Per UTSATailgaters, UTSA to meet with the WAC tomorrow in Denver

[YouCanUseaMint]

[quote]UTSATailgaters has confirmed that UTSA Head Football Coach Larry Coker, Athletic Director Lynn Hickey and some of her administration staff will , in fact, be meeting with WAC Commissioner Karl Benson tomorrow at WAC headquarters in Denver, Colorado.

UTSATailgaters has confirmed with at least two sources that this is in fact is a sales pitch to the WAC, as UTSA pushes onward in their sky rocketing ascension to FBS status. Back in July, UTSATailgaters had a one-on-one interview with WAC Commissioner Karl Benson, and he made it no secret that the WAC had UTSA on it's radar and that the UTSA was a very attractive program.

Fast forward a couple of months, and several defections later, and the WAC has been left scrambling to salvage the conference.  It appears that Benson and company are full throttle to save the conference, by talking to UTSA - and RunnerNation is standing on edge to see what comes of this meeting. The sources went on to say that a formal invite has not been extended yet and there is no specific deadline of when the WAC wishes to hand out it's invitations.

Since our interview with Karl Benson, all sorts of pros and cons were mentioned in joining the WAC. One huge thing not to forget, the WAC signed an extension with ESPN back in 2008 guaranteeing over 300 athletic events being televised on the four letter network, with 45 championship events as well, through 2017.

Two other schools that were confirmed by these same sources that have been prominently mentioned to be very high on the WAC's list, are Montana and Montana State.

Stay tuned, RunnerNation...[/quote]

Definitely interesting.. though I think Texas State is already a step ahead of UTSA. I know all of us bobcatfans are hoping the WAC does a Texas two-step soon.

[UNLV]

You don't see UTSA fans trying to stomp out UTSA growth...

So who replaces UTSA and Texas st in the SLC?    I think Tarleton st and Kingsville.

[YouCanUseaMint]

[quote name="UNLV" post="847126" timestamp="1284471624"]
You don't see UTSA fans trying to stomp out UTSA growth...

So who replaces UTSA and Texas st in the SLC?    [b]I think Tarleton st and Kingsville[/b].
[/quote]
Well that sounds like.... friendly competition  ;D

[NorthoftheBorder]

I understand that San Antonio is a much bigger city/TV market, but it really remains to be seen if San Antonio will support a college football team.  Can't throw water on anyone who wants to better themselves and has the Kahunas to go for it.  Hope 10 years from now we aren't doing Monday morning quarterbacking and saying coulda/shoulda/woulda on the FBS conference situation.

[kingkat99]

[quote name="UNLV" post="847126" timestamp="1284471624"]
You don't see UTSA fans trying to stomp out UTSA growth...

So who replaces UTSA and Texas st in the SLC?    I think Tarleton st and Kingsville.
[/quote]

Unless the SLC loses the Louisiana schools to budget cuts no one will has to replace UTSA since they have never fielded a football team so they dont need replacing and technically Lamar is replacing Texas State if they leave and the conference still has the same amount of football teams as before...

[Texantagonise]

[quote name="UNLV" post="847126" timestamp="1284471624"]
You don't see UTSA fans trying to stomp out UTSA growth...

So who replaces UTSA and Texas st in the SLC?    I think Tarleton st and Kingsville.
[/quote]

Trying to compare San Antonio to Beaumont is insane. San Antonio population 1,200,000 [b]JEFFERSON COUNTY[/b] 252,051.  ONLY a MILLION people separate us from them.  That is like comparing apples to kumquats, you cant be serious.  I would like to sere Lamar move to FBS also but the WAC makes no sense. If it was so great North Texas would be all over it.  But as it has been posted on here UNT wants no part of the WAC and its travel distances. 

[glow=red,2,300]Two other schools that were confirmed by these same sources that have been prominently mentioned to be very high on the WAC's list, are Montana and Montana State.
[/glow]
Montana, Montana St., Texas St., and UTSA that sounds like a nice [b]FCS[/b] division.  :o
Montana & Montana ST are 1780 and 1980 miles away from Beaumont.  Adding even more to the travel expenses.

I think Whitney Houston said it best " The WAC is CRACK!" or something like that.  ;D

[UNLV]

[quote name="Texantagonise" post="847146" timestamp="1284474906"]
[quote author=UNLV link=topic=72967.msg847126#msg847126 date=1284471624]
You don't see UTSA fans trying to stomp out UTSA growth...

So who replaces UTSA and Texas st in the SLC?    I think Tarleton st and Kingsville.
[/quote]

Trying to compare San Antonio to Beaumont is insane. San Antonio population 1,200,000 [b]JEFFERSON COUNTY[/b] 252,051.  ONLY a MILLION people separate us from them.  That is like comparing apples to kumquats, you cant be serious. 
[/quote]Yet LU brings in more fan support. Can you also post Lubbocks pop?  Ruston? Monroe? College station?
[quote]
I would like to sere Lamar move to FBS also but the WAC makes no sense. If it was so great North Texas would be all over it.  But as it has been posted on here UNT wants no part of the WAC and its travel distances. 
[/quote]UNT is in the Sunbelt. If LU was in the Sunbelt I would oppose going to the WAC too...
[quote]
[glow=red,2,300]Two other schools that were confirmed by these same sources that have been prominently mentioned to be very high on the WAC's list, are Montana and Montana State.
[/glow]
Montana, Montana St., Texas St., and UTSA that sounds like a nice [b]FCS[/b] division.  :o
Montana & Montana ST are 1780 and 1980 miles away from Beaumont.  Adding even more to the travel expenses.

I think Whitney Houston said it best " The WAC is CRACK!" or something like that.  ;D
[/quote]Hey North, no  Kahunas here.

[kingkat99]

[quote name="Texantagonise" post="847146" timestamp="1284474906"]
[quote author=UNLV link=topic=72967.msg847126#msg847126 date=1284471624]
You don't see UTSA fans trying to stomp out UTSA growth...

So who replaces UTSA and Texas st in the SLC?    I think Tarleton st and Kingsville.
[/quote]

Trying to compare San Antonio to Beaumont is insane. San Antonio population 1,200,000 [b]JEFFERSON COUNTY[/b] 252,051.  ONLY a MILLION people separate us from them.  That is like comparing apples to kumquats, you cant be serious.  I would like to sere Lamar move to FBS also but the WAC makes no sense. If it was so great North Texas would be all over it.  But as it has been posted on here UNT wants no part of the WAC and its travel distances. 

[glow=red,2,300]Two other schools that were confirmed by these same sources that have been prominently mentioned to be very high on the WAC's list, are Montana and Montana State.
[/glow]
Montana, Montana St., Texas St., and UTSA that sounds like a nice [b]FCS[/b] division.  :o
[b]Montana & Montana ST are 1780 and 1980 miles away from Beaumont.  Adding even more to the travel expenses.[/b]

I think Whitney Houston said it best " The WAC is CRACK!" or something like that.  ;D
[/quote]

The thought of these travel expenses and more were no doubt apart of Lynn Hickey getting her feelings hurt when the SLC voted that they cant field an FBS football team in another conference and then play all non-revenue sports in the SLC...its on thing to send a football team out west a few times but to say that volleyball, basketball, baseball, softball etc has to make those same trips is a hard pill to swallow.

[UNLV]

[quote name="kingkat99" post="847161" timestamp="1284475879"]
[quote author=Texantagonise link=topic=72967.msg847146#msg847146 date=1284474906]
[quote author=UNLV link=topic=72967.msg847126#msg847126 date=1284471624]
You don't see UTSA fans trying to stomp out UTSA growth...

So who replaces UTSA and Texas st in the SLC?    I think Tarleton st and Kingsville.
[/quote]

Trying to compare San Antonio to Beaumont is insane. San Antonio population 1,200,000 [b]JEFFERSON COUNTY[/b] 252,051.  ONLY a MILLION people separate us from them.  That is like comparing apples to kumquats, you cant be serious.  I would like to sere Lamar move to FBS also but the WAC makes no sense. If it was so great North Texas would be all over it.  But as it has been posted on here UNT wants no part of the WAC and its travel distances. 

[glow=red,2,300]Two other schools that were confirmed by these same sources that have been prominently mentioned to be very high on the WAC's list, are Montana and Montana State.
[/glow]
Montana, Montana St., Texas St., and UTSA that sounds like a nice [b]FCS[/b] division.  :o
[b]Montana & Montana ST are 1780 and 1980 miles away from Beaumont.  Adding even more to the travel expenses.[/b]

I think Whitney Houston said it best " The WAC is CRACK!" or something like that.  ;D
[/quote]

The thought of these travel expenses and more were no doubt apart of Lynn Hickey getting her feelings hurt when the SLC voted that they cant field an FBS football team in another conference and then play all non-revenue sports in the SLC...its on thing to send a football team out west a few times but to say that volleyball, basketball, baseball, softball etc has to make those same trips is a hard pill to swallow.
[/quote]The most logical plan for the WAC is to build a eastern division around Tech and use non-football sports to take short non-conference trips and
use the long trips money for WAC conference western trips. All balance out if done correctly. LU going to the WAC won't break the bank...

[coachacola]

Just because UTSA is in a large metro area doesn't mean the fans will show up.  They don't show up for any of UTSA's basketball games and they like basketball in San Antonio.  It's more of a matter of the WAC needing schools and San Antonio is a nice large TV market for the league.  The WAC would probably try to get a tie-in to the Alamo Bowl.

The big drawback to the WAC is travel expenses, but if you have a eastern division like UNLV said, you cut down a lot on travel expenses.  In football, that's maybe two trips out west.  Is that much more expensive than this year with a trip to South Dakota and Georgia?  Lamar already has a football game lined up with Hawaii in 2012!  Same with the other sports, they play most games against teams in the eastern division.

I think one thing that gets overlooked is the exposure Lamar will get being in a FBS conference.  Both football and basketball will get more exposure.  The WAC will still have a contract with ESPN (which the SLC does not), so that's more money for the athletic department.

Lamar doesn't have to join the WAC right away.  Let UTSA and some other schools join, then wait and see if La Tech stays or leaves.  If the WAC decides to go with an eastern division in a few years and needs another school or two then that's when Lamar makes their move if they believe it's feasible.

[UNLV]

If Fresno and Nevada is forced to stay in the WAC until 2013, That give LU 4 years to get ready for FBS.

[sleepy]

I would rather be a dominant FCS school that has a chance to win national championships than be north texas.  I have lived in Beaumont 30 years.  If the program is not winning they the town is not going to support it and that is a fact.  If the town is not supporting it than there is no revenue and that is what this program needs right now.  A solid foundation built and then talk about expansion.

[ispeakjive]

I am a Lamar graduate and I have never seen this area as excited about the University.  I am confident that the football program will grow and develop over the next five to ten years and I for one hope that all of that growth and development will be as a championship-caliber FCS or 1-AA football program. 

The Montange Center should be a cautionary tale to all of those who are prematurely wishing for Lamar to play FBS football.  25 or so years ago, Lamar had a tremendous, nationally-recognized basketball program and the Montange Center was planned.  When it opened, crowds came and things were rolling.  When Pat Foster left and the quality of the product on the court dropped, so did the crowds.  And the basketball program has still not fully recovered.  Anyone who followed Lamar in their heyday knows that unfortunately the basketball program is a shadow of its former self. 

Unfortunately, crowds in the Golden Triangle are fickle.  This area will support Lamar athletics (and football specifically) as long as they are winning and competitive.  If Lamar goes FBS and expands their stadium to a capacity of 25,000 or 35,000 (which I don't believe is physically possible given the contraints of location), there will be very few sell-outs and the perception will again be that the program is in decline.  Winning will keep the stadium full now and into the future and the best way to win here is FCS.  There is a great talent pool and you have the perfect size community and alumni base to support a high-level FCS program.  However, push it to FBS and go 6-5, 5-6, and so on for three or four years in a row, the crowds will dwindle and the program will be yanked again.  I appreciate the enthusiam for the program and where it can go, but the expectations need to have some perspective.  Just my humble opinion.

[bigred360]

Gosh, you guys keep posting long messages about going FBS or staying FCS. Well, it all depends on things not really in Lamar's control. If UTSA, Texas State and SHSU left the conference and they add a couple DII schools the fan's/students/alumni/administration will not like that either. They may not say that publicly but they don't want to play in a water-down conference just to be the big fish in the pond.

At that point we aren't just talking about football but all the other sports (non revenue producing).

I think at that point the students/fan's/alumni would rather play North Texas, ULL, ULM, Houston, UTEP, Tulsa, and the like. As for the stadium expansion, I remember reading Dr. Simmons already has architectural drawings for Provost Umphrey to go up to 30,000 at its current location.

Now, I'm not talking about this happening tomorrow but 5-6 years down the line. I think we at Lamar need to keep our options open.

Right now, I'm just happy we are playing football at Lamar.

In addition the student fee is to fund the football program so what happened in 1989 will not happen again.

[ispeakjive]

I would much rather Lamar develop into a FCS power with a legitimate shot at the playoffs year in and year out than go to some middle-of-the-road FBS conference and every few years have to get excited for an invitation in the Carl's Jr.-Budget Airlines-Shreveport Chamber of Commerce-Cialis-Just for Men-Happy to Be There Bowl in late December against the 8th place team from the Big East.

[bigred360]

[quote name="ispeakjive" post="848067" timestamp="1284576160"]
I would much rather Lamar develop into a FCS power with a legitimate shot at the playoffs year in and year out than go to some middle-of-the-road FBS conference and every few years have to get excited for an invitation in the Carl's Jr.-Budget Airlines-Shreveport Chamber of Commerce-Cialis-Just for Men-Happy to Be There Bowl in late December against the 8th place team from the Big East.
[/quote]

So you are good with maybe losing a couple Louisiana schools to budget cuts and 2 or 3 SLC Texas teams leaving. Who are we going to play? Deweyville Tech, Texas State School for the Blind, Texas College or some other school half the nation as never heard of. Even if you are invited to "the Carl's Jr.-Budget Airlines-Shreveport Chamber of Commerce-Cialis-Just for Men-Happy to Be There Bowl in late December against the 8th place team from the Big East." The game will be on TV and most of the football fan's in the nation will have heard of the team you are playing.

And not just playing these new SLC schools in football but every sport the school has.  ::)

BTW, the Big East in 5-6 years may not be the same conference it is today.

[ispeakjive]

Obviously, if the SLC changes dramatically over the next three or four years, the conference affiliation may have to change, but at this point, I would rather the program go in the direction of McNeese rather than North Texas.  I don't even know that FBS is feasible in terms of facilities, stadium size, and money available to the program.

[UNLV]

[quote name="ispeakjive" post="848164" timestamp="1284585690"]
Obviously, if the SLC changes dramatically over the next three or four years, the conference affiliation may have to change, but at this point, I would rather the program go in the direction of McNeese rather than North Texas.  I don't even know that FBS is feasible in terms of facilities, stadium size, and money available to the program.
[/quote]Why did you pick North Texas and not Boise st as your example?

[ispeakjive]

That's a fair question, but it is ultimately apples and oranges.  Boise St. is the only big time program in Idaho and in that region.  They get their pick of the players in that region and have been successful enough to recruit outside of that region as well.  I love Lamar, but we would be competing to be the eighth pick of FBS recruits in the state behind UT, A&M, Tech, UH, Baylor, UTEP, and Rice.  And that doesn't even factor in LSU, Oklahoma, North Texas, and the other FBS schools in the state and region.  Lamar can fill a FCS niche here especially if Texas State and UTSA move up and have a very successful program for years to come.

[UNLV]

[quote name="ispeakjive" post="848356" timestamp="1284607278"]
That's a fair question, but it is ultimately apples and oranges.  Boise St. is the only big time program in Idaho and in that region.  They get their pick of the players in that region and have been successful enough to recruit outside of that region as well.  I love Lamar, but we would be competing to be the eighth pick of FBS recruits in the state behind UT, A&M, Tech, UH, Baylor, UTEP, and Rice.  And that doesn't even factor in LSU, Oklahoma, North Texas, and the other FBS schools in the state and region.  Lamar can fill a FCS niche here especially if Texas State and UTSA move up and have a very successful program for years to come.
[/quote]Exactly like they did when they dropped the football program playing I-AA/FCS. Community support will once again dry up if LU
continue to bring in "who are you" schools. That is a fact backed up by Lamars own history.

[sleepy]

[quote name="UNLV" post="848291" timestamp="1284600288"]
[quote author=ispeakjive link=topic=72967.msg848164#msg848164 date=1284585690]
Obviously, if the SLC changes dramatically over the next three or four years, the conference affiliation may have to change, but at this point, I would rather the program go in the direction of McNeese rather than North Texas.  I don't even know that FBS is feasible in terms of facilities, stadium size, and money available to the program.
[/quote]Why did you pick North Texas and not Boise st as your example?
[/quote]

What did Boise State do before they became Boise State?

[NorthoftheBorder]

[quote name="UNLV" post="848397" timestamp="1284633475"]
[quote author=ispeakjive link=topic=72967.msg848356#msg848356 date=1284607278]
That's a fair question, but it is ultimately apples and oranges.  Boise St. is the only big time program in Idaho and in that region.  They get their pick of the players in that region and have been successful enough to recruit outside of that region as well.  I love Lamar, but we would be competing to be the eighth pick of FBS recruits in the state behind UT, A&M, Tech, UH, Baylor, UTEP, and Rice.  And that doesn't even factor in LSU, Oklahoma, North Texas, and the other FBS schools in the state and region.  Lamar can fill a FCS niche here especially if Texas State and UTSA move up and have a very successful program for years to come.
[/quote]Exactly like they did when they dropped the football program playing I-AA/FCS. Community support will once again dry up if LU
continue to bring in "who are you" schools. That is a fact backed up by Lamars own history.
[/quote]

We had a full house for Webber International because it was a the first home game in 21 years.  Bring them in 3 or 4 years from now and the crowd will not be nearly what it was.  I am ecstactic its back, have season tickets, and am 100% behind the program.  But in an age where you can have your choice of 15+ college games on TV on a Saturday night, it's my concern that the average fan will stay home and watch a game between VT and Boise State instead of coming to see Webber Int. @ PU stadium.  No matter, I am encouraged that Ray Woodard is the real deal and has put together a very good staff and he wants to win.  I think that what should be happening is the LU brass should have its finger on the pulse of what coach Woodard wants for his own carreer.  If his goal is to coach in the FBS some day, then if he has what it takes to do that, he will leave when his success level reaches the ceiling of what he know the goal and committment of the University is.  That's why Tubbs left in 1980.  He wanted more for the program than the adminstration did at the time and he went somewhere that had the same goal and committment as he did.  I don't think I need to chronicle the history of the basketball program  from that point to today.  Successfful businesses (college athletic programs) don't sit back and bask in the glory of their most recent success and take it easy and be satisfied with where they are at that moment, they are always  in tune to what is going on and what the goal is ahead and how to achieve it.  That said, go BIG RED!

[sleepy]

[quote name="UNLV" post="848397" timestamp="1284633475"]
[quote author=ispeakjive link=topic=72967.msg848356#msg848356 date=1284607278]
That's a fair question, but it is ultimately apples and oranges.  Boise St. is the only big time program in Idaho and in that region.  They get their pick of the players in that region and have been successful enough to recruit outside of that region as well.  I love Lamar, but we would be competing to be the eighth pick of FBS recruits in the state behind UT, A&M, Tech, UH, Baylor, UTEP, and Rice.  And that doesn't even factor in LSU, Oklahoma, North Texas, and the other FBS schools in the state and region.  Lamar can fill a FCS niche here especially if Texas State and UTSA move up and have a very successful program for years to come.
[/quote]Exactly like they did when they dropped the football program playing I-AA/FCS. Community support will once again dry up if LU
continue to bring in "who are you" schools. That is a fact backed up by Lamars own history.
[/quote]

Football is a different game today than it was 25 years ago.  There is much more interest now than there was and we also have one man who as long as we satisfy him we are fine.  He does not want to go FBS tomorrow or anytime soon.  He wants to be a force in FCS for a while and see where it takes us.  If Lamar puts a WINNING product on the field that is ALL THAT MATTERS TO THIS COMMUNITY!!! There is one way for us to win now and that is FCS!

[coachacola]

[quote name="sleepy" post="848450" timestamp="1284648058"]
[quote author=UNLV link=topic=72967.msg848397#msg848397 date=1284633475]
[quote author=ispeakjive link=topic=72967.msg848356#msg848356 date=1284607278]
That's a fair question, but it is ultimately apples and oranges.  Boise St. is the only big time program in Idaho and in that region.  They get their pick of the players in that region and have been successful enough to recruit outside of that region as well.  I love Lamar, but we would be competing to be the eighth pick of FBS recruits in the state behind UT, A&M, Tech, UH, Baylor, UTEP, and Rice.  And that doesn't even factor in LSU, Oklahoma, North Texas, and the other FBS schools in the state and region.  Lamar can fill a FCS niche here especially if Texas State and UTSA move up and have a very successful program for years to come.
[/quote]Exactly like they did when they dropped the football program playing I-AA/FCS. Community support will once again dry up if LU
continue to bring in "who are you" schools. That is a fact backed up by Lamars own history.
[/quote]

Football is a different game today than it was 25 years ago.  There is much more interest now than there was and we also have one man who as long as we satisfy him we are fine.  He does not want to go FBS tomorrow or anytime soon.  He wants to be a force in FCS for a while and see where it takes us.  If Lamar puts a WINNING product on the field that is ALL THAT MATTERS TO THIS COMMUNITY!!! There is one way for us to win now and that is FCS!
[/quote]

Who is this "one man"?  I've heard both Dr. Simmons and Billy Tubbs talk about going FBS in the future.  Is there someone else in the athletic department that doesn't want Lamar to go FBS?  From the PA News back in Feb 2009:

[quote]Shhhh... quiet, please.... Jimmy Simmons is dreaming. The Lamar University president is not trying to toot his own saxophone either.

"It probably won't happen under my administration," Dr. Simmons mused on Friday afternoon. "But we will have a beautifully designed football stadium.

If you decide to go into the bowl division, our stadium could easily expand to 36,000.... You don't want to leave them short-handed for the future... If you don't dream big, you can't have big dreams happen."

That's the kind of dreamer which Lamar's visionary leader really is. The good saxophone player already has dreamed big enough for the LU-Beaumont campus to restore football after a 20-year absence. It took such dreams and determination to shove Lamar football beyond the dream stage.[/quote]

http://panews.com/sports/x681461095/Jimmy-Simmons-moves-Lamar-in-position-to-expand-horizons?keyword=topstory

I still think Lamar is still 4 or 5 years from going FBS, but if an opportunity opens up they have to at least look into it.

[Texantagonise]

[quote name="UNLV" post="848397" timestamp="1284633475"]
[quote author=ispeakjive link=topic=72967.msg848356#msg848356 date=1284607278]

[/quote]Exactly like they did [b]when they dropped the football program playing I-AA/FCS. Community support will once again dry up [/b]if LU
continue to bring in "who are you" schools. That is a fact backed up by Lamars own history.
[/quote]
I am tired of seeing this generalized misstatement.  Lets look at some real facts for demise of football at Lamar.  From 1975 to the final game in 1989 Lamar was 38 - 90 - 3 that is an awful record. Plus in '86 and '87 they had their two wordt defensive teams in school history.  Giving up 339 and 389 points in those seasons.  And in this area if you don't win the people don't show.  Just ask the Beaumont Golden Gator, Bullfrogs, Wildcatters, and Drillers. The real death blow for Lamar football was the school moving to a "Basketball" conference where football was not played.  Then Lamar had to play as an independent and could only get FOUR home games the last two seasons. 
So the demise of Lamar was from over a decade of BAD football and the university thinking BIG.  They had the BIG DREAM of Lamar being a basketball powerhouse and gave no thought of what it would do to football.

So please quit saying that FCS is what killed Lamar football.