Kiss basketball goodbye in HF!!!

[horndawg]

[quote name="True Blue" post="814808" timestamp="1277611465"]
You have pretty much summed it up, But some AD football coaches have the attitude of their way or the highway.
[/quote]

I understand your concern, but I have a question.  You put on the AD's shoes. Set the scene, you are the AD at HF and along with that title, you are the Head football coach.  Your job depends on winning in football as the head football coach, and you only have about 3-4 years to begin winning football games or the community wants you out.  With the downfall of HF football in the recent past, would you, as the AD, really think your job relied on what the basketball team does?  I'm not saying just close the program or to not have an open gym for those that want to take advantage of that option, but I am asking with 3-4 short years to try and bring a struggling football program back, would basketball be your number 1 priority?  

[Guest speechless]

therein lies the problem and the admitting that there is a problem when attaching AD to a coaching position and the fact that one would be fired for losing only football games when in reality one should be fired for not giving every kid the opportunity to be as successful as he/she can be in any sport

[horndawg]

Small schools with small budgets can't really help that now can they?  They don't have a budget to hire two different people.

[knows2much]

You are absolutely right horndawg...his priority is and should be the football program.

You are also right speechless.  Larry Bird is an accomplished pro and probably didn't go thru any offseason weight workouts. 

But.  What I'm saying is that success [u][b]CAN[/b][/u] be had with football players having to lift weights during even their own basketball season.  If we were trying to spit out state titles and future college/pro bballers then I would suggest focusing the attention on specific bball weight training and skill work.  But we're not.  I'm talking about "success" or the possibility of it.  Football workouts will not be the reason of a good or bad year for HF.  JUST LIKE LARRY BIRD...those kids need to spend a little more time on their own if they really want it.  They may not be nba bound, but they can spend extra time on it just the same.  I did.  I used to put up 1000+ shots a day/week outside of practice and it made a remarkable difference.  Even doing football workouts all thru bball season.  So gripe and complain all you want to.  It's not gonna make any difference.  They are doing the universal work out regardless.  They can either make the best of it or use it as an excuse.  I don't really care either way.

[Guest speechless]

and the same ol' same ol' will continue

[stevenash]

[quote name="knows2much" post="815066" timestamp="1277755969"]
If not making the playoffs is not that big a deal then what does that say about schools consistently NOT making the playoffs?  I think it's a pretty big deal.  Yeah I know that the measure of success is different for everybody but that is the goal of just about every team in the state before each season.  In any sport.  And yeah skills are important.  Really important.  But the best shooters/ball handlers/batters/sprinters/you name it out there hone their skills on their own time.  Before school, after practice, playing pick-up ball, camps, at home, etc.  If you think that trading a 50 min weight workout for 50 mins of BB skill work is gonna all of the sudden turn a program around, then your wrong.  Because quite honestly, it takes a lot more than just 8 hours of practice a week to be truly successful.
[/quote]

But, in the case of basketball, skills MUST have priority over strength especially when time is limited.  And, I would suggest to you that 50 minutes of daily skills work will be far more productive than the  50 minutes of weight lifting when it comes to determing the success of a basketball program.

[Bucof2010]

H.S practice especially jv and varsity shouldn't be a whole lot of skills practice it should be practicing plays and defenses skiLls come from the park and driveway

[AggiesAreWe]

Even though we are letting 3 and 4 teams make the playoffs these days, it's still a big deal to those teams to make the playoffs.

Success is definitely measured differently by folks but to say a school is not successful in a sport because they have not won a state championship is ludicrous.

[stevenash]

[quote name="Bucof2010" post="815086" timestamp="1277761114"]
H.S practice especially jv and varsity shouldn't be a whole lot of skills practice it should be practicing plays and defenses skiLls come from the park and driveway
[/quote].  What is done in practice is a coaches decision but u can rest assured that what ever is done in practice will definitely improve skills

[Guest speechless]

[quote]H.S practice especially jv and varsity shouldn't be a whole lot of skills practice it should be practicing plays and defenses skiLls come from the park and driveway[/quote]

lol!  WOW!  "skills come from the park"  LMAO!  coaches spend 4 years trying to get kids to unlearn the crap they learn at the park...this post tells me a lot

[AggiesAreWe]

[quote name="speechless" post="815096" timestamp="1277766911"]
[quote]H.S practice especially jv and varsity shouldn't be a whole lot of skills practice it should be practicing plays and defenses skiLls come from the park and driveway[/quote]

lol!  WOW!  "skills come from the park"  LMAO!  coaches spend 4 years trying to get kids to unlearn the crap they learn at the park...this post tells me a lot
[/quote]

WOW!!! Indeed!

"Skills come from the park"?? Clueless, simply clueless.

[stevenash]

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="815100" timestamp="1277767904"]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=70692.msg815096#msg815096 date=1277766911]
[quote]H.S practice especially jv and varsity shouldn't be a whole lot of skills practice it should be practicing plays and defenses skiLls come from the park and driveway[/quote]

lol!  WOW!  "skills come from the park"  LMAO!  coaches spend 4 years trying to get kids to unlearn the crap they learn at the park...this post tells me a lot
[/quote]

WOW!!! Indeed!

"Skills come from the park"?? Clueless, simply clueless.    Now wait a minute, you two.  Where else can a guy learn to palm the ball, and take two steps before his jump step?
[/quote]

[True Blue]

[quote name="ECBucFan" post="815055" timestamp="1277753940"]
[quote author=sleepy link=topic=70692.msg815051#msg815051 date=1277752767]
[quote author=ECBucFan link=topic=70692.msg815049#msg815049 date=1277752572]
[quote author=AggiesAreWe link=topic=70692.msg815028#msg815028 date=1277747658]
So, it's okay if East Chambers and Kountze uses the universal theory. True Clueless, are you listening. ;)
[/quote]

Well, it works great for EC!  ;D
[/quote]

Again.........It is working at EC..........working "great".......not hardly.  Ask the coach if they would have been better [size=18pt]this year[/size] with 80 more hours of work on the basketball court and see what he says!
[/quote]

One year means almost nothing. Look at the past 15 years...  ;D
[/quote]Man you guys must not have to work . But I just got on and Like I said go look back at the 15 years of success that EC has had and call those coaches. Hoffpauir Sutherland Hargroves and see how many of them had their teams doing any football training during BB season. I see that some has allready said that it is not the fact of lifting or not it is the fact of lossing time to work on BB. I agree that you have to work on being stronger and faster but not during the little time you have during season. Go get coach Andrews on the side and ask him if he would not have benefit by more time in the gym. I know he is young and has not got the experience that some older coaches have so he must do what ever his boss ( the AD Head football coach ) tell him he has to. But I bet geven his choise he would have his team in the Gym as offen as he could.

[True Blue]

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="815100" timestamp="1277767904"]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=70692.msg815096#msg815096 date=1277766911]
[quote]H.S practice especially jv and varsity shouldn't be a whole lot of skills practice it should be practicing plays and defenses skiLls come from the park and driveway[/quote]

lol!  WOW!  "skills come from the park"  LMAO!  coaches spend 4 years trying to get kids to unlearn the crap they learn at the park...this post tells me a lot
[/quote]

WOW!!! Indeed!

"Skills come from the park"?? Clueless, simply clueless.
[/quote] Wait a minute guys this kid just graduated and never play a minute of highschool ball, so cut him some slack he is truely clueless ;D ;D

[CATMAN]

Has anyone talk to BLUE DOVE ABOUT this.

[team first]

I love when the posters put a foot in their mouths and you say ahhh....now I see why.First the 50 minute athletic period dedicated to skill level. Makes a difference buddy. Turns a program. Skill level improves and SHAZAMMMMMMMMMMMM you now have some magic. It is amazing what happens. Next. Larry Bird. That guy was bigger faster and stronger. Coudln't dribble, pass or shoot. Knowsnotenough..Try another argument.Horns winning football games is great, but if the other athletes arent given the RIGHT opprotunities to have the same success, somebody may be well, looking for a job..It might have happened before??? And my favorite.....Look at Michel Jordan, he lifted on game days? this is so true.....But what also may be true is, he could play a little before he got a little stronger. Skill again, always comes first. No skill, and lifting , just helps the guy down at the beach with the ladies. Well at least I hope he gets some benefit. I love sarcasm. If you dont know what your talking about, get off the site!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Skills at the PARKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK. Come on!

[Bucof2010]

[quote name="True Blue" post="815119" timestamp="1277775747"]
[quote author=AggiesAreWe link=topic=70692.msg815100#msg815100 date=1277767904]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=70692.msg815096#msg815096 date=1277766911]
[quote]H.S practice especially jv and varsity shouldn't be a whole lot of skills practice it should be practicing plays and defenses skiLls come from the park and driveway[/quote]

lol!  WOW!  "skills come from the park"  LMAO!  coaches spend 4 years trying to get kids to unlearn the crap they learn at the park...this post tells me a lot
[/quote]

WOW!!! Indeed!

"Skills come from the park"?? Clueless, simply clueless.
[/quote] Wait a minute guys this kid just graduated and never play a minute of highschool ball, so cut him some slack he is truely clueless ;D ;D
[/quote]

I did play h.s. ball and I stuck with one team which is more than some of us can say.How come all of you'll know when a player is going to be good before he gets to h.s. if the h.s. coaches make him good? He's good because he constantly has a ball in his hands the coaches just put that into a team setting

[horndawg]

[quote name="team first" post="815141" timestamp="1277784147"]
I love when the posters put a foot in their mouths and you say ahhh....now I see why.First the 50 minute athletic period dedicated to skill level. Makes a difference buddy. Turns a program. Skill level improves and SHAZAMMMMMMMMMMMM you now have some magic. It is amazing what happens. Next. Larry Bird. That guy was bigger faster and stronger. Coudln't dribble, pass or shoot. Knowsnotenough..Try another argument.Horns winning football games is great, but if the other athletes arent given the RIGHT opprotunities to have the same success, somebody may be well, looking for a job..It might have happened before??? And my favorite.....Look at Michel Jordan, he lifted on game days? this is so true.....But what also may be true is, he could play a little before he got a little stronger. Skill again, always comes first. No skill, and lifting , just helps the guy down at the beach with the ladies. Well at least I hope he gets some benefit. I love sarcasm. If you dont know what your talking about, get off the site!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Skills at the PARKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK. Come on!
[/quote]

You do know that championship teams are built in the offseason? This goes for all sports, I don't care, you name it, that's when "skills" are imroved.  This means that kids need to put it upon themselves to make each other better because the coach can't be there 24 hours a day.  I agree, they can help out as much as possible, but there is a point where these guys have to take what the coaches teach them and make themselves better. All some of you guys are doing on here is making the coaches the pawns and pointing the finger as to why you think everything is wrong instead of thinking of a better way to be more constructive.  

[horndawg]

And forget the Larry Bird example, use a better example, such as Bo Jackson, that guy played two professional sports. Now, I don't know because I haven't researched it, but I bet you he worked out all the stinking time.  Sure, basketball wasn't one of his sports, but to play two sports, somethings had to cross and I bet you anything working out on days he really didn't want to was one of them to keep himself ready for BOTH sports.

[xavierbreath]

I just read this thread last night and something came to my mind.  I remember driving through Gilbert Lake Estates a couple of months ago ( I have some interest in moving to that area), and was trying to gauge if the addition had many children.  One of the things that I look for is basketball goals in the driveways.  To my surprise, I saw very few.  Does this mean anything?  Is there a restriction against it?  I don't know, but I may drive out there again and see if anything has changed.

I remember when growing up, we had "open gyms" to play in, but, we played more in the neighborhood driveway than we did at the gym.  Why?  The drive way was always open, you could shoot anytime you wanted and there always seemed to be enough interest in the neighborhood to have at least a 2 on 2 going.  Does this happen out in the Hamshire Fannett area?  If not, this could be one of the major reasons that the HS program has not had success lately.  In my opinion, kids need to play the game as much as possible.....it will only make them better and the best place to start is in the driveway.  Also, practice what your coach teaches you or wants you to learn "in the driveway".  This will have you better prepared for the basketball season (as well as some strength training and agilities).

JMO :)

[Guest ECBucFan]

[quote name="True Blue" post="815116" timestamp="1277775109"]

Man you guys must not have to work .
[/quote]

I have just completed eleven 12 hr. shifts in a row, and went to SETXSports for a bit of diversion on my first day off. Now THIS stupidity...   

[stevenash]

[quote name="ECBucFan" post="815198" timestamp="1277825630"]
[quote author=True Blue link=topic=70692.msg815116#msg815116 date=1277775109]

Man you guys must not have to work .
[/quote]

I have just completed eleven 12 hr. shifts in a row, and went to SETXSports for a bit of diversion on my first day off. Now THIS stupidity...   
[/quote]

Hmmm- This stupidity seems to be something in which you are a willing participant.  People who live in glass houses should not throw stones?

[Betrayed]

This guy is going to look like a genius. Think about it. H.F is about to be very, very, strong in Basketball and Football in the upcoming years.Have ya'll not noticed their 6th thru 10th grade class. Those kids have skills and size already. Jordan Hunter and his crew will definitely be able to play with the best of'm in Basketball. And in football that Kendrick King is gonna do the same for their football program. Those two guys combined with guys older and younger then them will make up for some special teams.

[horndawg]

Newsflash:

Middle school success =/= High school success

Not to say they won't be successful (I, for one, would like to see all HF sports at least 3 rounds deep in playoffs), but by no means is it a given.

[sleepy]

[quote name="xavierbreath" post="815193" timestamp="1277823910"]
I just read this thread last night and something came to my mind.  I remember driving through Gilbert Lake Estates a couple of months ago ( I have some interest in moving to that area), and was trying to gauge if the addition had many children.  One of the things that I look for is basketball goals in the driveways.  To my surprise, I saw very few.  Does this mean anything?  Is there a restriction against it?   I don't know, but I may drive out there again and see if anything has changed.

I remember when growing up, we had "open gyms" to play in, but, we played more in the neighborhood driveway than we did at the gym.  Why?  The drive way was always open, you could shoot anytime you wanted and there always seemed to be enough interest in the neighborhood to have at least a 2 on 2 going.   Does this happen out in the Hamshire Fannett area?  If not, this could be one of the major reasons that the HS program has not had success lately.  In my opinion, kids need to play the game as much as possible.....it will only make them better and the best place to start is in the driveway.  Also, practice what your coach teaches you or wants you to learn "in the driveway".  This will have you better prepared for the basketball season (as well as some strength training and agilities).

JMO :)
[/quote]

Good post!!!