Nederland vs. Port Neches-Groves Game Thread/Nederland wins/Comments

[pngpurple4ever]

That was the most bone headed coaching decision I have ever seen. You have to go out and try to force a turnover, a bad shot, etc. Worst case is Ned. scores or shoots free throws. You still have plenty of time to score yourself. Letting Ned. get the last shot was plain STUPID!!!!

[BMTSoulja1]

Forcing the action will most likely draw a foul.  Would you want Neeedrland scoring points with the clock NOT moving or with the clock moving?  Also, Nederland may have messed up their last play and jacked up a 3 pointer, missed, giving way to a long reboud, giving you a chance to take a couple of dribbles and get a layup or 3 pointer off.  But wait, you have to be able to box out and grab a reboud for that to happen. 

Point is, PN-G coach banked on his boys to play sound defense and box out, AKA sound defense. You Have to find your man and box out, people...

[Honest Abe]

[quote name="pngpurple4ever" post="957208" timestamp="1296316429"]
That was the most bone headed coaching decision I have ever seen. You have to go out and try to force a turnover, a bad shot, etc. Worst case is Ned. scores or shoots free throws. You still have plenty of time to score yourself. Letting Ned. get the last shot was plain STUPID!!!!
[/quote]

Have U ever coached at the High School level/or higher?? If not, then U have no right to comment on the coach. If U think U can do better, maybe U should get out there urself and see how 'easy' it is. I'm sure U would never make a 'bone headed coaching decision'. Come on man, how about some respect for the hard work and hours upon end coach Abel and others put in every season. Have U ever even played high school b-ball or higher??

[ForeverADog]

To answer your question Soulja I would much rather have the other team score with the clock not moving because then I would have time to score. PNG would have had no advantage in OT. The crowd was 50 50. And Ned made a great comeback to get it to OT so they had the momentum. Plus when you have the ball you have more control. By playing sound defense for that minute at least gives you the ball or time to win. You play to win. PNG played not to lose.

Also #12 for PNG deserves great respect. He played the game of his life. Very small but a great stroke and used his ball fakes to perfection. Nobody played harder than him.

Finally how about that atmosphere? Coach English has a tape he showed us and still shows his players before every Ned PNG from when he was playing. He scored at the buzzer to beat PNG much like Kelvin just did but the game was at the Dog Dome and about 500 more fans stormed the court than last night. Its great motivation and glad to see the rivalry is finally back to where it was 30 years ago. Its been a long time since a basketball game has been that relevant in this rivalry.

[BMTSoulja1]

[quote name="ForeverADog" post="957284" timestamp="1296324670"]
To answer your question Soulja I would much rather have the other team score with the clock not moving because then I would have time to score. PNG would have had no advantage in OT. The crowd was 50 50. And Ned made a great comeback to get it to OT so they had the momentum. Plus when you have the ball you have more control. By playing sound defense for that minute at least gives you the ball or time to win. You play to win. PNG played not to lose.

Also #12 for PNG deserves great respect. He played the game of his life. Very small but a great stroke and used his ball fakes to perfection. Nobody played harder than him.

Finally how about that atmosphere? Coach English has a tape he showed us and still shows his players before every Ned PNG from when he was playing. He scored at the buzzer to beat PNG much like Kelvin just did but the game was at the Dog Dome and about 500 more fans stormed the court than last night. Its great motivation and glad to see the rivalry is finally back to where it was 30 years ago. Its been a long time since a basketball game has been that relevant in this rivalry.
[/quote]Excuse my last post as it was done from the Cell Phone with the misspelled letters and punctuation errors.

I had completely forget that PN-G led the entire game and Nederland grabbed momentum late.  I'm assuming that Nedeland had the momentum.  Now I can see the argument.  I'm normally for letting your team play defense, but in this case, I see why you would have forced the issue, ForeverADog .  But I also see what PN-G's coach was doing and it may have worked if they would have carried out the play as instructed.  I'm willing to bet that the PN-G coach, one of his last words during the last dead ball, was to 'please box out!'  Had they boxed out, I'm sure the Nederland players would have still went for the offensive rebound and it would have been called over the back foul, probably putting PN-G on the line to win the game.  BTW, was Nederland in the penalty at the end of the game?

[Honest Abe]

[quote name="BMTSoulja1" post="957301" timestamp="1296328367"]
[quote author=ForeverADog link=topic=79456.msg957284#msg957284 date=1296324670]
To answer your question Soulja I would much rather have the other team score with the clock not moving because then I would have time to score. PNG would have had no advantage in OT. The crowd was 50 50. And Ned made a great comeback to get it to OT so they had the momentum. Plus when you have the ball you have more control. By playing sound defense for that minute at least gives you the ball or time to win. You play to win. PNG played not to lose.

Also #12 for PNG deserves great respect. He played the game of his life. Very small but a great stroke and used his ball fakes to perfection. Nobody played harder than him.



Finally how about that atmosphere? Coach English has a tape he showed us and still shows his players before every Ned PNG from when he was playing. He scored at the buzzer to beat PNG much like Kelvin just did but the game was at the Dog Dome and about 500 more fans sto



rmed the court than last night. Its great motivation and glad to see the rivalry is finally back to where it was 30 years ago. Its been a long time since a basketball game has been that relevant in this rivalry.
[/quote]Excuse my last post as it was done from the Cell Phone with the misspelled letters and punctuation errors.


I had completely forget that PN-G led the entire game and Nederland grabbed momentum late.  I'm assuming that Nedeland had the momentum.  Now I can see the argument.  I'm normally for letting your team play defense, but in this case, I see why you would have forced the issue, ForeverADog .  But I also see what PN-G's coach was doing and it may have worked if they would have carried out the play as instructed.  I'm willing to bet that the PN-G coach, one of his last words during the last dead ball, was to 'please box out!'  Had they



boxed out, I'm sure the Nederland players would have still went for the offensive rebound and it would have been called over the back foul, probably putting PN-G on the line to win the game.  BTW, was Nederland in the penalty at the end of the game?
[/quote]

#12 was AMAZING last night. That kid played his heart out! Nederland was not in the penalty.  Abel COULD have fouled with 3 secs or so, and Ned would have had to take the ball out of bounds.

[team first]

soulja there was a foul to give, png only had 5 fouls at the time

[ForeverADog]

I do like the idea of fouling. Would have been a viable option.

[AshlyHasBeen]

That "boneheaded" decision is made at every level. You make a team score on you by not coming out of your defense in a tie game.

[bulldogbasketball]

Sitting back for the last 90 seconds WORKED! In case everyone forgot Nederland missed the three, so had Kelvin been boxed out we are looking at OT. If PNG had boxed Kelvin out and won the game then everyone would be praising the coach for a great job.

[baddog]

I've read so many posts about how PNG could have won this game in the final minute or so and I prefer to discuss other ways PNG could have won this game.......play better defense the whole game, hit those FTs when you had the chance, get that offensive rebound and go back up for two, hit that 3. In other words, you had your opponent down the whole game and they came back to win on the road. Plenty of opportunities missed to harp on THE LAST PLAY. Just the way I see it.

Great come from behind road win Dogs! You made the plays when it counted and that's what produces wins! Keep it going!

[AggiesAreWe]

I have spoken to a few of our area coaches since last night. I asked them about this scenario. They all to a man agreed with how Coach Able played that last minute. He probably felt his team was outmanned and wanted to keep it to one possession and take is chances. It turned out he did play it right in that they forced a 3 ball which was missed. Unfortunately, nobody boxed out the backside (which happens on a corner 3).

If he forces the issue, probably more bad things happen for PNG than good. Nederland is the better team and he needed to keep their scoring to a minimum by giving them only a few seconds to get 1 shot off and not have multiple chances of winning the game late.

Who knows how overtime would have went, but Coach Able played it right.

[ForeverADog]

Just not my strategy. Not sure how allowing a wide open uncontested 3 to a player who finished the game 5 of 7 from 3 point land was what you wanted from that sequence. I just feel they got lucky he missed it.

Abel was definitely shouting the entire time to rebound any shot. He for sure was right about that it just didn't happen.

[AshlyHasBeen]

Well actually they were in a 2-3, double teamed the ball handler on the pass to Dionte. #14 came out then the pass to English made #14 late getting there due to the double team.

[Guest Two-Dogs...]

I believe Able did what was best for that group of kids in that particular situation. I have a son who has played on PNG's varsity team for three years and I have seen every game in that time frame. We never have nor will we ever be the most athletic team on the court. We win through pace of play and solid defense. We can score when we have to in most situations however our strong suit is half court defense. Able's strategy last night worked. There was a wrench thrown in when nobody blocked out Kelvin. Had we made it to OT who knows what would've happened.
I do know this though. All the PNG haters on this board (soulja, aaw, joey, lazeek and others) are going to puke all over themselves at the end of this basketball season when the Tribe takes a playoff spot!

[baddog]

[quote name="Two-Dogs..." post="957429" timestamp="1296349078"]
I believe Able did what was best for that group of kids in that particular situation. I have a son who has played on PNG's varsity team for three years and I have seen every game in that time frame. We never have nor will we ever be the most athletic team on the court. We win through pace of play and solid defense. We can score when we have to in most situations however our strong suit is half court defense. Able's strategy last night worked. There was a wrench thrown in when nobody blocked out Kelvin. Had we made it to OT who knows what would've happened.
I do know this though. All the PNG haters on this board (soulja, aaw, joey, lazeek and others) are going to puke all over themselves at the end of this basketball season when the Tribe takes a playoff spot!
[/quote]

Wow, those guys are all mods.

I don't hate PNG. I simply feel that there are always other factors that could have happened to keep the game from coming down to that last play. I am a firm believer in the fact that basketball games (of course not all) are won at the FT line.

[PNG Proud]

[quote name="Two-Dogs..." post="957429" timestamp="1296349078"]
I believe Able did what was best for that group of kids in that particular situation. I have a son who has played on PNG's varsity team for three years and I have seen every game in that time frame. We never have nor will we ever be the most athletic team on the court. We win through pace of play and solid defense. We can score when we have to in most situations however our strong suit is half court defense. Able's strategy last night worked. There was a wrench thrown in when nobody blocked out Kelvin. Had we made it to OT who knows what would've happened.
I do know this though. All the PNG haters on this board (soulja, aaw, joey, lazeek and others) are going to puke all over themselves at the end of this basketball season when the Tribe takes a playoff spot!
[/quote]




I don't find those guys to be haters, although there are plenty on here.  By and large, I find them to be fair and level headed.  JMO

[missbulldawg]

[quote name="badndn" post="957066" timestamp="1296278581"]
[quote author=Honest Abe link=topic=79456.msg957043#msg957043 date=1296277633]They r kids! If the fans acted that way and made fun of the kids, then shame on them. But I think it was the students (as U mentioned) who were inappropriate.  Welcome to a Ned/PN-G matchup. It's been like this for what 40 yrs??
[/quote]
Same can be said about the "Fagot" comment by the PNG "KID" which is what started this all. Remember a Dog fan lumped all PNG fans in as "SORE LOOSERS" because of one kid. I agree with you, kids do stupid stuff all the time!

And no Ned/PNG matchups have not been like this for 40 years...This may have been the first time ever that a PNG/Ned basketball game was relevent in the SE TX basketball scene. ;D

[quote author=Nederland B-Dog Fan link=topic=79456.msg957056#msg957056 date=1296278347]
Congrats dogs for the victory! I didn't hear what PNG fans said about our freshman but I was sitting next to our student section and they just chanted "West is Best" not Indianettes suck. Nederland vs PNG never seens to dissapoint in any sport
[/quote] My daughter is an Indianette. She told me that they didn't chant it, but  many of them said it while they lined up.

[/quote][color=limegreen][/color]Honestly......the fans running out on the court wasn't just because we beat PNG. This is very exciting. Coach English has brought Ned basketball to a new level. Haven't been to the playoffs in 50 years until he came? Impressive! Ranked #20 in the state also very impressive! So being irritated about that, does fall under the sore loser category.

Also, as we were out there it wasn't just "one" kid that said something derogatory to our freshman. It was several players and fans as well. The rivalry is fun when it is kept clean but when it becomes brutal and affects the kids and their self esteem,there's a problem. Not too sure if we can do too much about the fans but the players should be ashamed of themselves.

We could sit and point fingers back and forth, that doesn't solve the problem. We need to talk to our kids. It's just sad that some parents are just as bad. Regardless, both teams played a great game.

[BMTSoulja1]

[quote name="Two-Dogs..." post="957429" timestamp="1296349078"]
I believe Able did what was best for that group of kids in that particular situation. I have a son who has played on PNG's varsity team for three years and I have seen every game in that time frame. We never have nor will we ever be the most athletic team on the court. We win through pace of play and solid defense. We can score when we have to in most situations however our strong suit is half court defense. Able's strategy last night worked. There was a wrench thrown in when nobody blocked out Kelvin. Had we made it to OT who knows what would've happened.
I do know this though. All the PNG haters on this board (soulja, aaw, joey, lazeek and others) are going to puke all over themselves at the end of this basketball season when the Tribe takes a playoff spot!
[/quote]When did I turn into an Indian hater?  I'm on YOUR side. I think the PN-G coach made the right decision.  Maybe you need to go back and read this thread again...

[DogOne]

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="957372" timestamp="1296338323"]
I have spoken to a few of our area coaches since last night. I asked them about this scenario. They all to a man agreed with how Coach Able played that last minute. He probably felt his team was outmanned and wanted to keep it to one possession and take is chances. It turned out he did play it right in that they forced a 3 ball which was missed. Unfortunately, nobody boxed out the backside (which happens on a corner 3).

If he forces the issue, probably more bad things happen for PNG than good. Nederland is the better team and he needed to keep their scoring to a minimum by giving them only a few seconds to get 1 shot off and not have multiple chances of winning the game late.

Who knows how overtime would have went, but Coach Able played it right.
[/quote]

If he felt his team was out-manned, why did he play for OT?  The longer the game goes, the more likely it is that the better team is going to win.  IMO, PN-G should've played aggressive defense when there was still a minute or so to go in the game.  By doing this, PN-G could've forced a turnover or gotten the ball back trailing by only 1 or 2 and had enough time to score the winning basket.

[FanintheStands]

[quote name="BMTSoulja1" post="957529" timestamp="1296362346"]
When did I turn into an Indian hater?  I'm on YOUR side. I think the PN-G coach made the right decision.  Maybe you need to go back and read this thread again...
[/quote]OK, I'm still confused.

By stalling the ball, the WORST that Nederland could do was go into overtime  (Let's say a 50-50 chance of that happening).  In overtime, they have a 50-50 chance of winning.

By allowing them to stall, the BEST that PNG could do was go into overtime (again 50-50).  In overtime, they have a 50-50 chance of winning.

So, by allowing Nederland to dribble out the clock, PNG only gave themselves a 25% chance of winning!!!! How is that the smart decision for a team that is tied up with 90 seconds to play?!?!?

[TradinUp BH]

I was at the game and walking my young kids out of the gym after the game. Both sides were mouthing off at each other. I think the NDN fans took offense because of the heated game and then afterwards students from the visiting school staying on the court mouthing. I guess I'm going to be a homer and say that if you win a game at somebody else's house, take the win and move on. There was no need to linger around and play the mouthing game with the team that lost. It went both ways, and it was parents involved also. The PNG administrators had to grab several Ned students and pull them away from the PNG side, they may have had to do the same with the PNG students, but I didn't see it. Some of the conduct I seen from both sides was a depressing end of a great game. Good luck to the Dogs and NDNS for the rest of the season.

[AggiesAreWe]

[quote name="Two-Dogs..." post="957429" timestamp="1296349078"]
I believe Able did what was best for that group of kids in that particular situation. I have a son who has played on PNG's varsity team for three years and I have seen every game in that time frame. We never have nor will we ever be the most athletic team on the court. We win through pace of play and solid defense. We can score when we have to in most situations however our strong suit is half court defense. Able's strategy last night worked. There was a wrench thrown in when nobody blocked out Kelvin. Had we made it to OT who knows what would've happened.
I do know this though. All the PNG haters on this board (soulja, aaw, joey, lazeek and others) are going to puke all over themselves at the end of this basketball season when the Tribe takes a playoff spot!
[/quote]


WOW!! Never knew I was a PNG hater. Learn something new every day. BTW, Joey is a PNG grad. ;)

[stevenash]

[quote name="pngpurple4ever" post="957208" timestamp="1296316429"]
That was the most bone headed coaching decision I have ever seen. You have to go out and try to force a turnover, a bad shot, etc. Worst case is Ned. scores or shoots free throws. You still have plenty of time to score yourself. Letting Ned. get the last shot was plain STUPID!!!!
[/quote]

If the PNG coach was "smart enough" to have a considerable underdog "in the game" in the last minute/seconds, would it stand to reason he is smart enough to handle the closing seconds of the same game?

[FanintheStands]

[quote name="stevenash" post="957575" timestamp="1296390492"]
[quote author=pngpurple4ever link=topic=79456.msg957208#msg957208 date=1296316429]
That was the most bone headed coaching decision I have ever seen. You have to go out and try to force a turnover, a bad shot, etc. Worst case is Ned. scores or shoots free throws. You still have plenty of time to score yourself. Letting Ned. get the last shot was plain STUPID!!!!
[/quote]

If the PNG coach was "smart enough" to have a considerable underdog "in the game" in the last minute/seconds, would it stand to reason he is smart enough to handle the closing seconds of the same game?
[/quote]If the Nederland coach wants to run out the clock and take the last shot and the PNG coach wants Nederland to keep it  to the last shot, would it stand to reason that one of them could be wrong?