Lumberton Girls Coach

[deep east texas]

Heard Wolf was leaving...who gets the job...I am hoping Charlie Wilson will come out of retirement.

[Riding Solo]

[quote name="deep east texas" post="965966" timestamp="1297716185"]
Heard Wolf was leaving...who gets the job...I am hoping Charlie Wilson will come out of retirement.
[/quote]

I liked Charlie but don't think he will come out of retirement.

[whsalum]

The young guy over at Deweyville is a hometown boy who might be a good fit.He did a pretty good job with a young club this year and worked for several years on a very good Hardin staff.Sometimes these young coaches do a really good job when they come back to their alma matta.

[snooker]

josh would do great

[Slam14]

Wow!  That didn't take long to get that rope over the branch.

[The Cook]

[quote name="Slam14" post="966332" timestamp="1297783534"]

Wow!  That didn't take long to get that rope over the branch.
[/quote]
That broke the land speed record.

[Loudmouth]

where is Gholson going and how did this even get started?

[fiveoclocksomewhere]

Charlie Wilson has been coaching a girls BB team in Louisiana. ( Comuting from Lumberton.) If the position were to open, I think he would be open to return. Beats driving an hour one way to work!  He still has a good relationship with LISD.

Last time I spoke to him, Gholson says he will be here next year.  Like other districts, Lumberton will be cutting salary as much as possible.  Who knows what can happen when the cutting starts. 2012 contracts are approved in March, I think.

Loudmouth asked-"Where did this start?"  There have been complaints to the school board about the number of varsity players that have quit the program in the past 9 months.(5 players) In fact one player that quit is the daughter of a school board member. There were some heated words exchanged. The players that left the program all cited pretty much the same reason for quitting. They did not like the way the coach treated them.

My take, as a parent has been to tell my daughter to toughen up, listen for the message being said. NOT the WAY it is being said. ( And I admit that I may be wrong. )

Gholson knows his basketball, practices the players hard. Which is good. But there is most certainly a problem with the way the kids are being treated. You don't have to embarrass a player to get 100% out of them.  I believe that players play harder for a coach that they respect and like. That respect is a two way street. Players these days don't take well to the Bobby Knight treatment. They will say "screw this" and quit.

Does this sort of thing even come up at Orangefield or Hardin Jeff, or Barbers Hill?  Seems like the players actually LIKE their coaches at the more successful programs. 

However it shakes out, Lumberton needs it's best players on the team.  Can a coach change?

[BH85]

[quote name="fiveoclocksomewhere" post="967144" timestamp="1297876795"]
[b]Does this sort of thing even come up at Orangefield or Hardin Jeff, or Barbers Hill?[/b]  Seems like the players actually LIKE their coaches at the more successful programs. 
[/quote]

Yes it comes up at Barbers Hill and at many programs, whether they are successful or not.

[Slam14]

[quote name="fiveoclocksomewhere" post="967144" timestamp="1297876795"]
Charlie Wilson has been coaching a girls BB team in Louisiana. ( Comuting from Lumberton.) If the position were to open, I think he would be open to return. Beats driving an hour one way to work!  He still has a good relationship with LISD.

Last time I spoke to him, Gholson says he will be here next year.  Like other districts, Lumberton will be cutting salary as much as possible.  Who knows what can happen when the cutting starts. 2012 contracts are approved in March, I think.

Loudmouth asked-"Where did this start?"   There have been complaints to the school board about the number of varsity players that have quit the program in the past 9 months.(5 players) In fact one player that quit is the daughter of a school board member. There were some heated words exchanged. The players that left the program all cited pretty much the same reason for quitting. They did not like the way the coach treated them.

My take, as a parent has been to tell my daughter to toughen up, listen for the message being said. NOT the WAY it is being said. ( And I admit that I may be wrong. )

Gholson knows his basketball, practices the players hard. Which is good. But there is most certainly a problem with the way the kids are being treated. You don't have to embarrass a player to get 100% out of them.  I believe that players play harder for a coach that they respect and like. That respect is a two way street. Players these days don't take well to the Bobby Knight treatment. They will say "screw this" and quit.

Does this sort of thing even come up at Orangefield or Hardin Jeff, or Barbers Hill?  Seems like the players actually LIKE their coaches at the more successful programs. 

However it shakes out, Lumberton needs it's best players on the team.  Can a coach change?
[/quote]

I'm an outsider looking in so I don't know the "specifics" that you may know, but I just don't see those things in the coach.  I have never seen him embarrass a player while coaching against us.  I do know of one big instance this season when he came to the defense of his team when he thought SOMEONE ELSE was trying to embarrass his girls.

I agree that players play harder for coaches they respect, but I just don't see outward signs that the coach doesn't respect his girls.  I started this whole post by stating that I don't REALLY know the inside details, but I don't see the world changing with a different coach that "everybody likes".

The dog should still wag the tail...not the tail wag the dog.

[fiveoclocksomewhere]

Good comments, Slam14. 

I have not seen anything at a game either.  I guess my point is five varsity players all leaving the program over something that does not involve basketball bothers me.  None quit over lack of playing time. 2 were starters.
Very few coaches will be liked by everyone. I understand that. But how can a program build when the best players keep leaving?

And yes, there are incidents of embarrassing kids at practice and halftimes that have caused the ruckus. I won't post the details, only to say if the comments were made to your 15/16 year old daughter, you would be pissed.

I just think it is dumb to run off your best players. 

[deep east texas]

[quote name="fiveoclocksomewhere" post="967238" timestamp="1297885741"]
Good comments, Slam14.   

I have not seen anything at a game either.  I guess my point is five varsity players all leaving the program over something that does not involve basketball bothers me.  None quit over lack of playing time. 2 were starters.
Very few coaches will be liked by everyone. I understand that. But how can a program build when the best players keep leaving?

And yes, there are incidents of embarrassing kids at practice and halftimes that have caused the ruckus. I won't post the details, only to say if the comments were made to your 15/16 year old daughter, you would be pissed.

I just think it is dumb to run off your best players. 
[/quote] 
I agree that  we do need a different coach that can coach up our girls.

[Team Game]

The issues with the coach did not just come up. Things have been going on for the past couple of years. Some of the same issues I see on here were also going on in PE at intermediate when he was there. Oh to have POWER!

[Slam14]

[quote name="fiveoclocksomewhere" post="967238" timestamp="1297885741"]
Good comments, Slam14.  

I have not seen anything at a game either.  I guess my point is five varsity players all leaving the program over something that does not involve basketball bothers me.  None quit over lack of playing time. 2 were starters.
Very few coaches will be liked by everyone. I understand that. But how can a program build when the best players keep leaving?

And yes, there are incidents of embarrassing kids at practice and halftimes that have caused the ruckus. I won't post the details, only to say if the comments were made to your 15/16 year old daughter, you would be pissed.

I just think it is dumb to run off your best players.  
[/quote]

fiveoclocksomewhere,
 You make good points in your posts and always seem to be pretty level-headed where some people post wild rants. Thats why I'm interested in seeing what's going on here.  I really do understand your concern, and everybody just wants the best for their daughters.  (If I'm not mistaken I think you have reason to be "double" concerned  ;D)  
 I agree with other posters in the fact that I think it is much wiser to "coach girls up" than to tear them down, but sometimes individuals respond to different approaches.  (I am not implying you should embarrass or be-little anyone.)

I thought our coach was as tough on my daughter as she was on any player in our system.  Tough, demanding, but not out of line.  I accepted that (and my daughter accepted that) because I thought my daughter had the talent and ability to be pushed.  [b]"From those who are given much...much is expected."  [/b]  

 I guess I ought to stay out of this because I really don't know and see what you see.  But what I do know is that there are a lot of variables in these type of situations, so make sure you identify all those variables before you pin all of the problems on just one of the pieces to the puzzle.

Hope things go well for you and your daughters.

[Riding Solo]

[quote name="fiveoclocksomewhere" post="967144" timestamp="1297876795"]
Charlie Wilson has been coaching a girls BB team in Louisiana. ( Comuting from Lumberton.) If the position were to open, I think he would be open to return. Beats driving an hour one way to work!  He still has a good relationship with LISD.

Last time I spoke to him, Gholson says he will be here next year.  Like other districts, Lumberton will be cutting salary as much as possible.  Who knows what can happen when the cutting starts. 2012 contracts are approved in March, I think.

Loudmouth asked-"Where did this start?"   There have been complaints to the school board about the number of varsity players that have quit the program in the past 9 months.(5 players) In fact one player that quit is the daughter of a school board member. There were some heated words exchanged. The players that left the program all cited pretty much the same reason for quitting. They did not like the way the coach treated them.

My take, as a parent has been to tell my daughter to toughen up, listen for the message being said. NOT the WAY it is being said. ( And I admit that I may be wrong. )

Gholson knows his basketball, practices the players hard. Which is good. But there is most certainly a problem with the way the kids are being treated. You don't have to embarrass a player to get 100% out of them.  I believe that players play harder for a coach that they respect and like. That respect is a two way street. Players these days don't take well to the Bobby Knight treatment. They will say "screw this" and quit.

Does this sort of thing even come up at Orangefield or Hardin Jeff, or Barbers Hill?  Seems like the players actually LIKE their coaches at the more successful programs. 

However it shakes out, Lumberton needs it's best players on the team.  Can a coach change?
[/quote]

Yes, it does go on in the successful programs. IMO here is the deal. If a kid loves the game enough NO coach can make them quit. If a kid quits then they were going to quit anyway. Sorry but their loss. The problem is, parents discuss their displeasures with a coach infront of their kids. Therefore the kids turns on the coach.  Most of the kids today would quit if they had to play for a coach 30 years ago. I really enjoy listening to basketball game on the radio. That way I don't hear all the negativity from the stands. Some parents not all have lost complete control. This is not directed at any of you. Your post are good and asking fair questions. Just don't think it is all the coaches fault. Apparently the ones that quit did not love the game enough. Peace!!!!

[Riding Solo]

Let me ask you guys a question. My son was a senior and he was a starter. He was not the leading scorer and really rarely shot. He did all the little things like pass the rock, steals and rebounded. He shot a ball against WOS and missed. The coach immediatly took him out and chewed him out. I was right there listening and the coach said "That is not your role, Do not shoot the ball" my son was pissed and so was I. But my son understood and so did I. I did not discuss it with my son or the coach. That year Orangefield went to the playoff's for the first time in 56 years and they set the record for most wins in a season. The young men on that team were very unselfish and knew their roles on the "TEAM". Thats why they won. My question is, how would you have reacted if a coach told your child that?

[Riding Solo]

Sorry but I am not done yet. I am on a role. LOL!!!!!!The biggest compliment my daughter's coach in high school gave her was not how many points she scored, steals, assist or rebounds in a game. She said and I quote, " she is a self made player". What that means is, she worked just as hard in PRACTICE as she did in the games. That is the key to getting better. She got better every year. End of story. ;D ;D Young people don't listen to Allen Iverson "Practice, we talking about Practice".

[Slam14]

[quote name="Riding Solo" post="967420" timestamp="1297906108"]
[quote author=fiveoclocksomewhere link=topic=80253.msg967144#msg967144 date=1297876795]
Charlie Wilson has been coaching a girls BB team in Louisiana. ( Comuting from Lumberton.) If the position were to open, I think he would be open to return. Beats driving an hour one way to work!  He still has a good relationship with LISD.

Last time I spoke to him, Gholson says he will be here next year.  Like other districts, Lumberton will be cutting salary as much as possible.  Who knows what can happen when the cutting starts. 2012 contracts are approved in March, I think.

Loudmouth asked-"Where did this start?"   There have been complaints to the school board about the number of varsity players that have quit the program in the past 9 months.(5 players) In fact one player that quit is the daughter of a school board member. There were some heated words exchanged. The players that left the program all cited pretty much the same reason for quitting. They did not like the way the coach treated them.

My take, as a parent has been to tell my daughter to toughen up, listen for the message being said. NOT the WAY it is being said. ( And I admit that I may be wrong. )

Gholson knows his basketball, practices the players hard. Which is good. But there is most certainly a problem with the way the kids are being treated. You don't have to embarrass a player to get 100% out of them.  I believe that players play harder for a coach that they respect and like. That respect is a two way street. Players these days don't take well to the Bobby Knight treatment. They will say "screw this" and quit.

Does this sort of thing even come up at Orangefield or Hardin Jeff, or Barbers Hill?  Seems like the players actually LIKE their coaches at the more successful programs. 

However it shakes out, Lumberton needs it's best players on the team.  Can a coach change?
[/quote]

Yes, it does go on in the successful programs. IMO here is the deal. If a kid loves the game enough NO coach can make them quit. If a kid quits then they were going to quit anyway. Sorry but their loss. The problem is, parents discuss their displeasures with a coach infront of their kids. Therefore the kids turns on the coach.  Most of the kids today would quit if they had to play for a coach 30 years ago. I really enjoy listening to basketball game on the radio. That way I don't hear all the negativity from the stands. Some parents not all have lost complete control. This is not directed at any of you. Your post are good and asking fair questions. Just don't think it is all the coaches fault. Apparently the ones that quit did not love the game enough. Peace!!!!
[/quote]

OK, lock the thread!  Riding Solo laid all the cards on the table and didn't pull any punches!  Sometimes you have to just cut straight to the chase!

[Riding Solo]

[quote name="Slam14" post="967519" timestamp="1297912931"]
[quote author=Riding Solo link=topic=80253.msg967420#msg967420 date=1297906108]
[quote author=fiveoclocksomewhere link=topic=80253.msg967144#msg967144 date=1297876795]
Charlie Wilson has been coaching a girls BB team in Louisiana. ( Comuting from Lumberton.) If the position were to open, I think he would be open to return. Beats driving an hour one way to work!  He still has a good relationship with LISD.

Last time I spoke to him, Gholson says he will be here next year.  Like other districts, Lumberton will be cutting salary as much as possible.  Who knows what can happen when the cutting starts. 2012 contracts are approved in March, I think.

Loudmouth asked-"Where did this start?"   There have been complaints to the school board about the number of varsity players that have quit the program in the past 9 months.(5 players) In fact one player that quit is the daughter of a school board member. There were some heated words exchanged. The players that left the program all cited pretty much the same reason for quitting. They did not like the way the coach treated them.

My take, as a parent has been to tell my daughter to toughen up, listen for the message being said. NOT the WAY it is being said. ( And I admit that I may be wrong. )

Gholson knows his basketball, practices the players hard. Which is good. But there is most certainly a problem with the way the kids are being treated. You don't have to embarrass a player to get 100% out of them.  I believe that players play harder for a coach that they respect and like. That respect is a two way street. Players these days don't take well to the Bobby Knight treatment. They will say "screw this" and quit.

Does this sort of thing even come up at Orangefield or Hardin Jeff, or Barbers Hill?  Seems like the players actually LIKE their coaches at the more successful programs. 

However it shakes out, Lumberton needs it's best players on the team.  Can a coach change?
[/quote]

Yes, it does go on in the successful programs. IMO here is the deal. If a kid loves the game enough NO coach can make them quit. If a kid quits then they were going to quit anyway. Sorry but their loss. The problem is, parents discuss their displeasures with a coach infront of their kids. Therefore the kids turns on the coach.  Most of the kids today would quit if they had to play for a coach 30 years ago. I really enjoy listening to basketball game on the radio. That way I don't hear all the negativity from the stands. Some parents not all have lost complete control. This is not directed at any of you. Your post are good and asking fair questions. Just don't think it is all the coaches fault. Apparently the ones that quit did not love the game enough. Peace!!!!
[/quote]

OK, lock the thread!  Riding Solo laid all the cards on the table and didn't pull any punches!   Sometimes you have to just cut straight to the chase!
[/quote]

That is the best post I have ever read. LOL!!! good job Slam.

[Slam14]

[quote name="Riding Solo" post="967523" timestamp="1297913337"]
[quote author=Slam14 link=topic=80253.msg967519#msg967519 date=1297912931]
[quote author=Riding Solo link=topic=80253.msg967420#msg967420 date=1297906108]
[quote author=fiveoclocksomewhere link=topic=80253.msg967144#msg967144 date=1297876795]
Charlie Wilson has been coaching a girls BB team in Louisiana. ( Comuting from Lumberton.) If the position were to open, I think he would be open to return. Beats driving an hour one way to work!  He still has a good relationship with LISD.

Last time I spoke to him, Gholson says he will be here next year.  Like other districts, Lumberton will be cutting salary as much as possible.  Who knows what can happen when the cutting starts. 2012 contracts are approved in March, I think.

Loudmouth asked-"Where did this start?"   There have been complaints to the school board about the number of varsity players that have quit the program in the past 9 months.(5 players) In fact one player that quit is the daughter of a school board member. There were some heated words exchanged. The players that left the program all cited pretty much the same reason for quitting. They did not like the way the coach treated them.

My take, as a parent has been to tell my daughter to toughen up, listen for the message being said. NOT the WAY it is being said. ( And I admit that I may be wrong. )

Gholson knows his basketball, practices the players hard. Which is good. But there is most certainly a problem with the way the kids are being treated. You don't have to embarrass a player to get 100% out of them.  I believe that players play harder for a coach that they respect and like. That respect is a two way street. Players these days don't take well to the Bobby Knight treatment. They will say "screw this" and quit.

Does this sort of thing even come up at Orangefield or Hardin Jeff, or Barbers Hill?  Seems like the players actually LIKE their coaches at the more successful programs. 

However it shakes out, Lumberton needs it's best players on the team.  Can a coach change?
[/quote]

Yes, it does go on in the successful programs. IMO here is the deal. If a kid loves the game enough NO coach can make them quit. If a kid quits then they were going to quit anyway. Sorry but their loss. The problem is, parents discuss their displeasures with a coach infront of their kids. Therefore the kids turns on the coach.  Most of the kids today would quit if they had to play for a coach 30 years ago. I really enjoy listening to basketball game on the radio. That way I don't hear all the negativity from the stands. Some parents not all have lost complete control. This is not directed at any of you. Your post are good and asking fair questions. Just don't think it is all the coaches fault. Apparently the ones that quit did not love the game enough. Peace!!!!
[/quote]

OK, lock the thread!  Riding Solo laid all the cards on the table and didn't pull any punches!   Sometimes you have to just cut straight to the chase!
[/quote]

That is the best post I have ever read. LOL!!! good job Slam.
[/quote]

;) ;D

[Slam14]

[quote name="Slam14" post="967375" timestamp="1297899192"]
[quote author=fiveoclocksomewhere link=topic=80253.msg967238#msg967238 date=1297885741]
Good comments, Slam14.  

I have not seen anything at a game either.  I guess my point is five varsity players all leaving the program over something that does not involve basketball bothers me.  None quit over lack of playing time. 2 were starters.
Very few coaches will be liked by everyone. I understand that. But how can a program build when the best players keep leaving?

And yes, there are incidents of embarrassing kids at practice and halftimes that have caused the ruckus. I won't post the details, only to say if the comments were made to your 15/16 year old daughter, you would be pissed.

I just think it is dumb to run off your best players.  
[/quote]

fiveoclocksomewhere,
 You make good points in your posts and always seem to be pretty level-headed where some people post wild rants. Thats why I'm interested in seeing what's going on here.  I really do understand your concern, and everybody just wants the best for their daughters.  (If I'm not mistaken I think you have reason to be "double" concerned  ;D)  
 I agree with other posters in the fact that I think it is much wiser to "coach girls up" than to tear them down, but sometimes individuals respond to different approaches.  (I am not implying you should embarrass or be-little anyone.)

I thought our coach was as tough on my daughter as she was on any player in our system.  Tough, demanding, but not out of line.  I accepted that (and my daughter accepted that) because I thought my daughter had the talent and ability to be pushed.  [b]"From those who are given much...much is expected."  [/b]  

 I guess I ought to stay out of this because I really don't know and see what you see.  But what I do know is that there are a lot of variables in these type of situations, so make sure you identify all those variables before you pin all of the problems on just one of the pieces to the puzzle.

Hope things go well for you and your daughters.
[/quote]

Apologizes to fiveoclocksomewhere...I just realized that I think it's "LR2014" who has twin daughters at Lumberton.  Sorry for my mistake.

[Bobcat1]

[quote name="Riding Solo" post="967436" timestamp="1297907492"]
Let me ask you guys a question. My son was a senior and he was a starter. He was not the leading scorer and really rarely shot. He did all the little things like pass the rock, steals and rebounded. He shot a ball against WOS and missed. The coach immediatly took him out and chewed him out. I was right there listening and the coach said "That is not your role, Do not shoot the ball" my son was pissed and so was I. But my son understood and so did I. I did not discuss it with my son or the coach. That year Orangefield went to the playoff's for the first time in 56 years and they set the record for most wins in a season. The young men on that team were very unselfish and knew their roles on the "TEAM". Thats why they won. My question is, how would you have reacted if a coach told your child that?
[/quote]

I think I remember that, because we all got the role speech at practice that SATURDAY because of that.  >:(

[Bobcat1]

I agree with Riding Solo about talking about the coach in front of their kids, if they love the game, they wouldn't only be playing when it's basketball season, shoot at home and try to get on a travel team to play more. Some coaches may not be the best, but they are far from the worst you could have! 

[fiveoclocksomewhere]

Slam14- You are mistaking me for for my good buddy with twin freshmen daughters.  ;D Thats a compliment. My daughter is a little older. Has played for Coach Gholson for two years.

Solo and Slam-Thanks for the comments and good advice.  I agree with you both for the most part. You can't let a coach run you off. That's why I told my daughter to suck it up. She loves playing basketball. I have no doubt in that. But I also doubt she will play next season for this coach. She will play the sports that she gets the most enjoyment from. She will make up her mind this Summer. Fortunately she is able to play pretty much any sport and do reasonably well. But I love watching her play BBall.

At what point does "tough coach" turn into "verbally abusive a-hole"? Very few of these kids have aspirations to play beyond high school. Why should they be subjected to being told every single day how bad they suck? I understand being tough. But why be mean-spirited also?

And yes Solo, there have been some parents that get overly involved and it transfers to the daughter/player. I have done my best to keep out of it. When my daughter has had a problem she has met with the coach on her own, without parents involved.  I was pretty proud of her for that actually.
Thanks again for the comments and advice.

[fiveoclocksomewhere]

I also would like to say that we can all post here and gripe and complain. Thats what these boards are for. But we need to be careful in calling for someone to be fired. You are talking about someones job. Putting groceries on the table is serious business.
Be certain before you complain to a school board or AD about what you feel is a problem with a coach.

Thats why sometimes I like to come on here and cuss and discuss with other parents, coaches, etc before I make up my mind about things.  There are some nuts, but there are some smart old hands on here too.

Ideally here at L-Town, it would be great if our coach could recognize the problem. Maybe a heart to heart with his AD and make an effort to improve his temper.  There have been discusions with him about it. But I do not believe he sees it as a problem. Which is a shame. Because like I said, they guy knows his X's and O's.

The question is will there be any players left to coach?