19-4A vs 20-4A Who would win?

[gary-us-bonds]

Katy has multiple junior highs, but they all learn the Katy system and all feed into Katy.
It's not the multiple junior highs as much as it is that any one junior high can go to multiple high schools.

If Baytown had 6 junior highs, 2 going to Lee, 2 going to Sterling and 2 going to GCM...it would make for a much better athletic program at each.
Katy can start teaching their system all the way down in pop warner league.

I'm not sure how West Brook does their zoning.  I do know that Lee used to beat the fire out of the Bruins when they had an equal number of students, so what West Brook does is neither here nor there.

Yes, you can compete and win without having junior high feeder systems for the high schools, but it's just easier to compete and win if you do have the system in place.

[HUM398]

[quote name="panamamyers" post="819167" timestamp="1279629736"]
Katy has multiple junior highs, but they all learn the Katy system and all feed into Katy.
It's not the multiple junior highs as much as it is that any one junior high can go to multiple high schools.

If Baytown had 6 junior highs, 2 going to Lee, 2 going to Sterling and 2 going to GCM...it would make for a much better athletic program at each.
Katy can start teaching their system all the way down in pop warner league.

I'm not sure how West Brook does their zoning.  I do know that Lee used to beat the fire out of the Bruins when they had an equal number of students, so what West Brook does is neither here nor there.

Yes, you can compete and win without having junior high feeder systems for the high schools, but it's just easier to compete and win if you do have the system in place.
[/quote]

Katy no longer has a single middle school that feeds into it, they are zoned to multiple high schools.  i remember KT2000 from the 5a board mentioning that a couple of times.  Cinco Ranch i belive is the only katy ISD school that has a specific middle school feeding into it.

[Guest GCMPats]

[quote name="panamamyers" post="819167" timestamp="1279629736"]
Katy has multiple junior highs, but they all learn the Katy system and all feed into Katy.
It's not the multiple junior highs as much as it is that any one junior high can go to multiple high schools.

If Baytown had 6 junior highs, 2 going to Lee, 2 going to Sterling and 2 going to GCM...it would make for a much better athletic program at each.
Katy can start teaching their system all the way down in pop warner league.

I'm not sure how West Brook does their zoning.  I do know that Lee used to beat the fire out of the Bruins when they had an equal number of students, so what West Brook does is neither here nor there.

Yes, you can compete and win without having junior high feeder systems for the high schools, but it's just easier to compete and win if you do have the system in place.
[/quote]


GCCISD's problem is not with "feeder" systems or anything of that nature. The basic problem lies with an increased lack of "active" participants in each school's football programs. When you take the fact that the demographics in Baytown continue to change added to the opening of GCM, you get three high schools that will find it difficult to compete outside of their respective districts(4A or 5A). It's all about the Larry's and Joe's.

GCCISD had an opportunity to fix the problem. They chose, however, to take the path "often" traveled- Expansion.

[gary-us-bonds]

I understand the dynamic of the shift in demographics.  I understand the lack of participation.

All things being equal, you would much prefer to have pop warner, optimist, ymca, junior highs, etc. that all feed into the same system.  It is much easier to build a program.

It's the reason why Olin always flirted with other job offers through the years.  He was constantly looking for a 5A school that was the only school in town, wanting to be in control of the whole operation from pop warner on up.

[bh89-2]

[quote name="panamamyers" post="819208" timestamp="1279638520"]
I understand the dynamic of the shift in demographics.  I understand the lack of participation.

All things being equal, you would much prefer to have pop warner, optimist, ymca, junior highs, etc. that all feed into the same system.  It is much easier to build a program.

It's the reason why Olin always flirted with other job offers through the years.  He was constantly looking for a 5A school that was the only school in town, wanting to be in control of the whole operation from pop warner on up.
[/quote]

Where did Olin go? 

[bronco1]

[quote name="bh89-2" post="819210" timestamp="1279639661"]
[quote author=panamamyers link=topic=70983.msg819208#msg819208 date=1279638520]
I understand the dynamic of the shift in demographics.  I understand the lack of participation.

All things being equal, you would much prefer to have pop warner, optimist, ymca, junior highs, etc. that all feed into the same system.  It is much easier to build a program.

It's the reason why Olin always flirted with other job offers through the years.  He was constantly looking for a 5A school that was the only school in town, wanting to be in control of the whole operation from pop warner on up.
[/quote]

Where did Olin go? 
[/quote]

Lewisville

[WeedBegone]

[quote name="panamamyers" post="819167" timestamp="1279629736"]
Katy has multiple junior highs, but they all learn the Katy system and all feed into Katy.
It's not the multiple junior highs as much as it is that any one junior high can go to multiple high schools.

If Baytown had 6 junior highs, 2 going to Lee, 2 going to Sterling and 2 going to GCM...it would make for a much better athletic program at each.
Katy can start teaching their system all the way down in pop warner league.

I'm not sure how West Brook does their zoning.  I do know that Lee used to beat the fire out of the Bruins when they had an equal number of students, so what West Brook does is neither here nor there.

Yes, you can compete and win without having junior high feeder systems for the high schools, but it's just easier to compete and win if you do have the system in place.
[/quote]

The years Lee beat the fire out of West Brook was when WB was split into OZEN and lost most of its Atheletes to OZEN.
With OZEN being declared as a magnet school--- the magnet attracted the kids that could pump iron  Then came Stump and things began to fall back into place.   ;)

[Guest GCMPats]

That is the system you will find in MOST 4A school districts. They have the luxury of  implementing a system from the day they start playing football until the day they graduate.

It was quite obvious we were not in Kansas any more when GCM would roll into these towns and the water towers would say "HOME OF THE BRONCOS" (for example) when the water towers in Baytown say "HOME OF LEE COLLEGE". In other words, you have to play the ENTIRE community! It does make a difference when you take the other factors I mentioned into consideration.

[gary-us-bonds]

Olin never got what he was looking for.
He flirted with McKinney(I believe) about 7 to 10 years ago.
They eventually split into two high schools there too if I am not mistaken.

The situation he was looking for was a very specific one, and he never really found it.
He fought hard for a unified high school in Baytown.
I wanted a unified high school too.

With today's society of everyone gets a trophy, that was not going to happen.
Everyone that goes out for a sport needs to have a starting position. 
You need as many valedictorians and top 10% as you can get.
etc. etc.../..

[Guest GCMPats]

Panama, we finally agree on something.

Combining Lee and Sterling made way too much sense. It could have created a school that would have been a force to be reckoned with in every varsity sporting event.

[biaplayer]

I doubt that very seriously, combining the schools wouldnt do anything for ya, you can only put 11 on the field at one time, still the same result

[the_dude_abides]

[quote name="biaplayer" post="819352" timestamp="1279676836"]
I doubt that very seriously, combining the schools wouldnt do anything for ya, you can only put 11 on the field at one time, still the same result
[/quote]

You're right having twice the talent pool to draw from would make no difference at all.

[gary-us-bonds]

There's no doubt in my mind that Baytown would have a football powerhouse if the three schools were combined.  You would be looking at the same number of students as a Plano East.
Track and baseball would also be state powers.
The other sports...probably not.

No point in talking about it though.Lee is a 4a team now, so might as well make the best of it.

[BrenhamFan]

[quote name="the_dude_abides" post="819354" timestamp="1279677000"]
[quote author=biaplayer link=topic=70983.msg819352#msg819352 date=1279676836]
I doubt that very seriously, combining the schools wouldnt do anything for ya, you can only put 11 on the field at one time, still the same result
[/quote]

You're right having twice the talent pool to draw from would make no difference at all.
[/quote]

We beat schools with twice the amount of kids we have....  That's not always a factor....

[Jackthehammer]

[quote name="panamamyers" post="819356" timestamp="1279677708"]
There's no doubt in my mind that Baytown would have a football powerhouse if the three schools were combined.  You would be looking at the same number of students as a Plano East.
Track and baseball would also be state powers.
The other sports...probably not.

No point in talking about it though.Lee is a 4a team now, so might as well make the best of it.
[/quote]

Port Arthur combined 3 school and everyone assumed they would be a powerhouse and so far they have not.

[Jackthehammer]

Ok read all this and love that things are picking up. I gotta say that the top 3 schools out of these two districts are in no particular order Central, Dayton,and PN-G.  I respect all 3 of these schools as far as this comming season. Now for history the 1st game I saw PN-G play last year was the PN-G Crosby game and they were not even the same class of teams in that game. PN-G beat BH,Crosby,and BH by themselves last season. PN-G Dayton would have been an awsome game to watch would have loved to see it. Central beat GCM. Crosby lost to PN-G and then beat Nederland. Dayton beat Vidor. Looks like 20-4a was better last season.

[NewIndian]

[quote name="GCMPats" post="819214" timestamp="1279640022"]
That is the system you will find in MOST 4A school districts. They have the luxury of  implementing a system from the day they start playing football until the day they graduate.

It was quite obvious we were not in Kansas any more when GCM would roll into these towns and the water towers would say "HOME OF THE BRONCOS" (for example) when the water towers in Baytown say "HOME OF LEE COLLEGE". In other words, you have to play the ENTIRE community! It does make a difference when you take the other factors I mentioned into consideration.
[/quote]

Our water towers along with Ned dont have "home of"  on em just have giant Indian heads or giant bulldogs on em, love it can see em from along way away.

[gary-us-bonds]

Baytown is not Port Arthur.

Port Arthur still only has less than 3,000 students even with all high schools combined.
Baytown would have over 5,000.

PA is a product of poor coaching and no discipline.
You can set your watch by it.  As soon as they run into a little turbulence, they throw in the towel and quit.

Baytown is not now, nor ever will be, anything like Port Arthur.

[WeedBegone]

[quote name="panamamyers" post="819423" timestamp="1279717121"]
Baytown is not Port Arthur.

Port Arthur still only has less than 3,000 students even with all high schools combined.
Baytown would have over 5,000.

PA is a product of poor coaching and no discipline.
You can set your watch by it.  As soon as they run into a little turbulence, they throw in the towel and quit.

Baytown is not now, nor ever will be, anything like Port Arthur.

[/quote]

Yet again--Baytown will never be a Beaumont also---- Never forget the reputation that  Beaumont - Pt Arthur and Orange --is the Golden Triangle and is the pro-football capital of the world.  When you come here---bring your hip-pads----your gonna need em. ;D

[bh89-2]

[quote name="WeedBegone" post="819447" timestamp="1279720592"]
[quote author=panamamyers link=topic=70983.msg819423#msg819423 date=1279717121]
Baytown is not Port Arthur.

Port Arthur still only has less than 3,000 students even with all high schools combined.
Baytown would have over 5,000.

PA is a product of poor coaching and no discipline.
You can set your watch by it.  As soon as they run into a little turbulence, they throw in the towel and quit.

Baytown is not now, nor ever will be, anything like Port Arthur.

[/quote]

Yet again--Baytown will never be a Beaumont also---- Never forget the reputation that  Beaumont - Pt Arthur and Orange --is the Golden Triangle and is the pro-football capital of the world.  When you come here---bring your hip-pads----your gonna need em. ;D
[/quote]

Best bring a gun and a knife and hope you live to see an NFL game......  Hey, but you do have Richard's......"It's all about the gravy baby!"

[liltex]

Didn't they close that great soul food place by the rr tracks?My fav place to eat when in the area.

[BMTSoulja1]

Richard's is closed by the RR tracks off College street.  Since Ike, it was moved on Magnolia between downtown Beaumont and the North End.  Yes, also one of my favorate soul food spots...

[liltex]

Thanks I'll put it in the Tomtom and find it.Oxtails are to die for along w/all the great sides.They got their start in Sour Lake back in the booming oilfield days and they're some fine folks.The nanner puddin is the best too.

[BMTSoulja1]

[quote name="liltex" post="819495" timestamp="1279729717"]
Thanks I'll put it in the Tomtom and find it.Oxtails are to die for along w/all the great sides.They got their start in Sour Lake back in the booming oilfield days and they're some fine folks.The nanner puddin is the best too.
[/quote]Favorates are Oxtail, baked chicken, and the banana puddin is off the chains.  The place is not hard to find.  On Magnolia between I-10 and North street (greyhound bus station).

[liltex]

Gotcha I know right where that is.The big tall brother in long dreds w/all the clothing favors Mr.Brown hangs out there close to a church thrift store.