Questions for Bluedove

[CThoops]

I wasnt trying to be mean  :D Just understand the difference between "Making" a shot and "Shooting" a shot..  ;D

Don't think there is any argument there..

Relax both of you. The fact is you need both on a team to be successful. period.

[stevenash]

[quote name="dogs1218" post="926862" timestamp="1291583282"]
I wasnt trying to be mean  :D Just understand the difference between "Making" a shot and "Shooting" a shot..  ;D

Don't think there is any argument there..

Relax both of you. The fact is you need both on a team to be successful. period.
[/quote]

You hit the nail on the head with that statement.  Both styles very complimentary of each other and the presence of each makes the other more effective.

[Aces_Full]

How would I get the ball up the court?  I guess the old fashioned way, good passing and execution.  Some people on this board seem to think "spot up" shooter means you can't dribble, pass, run an offense, or play defense.  You don't have to be Allen Iverson to get the ball up the court against pressure, just have to be able to protect the basketball and attack what is given.  Larry Bird was slower than Christmas and couldn't jump over a nickel, but he could create for others because he could read defenders and defenses, and knew how to attack them.  Oh and he was also the greatest "spot up" shooter of all time.  ;)

[east texas bb]

We are all just getting lost in the definitions of what each is.  The first thing that started the topic was I asked whether the Bosha kid could create his own shot or if he was getting kickouts because someone said that he was the best player in SETexas and another said he had the possibilty of being a star and going to the NBA.  Then it got turned into who was better a spot up shooter or playmaker, someone I term as having the ability to shoot open shots, create a shot off the dribble, and create shots for others where as a  only spot up shooter could not do the latter two things.

I dont think a spot up shooter is limited on offense. I think he can dribble, pass, play defense, but his dribble will be limited and his passing will be limited.  The first thing in basketball you learn is to dribble the ball.  Without that step you cant go to the next. 
So I am assuming you could put 5 spot up shooters on the basketball court and break a press without dribbling and then score on offense without dribbling, by using passing and execution only.  I havent seen a game yet where there was not a dribble. 
And please do not compare Allen Iverson to a playmaker, he was an Allen Iverson maker, he created for himself only. 
And I never said you had to jump high or run fast to be a playmaker.  I didnt say you needed uughs and aahhs.  I could care less about that stuff.  I asked my wife this question earlier, who knows very little of the game, and she even knew the answer.  A player who creates his shot and for others and hit the spot up jumper is more valuable than the spot up shooter.  Larry Bird was most definetly a playmaker.  You can be both a shooter and a playmaker.  My argument is that one is limited and the other is not unless he limits himself, like Iverson.

[stevenash]

[quote name="Aces_Full" post="926950" timestamp="1291588772"]
How would I get the ball up the court?  I guess the old fashioned way, good passing and execution.  Some people on this board seem to think "spot up" shooter means you can't dribble, pass, run an offense, or play defense.  You don't have to be Allen Iverson to get the ball up the court against pressure, just have to be able to protect the basketball and attack what is given.  Larry Bird was slower than Christmas and couldn't jump over a nickel, but he could create for others because he could read defenders and defenses, and knew how to attack them.  Oh and he was also the greatest "spot up" shooter of all time.   ;)
[/quote]

He also made a lot of drives to the basket because the "quicker" guy had to guard him so close so as to prevent the field goal attempt.  Looks to me like being a great shooter, in  effect, makes it possible for you to create your own alternative shot.

[east texas bb]

Exactly, that is what made him a playmaker.  He could shoot and dribble and pass.  Not just shoot.  Good post.

[stevenash]

[quote name="east texas bb" post="927036" timestamp="1291592995"]
Exactly, that is what made him a playmaker.  He could shoot and dribble and pass.  Not just shoot.  Good post.
[/quote]

Bosha can do same.

[Guest speechless]

if Nate would flourish in other places explain what happened in New York and why they were so willing to let him go for someone (eddie house) who they ended up letting go a year later?

[stevenash]

[quote name="speechless" post="927168" timestamp="1291598045"]
if Nate would flourish in other places explain what happened in New York and why they were so willing to let him go for someone (eddie house) who they ended up letting go a year later?
[/quote]

Management in New York and Boston are unknowledgeable and incompetent.

[AggiesAreWe]

[quote name="stevenash" post="927175" timestamp="1291598293"]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=77007.msg927168#msg927168 date=1291598045]
if Nate would flourish in other places explain what happened in New York and why they were so willing to let him go for someone (eddie house) who they ended up letting go a year later?
[/quote]

[b]Management in New York and Boston are unknowledgeable and incompetent.[/b][/quote]


I agree.

[stevenash]

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="927177" timestamp="1291598345"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=77007.msg927175#msg927175 date=1291598293]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=77007.msg927168#msg927168 date=1291598045]
if Nate would flourish in other places explain what happened in New York and why they were so willing to let him go for someone (eddie house) who they ended up letting go a year later?
[/quote]

[b]Management in New York and Boston are unknowledgeable and incompetent.[/b][/quote]


I agree.
[/quote]  Could one then conclude if management is incompetent at the upper level such as in Boston, then it follows that management would be only equal or worse at the less successful franchises?

[Rockin A]

come on, you're killin us!

[stevenash]

[quote name="LT Dan" post="927295" timestamp="1291607737"]
come on, you're killin us!
[/quote] ;D

[BLUEDOVE3]

Guys! First of all, we can't continue to try and interchange NBA players and their style against high school players in this area. Some weeks ago, many of us agreed that the talent pool in high school for this area is far below the previous talent pool to come out of SETex. Bird was a player maker, more like todays point forwards. I've been limited to seeing high school play in this area but I am going to assume that you may have 10 or less [color=red]impact [/color] players in this area. I thought the original questioning was about high school players. Futhermore, I'm not comparing no players to Larry BIRD, AI, Rondo, etc. because the majority of these kids today treat my game like a hobby. They don't know any history of the game, can't dribble, can't shoot, and keep tripping over their own feet. Bird didn't have a X-Box.

[stevenash]

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="927393" timestamp="1291647646"]
Guys! First of all, we can't continue to try and interchange NBA players and their style against high school players in this area. Some weeks ago, many of us agreed that the talent pool in high school for this area is far below the previous talent pool to come out of SETex. Bird was a player maker, more like todays point forwards. I've been limited to seeing high school play in this area but I am going to assume that you may have 10 or less [color=red]impact [/color] players in this area. I thought the original questioning was about high school players. Futhermore, I'm not comparing no players to Larry BIRD, AI, Rondo, etc. because the majority of these kids today treat my game like a hobby. They don't know any history of the game, can't dribble, can't shoot, and keep tripping over their own feet. Bird didn't have a X-Box.
[/quote]

Does your next to last sentence accurately describe your personal perception of a "spot up shooter"?

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="stevenash" post="927580" timestamp="1291668444"]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=77007.msg927393#msg927393 date=1291647646]
Guys! First of all, we can't continue to try and interchange NBA players and their style against high school players in this area. Some weeks ago, many of us agreed that the talent pool in high school for this area is far below the previous talent pool to come out of SETex. Bird was a player maker, more like todays point forwards. I've been limited to seeing high school play in this area but I am going to assume that you may have 10 or less [color=red]impact [/color] players in this area. I thought the original questioning was about high school players. Futhermore, I'm not comparing no players to Larry BIRD, AI, Rondo, etc. because the majority of these kids today treat my game like a hobby. They don't know any history of the game, can't dribble, can't shoot, and keep tripping over their own feet. Bird didn't have a X-Box.
[/quote]

Does your next to last sentence accurately describe your personal perception of a "spot up shooter"?
[/quote]Stevie, remind me to not send you a Thanksgiving pie to your family next year. Always trying to twist stuff ;) I have much respect for spot-up shooters, but they are boring as hell when they are off.

[east texas bb]

I will take a pie Bluedove. 

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="east texas bb" post="927695" timestamp="1291680844"]
I will take a pie Bluedove. 
[/quote] ;)

[stevenash]

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="927584" timestamp="1291668675"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=77007.msg927580#msg927580 date=1291668444]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=77007.msg927393#msg927393 date=1291647646]
Guys! First of all, we can't continue to try and interchange NBA players and their style against high school players in this area. Some weeks ago, many of us agreed that the talent pool in high school for this area is far below the previous talent pool to come out of SETex. Bird was a player maker, more like todays point forwards. I've been limited to seeing high school play in this area but I am going to assume that you may have 10 or less [color=red]impact [/color] players in this area. I thought the original questioning was about high school players. Futhermore, I'm not comparing no players to Larry BIRD, AI, Rondo, etc. because the majority of these kids today treat my game like a hobby. They don't know any history of the game, can't dribble, can't shoot, and keep tripping over their own feet. Bird didn't have a X-Box.
[/quote]
Just like the creators are when they turn the ball over. ;D
Does your next to last sentence accurately describe your personal perception of a "spot up shooter"?
[/quote]Stevie, remind me to not send you a Thanksgiving pie to your family next year. Always trying to twist stuff ;) I have much respect for spot-up shooters, but they are boring as heck when they are off.
[/quote]