Free Throw Shooting !!!!

[FanintheStands]

[quote name="stevenash" post="965988" timestamp="1297717918"]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg965968#msg965968 date=1297716302]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965910#msg965910 date=1297710193]
[quote author=FlexD33 link=topic=80209.msg965811#msg965811 date=1297696184]
Free throws win championships......if i remember right in 2010 when HJ made it to the state simi finals they went something like 16 for 30 or some where around those numbers from the free throw line. I still think to this day if they woudl have made atleast 5 more free throws they would have been playing for a state championship that year. IMO free throws are as easy as you want them to be, I've seen players just staright up panic when they get the free throw line. Then I've seen other players get up there like its nothing and sink the biggest two shots of the season....its all about muscle memory
[/quote]

I agree with everything you say.  However, sometimes, a fluke comes along.  Ask LeBron how he felt yesterday when he had two shots to tie the game with the Celtics in the last 10 seconds.  Sometimes the mental aspect influences the muscle memory.
[/quote]True, but I also heard the ESPN announcer quote some sick percentages from Lebron when the game is near the end and the score is close..... something like 90-95% during that time.

The only problem with the percentages is sometimes those "5-10%" chances actually happen.
[/quote]

This wasnt ANY game- it was the Celtics
[/quote]Ok..............

Are you allowed to miss a shot against the 76'ers and not the Celtics?

[stevenash]

[quote name="FanintheStands" post="966173" timestamp="1297740157"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965988#msg965988 date=1297717918]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg965968#msg965968 date=1297716302]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965910#msg965910 date=1297710193]
[quote author=FlexD33 link=topic=80209.msg965811#msg965811 date=1297696184]
Free throws win championships......if i remember right in 2010 when HJ made it to the state simi finals they went something like 16 for 30 or some where around those numbers from the free throw line. I still think to this day if they woudl have made atleast 5 more free throws they would have been playing for a state championship that year. IMO free throws are as easy as you want them to be, I've seen players just staright up panic when they get the free throw line. Then I've seen other players get up there like its nothing and sink the biggest two shots of the season....its all about muscle memory
[/quote]

I agree with everything you say.  However, sometimes, a fluke comes along.  Ask LeBron how he felt yesterday when he had two shots to tie the game with the Celtics in the last 10 seconds.  Sometimes the mental aspect influences the muscle memory.
[/quote]True, but I also heard the ESPN announcer quote some sick percentages from Lebron when the game is near the end and the score is close..... something like 90-95% during that time.

The only problem with the percentages is sometimes those "5-10%" chances actually happen.
[/quote]

This wasnt ANY game- it was the Celtics
[/quote]Ok..............

Are you allowed to miss a shot against the 76'ers and not the Celtics?
[/quote]

The suggestion is the pressure is greater against the celts than the sixers.  YOu may make a 6 foot putt with me and miss it with Tiger in the foursome

[LumRaiderFan]

[quote name="stevenash" post="966182" timestamp="1297740620"]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg966173#msg966173 date=1297740157]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965988#msg965988 date=1297717918]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg965968#msg965968 date=1297716302]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965910#msg965910 date=1297710193]
[quote author=FlexD33 link=topic=80209.msg965811#msg965811 date=1297696184]
Free throws win championships......if i remember right in 2010 when HJ made it to the state simi finals they went something like 16 for 30 or some where around those numbers from the free throw line. I still think to this day if they woudl have made atleast 5 more free throws they would have been playing for a state championship that year. IMO free throws are as easy as you want them to be, I've seen players just staright up panic when they get the free throw line. Then I've seen other players get up there like its nothing and sink the biggest two shots of the season....its all about muscle memory
[/quote]

I agree with everything you say.  However, sometimes, a fluke comes along.  Ask LeBron how he felt yesterday when he had two shots to tie the game with the Celtics in the last 10 seconds.  Sometimes the mental aspect influences the muscle memory.
[/quote]True, but I also heard the ESPN announcer quote some sick percentages from Lebron when the game is near the end and the score is close..... something like 90-95% during that time.

The only problem with the percentages is sometimes those "5-10%" chances actually happen.
[/quote]

This wasnt ANY game- it was the Celtics
[/quote]Ok..............

Are you allowed to miss a shot against the 76'ers and not the Celtics?
[/quote]

The suggestion is the pressure is greater against the celts than the sixers.  YOu may make a 6 foot putt with me and miss it with Tiger in the foursome
[/quote]
Yeah, Tiger might spit on you! ;D

[CThoops]

[quote name="stevenash" post="966182" timestamp="1297740620"]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg966173#msg966173 date=1297740157]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965988#msg965988 date=1297717918]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg965968#msg965968 date=1297716302]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965910#msg965910 date=1297710193]
[quote author=FlexD33 link=topic=80209.msg965811#msg965811 date=1297696184]
Free throws win championships......if i remember right in 2010 when HJ made it to the state simi finals they went something like 16 for 30 or some where around those numbers from the free throw line. I still think to this day if they woudl have made atleast 5 more free throws they would have been playing for a state championship that year. IMO free throws are as easy as you want them to be, I've seen players just staright up panic when they get the free throw line. Then I've seen other players get up there like its nothing and sink the biggest two shots of the season....its all about muscle memory
[/quote]

I agree with everything you say.  However, sometimes, a fluke comes along.  Ask LeBron how he felt yesterday when he had two shots to tie the game with the Celtics in the last 10 seconds.  Sometimes the mental aspect influences the muscle memory.
[/quote]True, but I also heard the ESPN announcer quote some sick percentages from Lebron when the game is near the end and the score is close..... something like 90-95% during that time.

The only problem with the percentages is sometimes those "5-10%" chances actually happen.
[/quote]

This wasnt ANY game- it was the Celtics
[/quote]Ok..............

Are you allowed to miss a shot against the 76'ers and not the Celtics?
[/quote]

The suggestion is the pressure is greater against the celts than the sixers.  YOu may make a 6 foot putt with me and miss it with Tiger in the foursome
[/quote]

Dont think players are scared of Tiger anymore :D

[FanintheStands]

[quote name="stevenash" post="966182" timestamp="1297740620"]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg966173#msg966173 date=1297740157]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965988#msg965988 date=1297717918]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg965968#msg965968 date=1297716302]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965910#msg965910 date=1297710193]
[quote author=FlexD33 link=topic=80209.msg965811#msg965811 date=1297696184]
Free throws win championships......if i remember right in 2010 when HJ made it to the state simi finals they went something like 16 for 30 or some where around those numbers from the free throw line. I still think to this day if they woudl have made atleast 5 more free throws they would have been playing for a state championship that year. IMO free throws are as easy as you want them to be, I've seen players just staright up panic when they get the free throw line. Then I've seen other players get up there like its nothing and sink the biggest two shots of the season....its all about muscle memory
[/quote]

I agree with everything you say.  However, sometimes, a fluke comes along.  Ask LeBron how he felt yesterday when he had two shots to tie the game with the Celtics in the last 10 seconds.  Sometimes the mental aspect influences the muscle memory.
[/quote]True, but I also heard the ESPN announcer quote some sick percentages from Lebron when the game is near the end and the score is close..... something like 90-95% during that time.

The only problem with the percentages is sometimes those "5-10%" chances actually happen.
[/quote]

This wasnt ANY game- it was the Celtics
[/quote]Ok..............

Are you allowed to miss a shot against the 76'ers and not the Celtics?
[/quote]

The suggestion is the pressure is greater against the celts than the sixers.  YOu may make a 6 foot putt with me and miss it with Tiger in the foursome
[/quote]The response is that the 76'ers would not be in a close situation in the final seconds with the Heat.  I think the numbers the announcer gave was "[i]a 5 point or less game with less than a minute left[/i]".  BTW, who keeps those stats?!?!?

[whsalum]

[quote name="dogs1218" post="966188" timestamp="1297740945"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg966182#msg966182 date=1297740620]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg966173#msg966173 date=1297740157]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965988#msg965988 date=1297717918]
[quote author=FanintheStands link=topic=80209.msg965968#msg965968 date=1297716302]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg965910#msg965910 date=1297710193]
[quote author=FlexD33 link=topic=80209.msg965811#msg965811 date=1297696184]
Free throws win championships......if i remember right in 2010 when HJ made it to the state simi finals they went something like 16 for 30 or some where around those numbers from the free throw line. I still think to this day if they woudl have made atleast 5 more free throws they would have been playing for a state championship that year. IMO free throws are as easy as you want them to be, I've seen players just staright up panic when they get the free throw line. Then I've seen other players get up there like its nothing and sink the biggest two shots of the season....its all about muscle memory
[/quote]

I agree with everything you say.  However, sometimes, a fluke comes along.  Ask LeBron how he felt yesterday when he had two shots to tie the game with the Celtics in the last 10 seconds.  Sometimes the mental aspect influences the muscle memory.
[/quote]True, but I also heard the ESPN announcer quote some sick percentages from Lebron when the game is near the end and the score is close..... something like 90-95% during that time.

The only problem with the percentages is sometimes those "5-10%" chances actually happen.
[/quote]

This wasnt ANY game- it was the Celtics
[/quote]Ok..............

Are you allowed to miss a shot against the 76'ers and not the Celtics?
[/quote]

The suggestion is the pressure is greater against the celts than the sixers.  YOu may make a 6 foot putt with me and miss it with Tiger in the foursome
[/quote]

Dont think players are scared of Tiger anymore :D
[/quote]You lose the fear factor when your wife beats the sh$$ out of you with a golf club  ;D

[snooker]

ft shooting is about handling pressure  -- something most kids struggle with.  form is a close second -- but i think you can shoot granny shots effectively as long as you are confident. ... someone said 100 made a day --- thats key. now how much of practice do you sacrifice for that??  depends on how important you think they are

[baddog]

You can play great defense, hit your threes, have an inside game, get you rebounds.....etc. All game long. The fact is that most basketball games come down to the final minutes with one team being down by no more than 10 points. The team that is down will foul to force FTs. This is where games are won and lost. FTs are key.

[stevenash]

[quote name="baddog" post="966445" timestamp="1297794165"]
You can play great defense, hit your threes, have an inside game, get you rebounds.....etc. All game long. The fact is that most basketball games come down to the final minutes with one team being down by no more than 10 points. The team that is down will foul to force FTs. This is where games are won and lost. FTs are key.
[/quote]

I guess you are assuming that if a team misses the free throws that they were forced to take, that the other team converts each time?

[Pumper]

FT shooting is repetition and confidence.  You ever notice that some kids who get fouled (often point guards) seem that they can't wait to get to the line to shoot when they are fouled?  They know they are going to make them, and then they usually do.  Shooting 50 a day and charting them is good for kids.  Charting them makes the kid accountable and they will want to improve over time. 

I have helped a number of kids over the years on free throws.  It can be like a golf swing with too many things to think about.  The key is the release.  Do the same thing every time, eyes on the target, and follow through (not sort of follow through, but really follow through and hold your release).  If a kid will practice that way they will improve.  It just ain't that tough. 

Don't you think if a kid shoots 50 a day and charts them, then they will go to the line in a game with more confidence at crunch time?  It really is pretty simple if they are willing to do the work.  And it's better not to give them 50 things to think about (bend your knees, elbow in, deep breath, finish on your toes, don't fall back, etc, etc.).  All those things are good, but eyes on the target (focus) and the right release will take care of most of it, along with the repetition of doing it the same way EVERY time in practice and in a game.

Now, off my soap box....

[east texas bb]

The least amount of routine or mental approach to the FT will for most athletes be good for them.  You have some superior mental athletes that it really dosent matter what they do they are going to make them.  Keep the routine simple,  I have taught my son to approach it like Steve Nash,  he will visulize and go through the approach with out the ball, then when he is givin the ball he takes 3 dribbles, shoots, and holds the follow through until the ball hits the floor.  Alot of players will "pull the string" and not hold the release, you have to hold the release at leas until it is in the net.  I teach youth players who are trying to get their shots to hold the follow through until the ball bounces off the floor.  I call them "one bouncers", grooving your shot, or 2 second hold em.  It has seemed to work with the players who will listen.
I disagree with whoever was saying that basketball is all about FT's, they are a very important factor, but there are too many aspects to say FT's are the sole determining factor in a game.  Are they any more important than a missed defensive assignment and your players scores a layup?  It is just that FT are alot easier to stat than a missed defensive assignment.

[baddog]

[quote name="stevenash" post="966460" timestamp="1297795631"]
[quote author=baddog link=topic=80209.msg966445#msg966445 date=1297794165]
You can play great defense, hit your threes, have an inside game, get you rebounds.....etc. All game long. The fact is that most basketball games come down to the final minutes with one team being down by no more than 10 points. The team that is down will foul to force FTs. This is where games are won and lost. FTs are key.
[/quote]

I guess you are assuming that if a team misses the free throws that they were forced to take, that the other team converts each time?
[/quote]

Of course not. Why would you assume that? If you hit those FTs, you maintain your lead. Miss them, you give your opponent a chance to gain or overtake. No one converts everytime. Was that just for the sake of argument?

[stevenash]

[quote name="baddog" post="966523" timestamp="1297806970"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=80209.msg966460#msg966460 date=1297795631]
[quote author=baddog link=topic=80209.msg966445#msg966445 date=1297794165]
You can play great defense, hit your threes, have an inside game, get you rebounds.....etc. All game long. The fact is that most basketball games come down to the final minutes with one team being down by no more than 10 points. The team that is down will foul to force FTs. This is where games are won and lost. FTs are key.
[/quote]

I guess you are assuming that if a team misses the free throws that they were forced to take, that the other team converts each time?
[/quote]
Yes- devils advocate

Of course not. Why would you assume that? If you hit those FTs, you maintain your lead. Miss them, you give your opponent a chance to gain or overtake. No one converts everytime. Was that just for the sake of argument?
[/quote]

[whsalum]

[quote name="east texas bb" post="966471" timestamp="1297798284"]
The least amount of routine or mental approach to the FT will for most athletes be good for them.  You have some superior mental athletes that it really dosent matter what they do they are going to make them.  Keep the routine simple,  I have taught my son to approach it like Steve Nash,  he will visulize and go through the approach with out the ball, then when he is givin the ball he takes 3 dribbles, shoots, and holds the follow through until the ball hits the floor.  Alot of players will "pull the string" and not hold the release, you have to hold the release at leas until it is in the net.  I teach youth players who are trying to get their shots to hold the follow through until the ball bounces off the floor.  I call them "one bouncers", grooving your shot, or 2 second hold em.   It has seemed to work with the players who will listen.
I disagree with whoever was saying that basketball is all about FT's, they are a very important factor, but there are too many aspects to say FT's are the sole determining factor in a game.  Are they any more important than a missed defensive assignment and your players scores a layup?  It is just that FT are alot easier to stat than a missed defensive assignment.
[/quote] I have taught my son to approach it like Steve Nash,  he will visulize and go through the approach with out the ball, then when he is givin the ball he takes 3 dribbles, shoots, and holds the follow through until the ball hits the floor. 

Thta's the exact routine I used years ago to get my kids relaxed and shooting it right.Went thru the entire routine before they got the ball,then bounced the ball 3 times ,took a deep breat and shot the ball,broke the wrist and held it to the ball hit the floor.Worked to the tune of 82% over 3 years and 400 plus attempts.The key is practicing the exact routine over and over.

[east texas bb]

Exactly, simple but the mind will not get in the way of the muscle memory, and if you have practiced it enough you will step to the line and shoot it at a good percentages, but their are not many kids that will learn to shoot it right or put in the time.  If they will they can shoot it at a good percentages and even the ones they do miss go in and out or hit back iron .  I do the same with my son, the only time I will interfere with his shooting approach is if I see it goign to the left or right, that means the off hand is playing a role in the ball going forward, if it is just hitting back iron it is because you are usually not releasing it high enough and the shot is flat.  But you can correct that pretty easy, if I was hitting backiron or I see a kid shooting hitting backiron I can usually adjust my release or get them to adjust their release and they will start making them. 
Steve Nash IMO is the best shooter that has ever played, I posted an article on here on another thread where the stats backed it up.  But basically he is the only player to shoot 90 percent from FT line, 50 percent from the floor, and 40 percent from the 3 point line in 4 straight seasons and the only player to shoot it for his career.

[True Blue]

Goodrich game comes down to a FT to seal the game and the kid mised it and they lost. FTs win games It may not be the biggest part of the game but in a close game it most time is the winner or loser that eather makes it or misses it.

[east texas bb]

Here is that article on Nash:

Tuesday, October 5, 2010
BRIAN McCORMICK ON WHY EVERYONE SHOULD SHOOT LIKE STEVE NASH

I believe Steve Nash is the best shooter to play in the NBA, at least since the NBA incorporated the three-point line. While my belief is based primarily on observation, the numbers support the theory. John Hollinger, the creator of the player efficiency rankings, ranks Nash as the all-time #1 shooter based on a combined shooting range (CSR) which adds 2-point percentage, 3-pt % and FT%.


According to Hollinger’s rankings, four players are career 180 Shooters: Nash (184.9), Steve Kerr (181.2), Reggie Miller (180.7) and Mark Price(180.7). Also, Steve Nash and Larry Bird are the only players to finish multiple seasons in the even more difficult 90-50-40 club (90% FT, 50% 2-pt FG% and 40% 3-pt FG%). Bird accomplished the feat twice, while Nash has accomplished the feat four times ('06, '08, '09, and '10). Based on the numbers, I do not see much room to argue for anyone else.

If we agree that Nash is the best shooter of all time, why don’t more players emulate him?

Last season during the play-offs, several NBA bloggers tweeted that players who mimic a shot before shooting a free throw shot a higher percentage than those who did not. This was anecdotal and observational, and not a real study, but science supports the claim.