but in districts like the one I coach in, you make it, you definitely deserve it (and we have 4 teams make it).........The point system would come into play if only one team made the playoffs......You have absolutely no comprehension of how it works......I would suggest you not comment on something you do not understand......[/quote'] I did not realize that they capped the points to keep teams from running up the score although some teams still choose to run it up. But back to the conversion.......I still disagree and thats my pee wee opinion (although I do not coach pee wee). Had I been the Irving coach I probably would have reluctantly sent the team out to defend. But you must understand that high school kids live for the moment, and thats it ! They do not want to think about tie-breaker points down the road. Especially after they just lost a hard fought game in overtime. And your right, I may not know every rule completely but I do know about WINNING ! I played some college football at McNeese State in the late 70s and still enjoy the game today. You are obviosly a young assistant coach who thinks he has it all figured out. I would love to coach against guys like you ! You see, while you are farting around on the computer bragging about being a coach.....All of the REAL COACHES are busting their butts studying their opponents and preparing their kids for Friday night.
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