Pitch count for High School

[TEL]

What are your thoughts on High School kids throwing 100 pitches or more in a game? I was basically told I was ignorant for speaking up about this. Anyone in 19-4A remember what happened to Smesney from Dayton when he got to Angelina after throwing 100+ on several outings? Why take a chance with a kids future? Should parents not be able to speak up about the welfare of their children or others?

[CatFan81]

Not sure, but I believe MLB keeps up with the pitch count.

[TEL]

[quote name="CatFan81" post="990334" timestamp="1301463843"]
Not sure, but I believe MLB keeps up with the pitch count.
[/quote]
All levels keep a pitch count, what's your point?

[TeamJagUS]

[quote name="TEL" post="990332" timestamp="1301463687"]
What are your thoughts on High School kids throwing 100 pitches or more in a game? I was basically told I was ignorant for speaking up about this. Anyone in 19-4A remember what happened to Smesney from Dayton when he got to Angelina after throwing 100+ on several outings? Why take a chance with a kids future? [b]Should parents not be able to speak up about the welfare of their children or others?[/b]
[/quote]

not if they're hurtin'...

[YOUKNOWIT11]

Kids feel pressure to perform and coaches feel pressure to win. Not a good combination when a kid's arm needs to rest.

[Guest charliebrown]

I totally agree!!! Pitch count is a must and I believe it's the coaches responsibility to make sure a pitcher doesn't throw over a certain amount of pitches this is just a game the kid's health is more important especially if he's capable of playing at the next level.

[whattheheck]

Smesny injury was ue to poor mechanics not pitch count.

[astrofan]

The pitch count should be definitely reinforced to some degree! Some of the kids are pitching high counts repeatedly.  If they are having a good game that just contributes to the possibility of them being used more and more to the limit.

[2throwrundown]

Pitch count can be the most decieving stats in the game.  Its not the grand total number of pitches thrown in a game but more the total thrown in each inning.  What is worse a pitcher throwing 105 pitches in 7 complete innings or setting a pitch count of 70 and them reaching that after 3 innings?  Even at that its all relative to the individual athlete and their conditioning level.  If a kid is on the mound laboring and works a couple high pitch innings he is much more suseptable to injury than a pitcher who throws innings in under 20 pitches.

[SKINS]

If the so said pitcher has good mechanics and is pitching well he shouldn't come out if he doesn't want to. When things are going good don't stop him. On the other hand you can usually tell when a pitcher is used up. I once saw a pitching on the mound who was doubled over because of his arm in the 7th, yet the coach left him in because he was all they had.

[Ty Cobb]

In my opinion a pitch count is nothing more than a guide to go by.  What is right for some, may not be right for all.  It all depends on the player.  Some player's are in better shape (pitching shape) than others. 

[BigTuna]

Throw the ball over the plate and you dont have to worry about pitch count. if they hit, they hit it, and the coach will pull him before it gets too high anyway.  Pitchers that go 3-2 on a lot of hitters and walk a ton are the ones that normally have arm trouble.

[BaseballWarrior]

[quote name="Ty Cobb" post="990403" timestamp="1301491205"]
In my opinion a pitch count is nothing more than a guide to go by.  What is right for some, may not be right for all.  It all depends on the player.  Some player's are in better shape (pitching shape) than others. 
[/quote]

agreed... I don't believe in a definitive number, pitch count is relative. Once their mechanics start to falter, or they begin "overthrowing" to compensate for tiredness, time to come out. To be honest, no matter the pitch count, if the pitcher is maintaining proper mechanics and not really showing signs of fatigue, no reason to pull him.  A good coach learns their pitchers, knows their mechanics, and understands when a pitcher is nearing their limit.

However, overusing a pitcher is a completely different story. If a pitcher goes out and starts for 4-7 hard innings, he should not start, and possibly not relieve on Friday(circumstantial-relief). You have to give their arm sufficient time to rest.

[falcolnfanatic]

The pitch count is one of the most useless things is baseball. As long as a pitcher does not get tired and keeps the right mechanics he can throw 200 pitches and be fine. The injuries come from other things like not giving a pitcher proper rest. If a pitcher starts a game then he should not go out and play shortstop the next day. He should not even pick up a baseball the next day. Also if a pitcher throws 100 and 80 of them are curveballs or Sliders then that kid is going to have arm problems as well.

[EAGLE07]

[quote name="whattheheck" post="990383" timestamp="1301488950"]
Smesny injury was ue to poor mechanics not pitch count.
[/quote]

It was both....
You can throw Andy Dewey's name in there also.

[EAGLE07]

[quote name="BaseballWarrior" post="990431" timestamp="1301494171"]
[quote author=Ty Cobb link=topic=82460.msg990403#msg990403 date=1301491205]
In my opinion a pitch count is nothing more than a guide to go by.  What is right for some, may not be right for all.  It all depends on the player.  Some player's are in better shape (pitching shape) than others. 
[/quote]

agreed... I don't believe in a definitive number, pitch count is relative. Once their mechanics start to falter, or they begin "overthrowing" to compensate for tiredness, time to come out. To be honest, no matter the pitch count, if the pitcher is maintaining proper mechanics and not really showing signs of fatigue, no reason to pull him.  A good coach learns their pitchers, knows their mechanics, and understands when a pitcher is nearing their limit.

However, overusing a pitcher is a completely different story. If a pitcher goes out and starts for 4-7 hard innings, he should not start, and possibly not relieve on Friday(circumstantial-relief). You have to give their arm sufficient time to rest.
[/quote]


Well said Warrior.....

[JS]

While I don't care to elaborate as to what caused Smesny's injury I will give an update since his name has been mentioned. Frank has been medically released and is about 85% finished with
rehab. He is throwing on the mound again, progressing rapidly, and will pitch with Kyle Chapman this summer and see where it goes.

[EAGLE07]

[quote name="Diamond-J" post="990728" timestamp="1301515691"]
While I don't care to elaborate as to what caused Smesny's injury I will give an update since his name has been mentioned. Frank has been medically released and is about 85% finished with
rehab. He is throwing on the mound again, progressing rapidly, and will pitch with Kyle Chapman this summer and see where it goes.

[/quote]

Your ears burnin'  ;D ;D
Glad to hear Frank is throwing again.
Try to give you a call later this afternoon. 

[TEL]

[quote name="EAGLE07" post="990503" timestamp="1301499789"]
[quote author=whattheheck link=topic=82460.msg990383#msg990383 date=1301488950]
Smesny injury was ue to poor mechanics not pitch count.
[/quote]

It was both....
You can throw Andy Dewey's name in there also.
[/quote]
I agree EAGLE07, I think we had this discussion before. I also agree with what someone said earlier, you have to take care of your pitchers arm, ice, stay in shape, etc.. but I will still say that High School kids shouldn't be throwing 100 + pitches no matter what. Also, I know their are alot of good coaches out there but don't leave it up to them to take care of your kid.

[TEL]

[quote name="Diamond-J" post="990728" timestamp="1301515691"]
While I don't care to elaborate as to what caused Smesny's injury I will give an update since his name has been mentioned. Frank has been medically released and is about 85% finished with
rehab. He is throwing on the mound again, progressing rapidly, and will pitch with Kyle Chapman this summer and see where it goes.

[/quote]
Glad to hear it!!

[BaseballWarrior]

[quote name="TEL" post="990805" timestamp="1301529445"]
[quote author=EAGLE07 link=topic=82460.msg990503#msg990503 date=1301499789]
[quote author=whattheheck link=topic=82460.msg990383#msg990383 date=1301488950]
Smesny injury was ue to poor mechanics not pitch count.
[/quote]

It was both....
You can throw Andy Dewey's name in there also.
[/quote]
I agree EAGLE07, I think we had this discussion before. I also agree with what someone said earlier, you have to take care of your pitchers arm, ice, stay in shape, etc.. but I will still say that High School kids shouldn't be throwing 100 + pitches no matter what. Also, I know their are alot of good coaches out there but don't leave it up to them to take care of your kid.
[/quote]

Really? So parents... Go keep a pitch count and take your child off the field when they get to 100 pitches. How about trust the coach or take your kid off the team.

[Ricefan]

Keep in mind game warm up , pitches between innings , what does pitcher do between innings , most coaches know their pitchers of what they can and cant do ... pitchers need consistency ... fortunate where we play. Hope its the same for you !

[juskillenit89]

[quote name="BaseballWarrior" post="990823" timestamp="1301533498"]
[quote author=TEL link=topic=82460.msg990805#msg990805 date=1301529445]
[quote author=EAGLE07 link=topic=82460.msg990503#msg990503 date=1301499789]
[quote author=whattheheck link=topic=82460.msg990383#msg990383 date=1301488950]
Smesny injury was ue to poor mechanics not pitch count.
[/quote]

It was both....
You can throw Andy Dewey's name in there also.
[/quote]
I agree EAGLE07, I think we had this discussion before. I also agree with what someone said earlier, you have to take care of your pitchers arm, ice, stay in shape, etc.. but I will still say that High School kids shouldn't be throwing 100 + pitches no matter what. Also, I know their are alot of good coaches out there but don't leave it up to them to take care of your kid.
[/quote]

So parents... Go keep pitch count and take your child off the field when they get to 100 pitches
[/quote]
I think the point is even though you arent the coach your son should be important enough to speak with the coach when his health or risk of injury becomes more likely.  If the state of your childs health or well being becomes second to the game then that is a shame.

100 pitches can certainly be concern when you have poor mechanics, a recent tender arm, temperatures make a considerable drop or if throwing high percentage of breaking pitches.

[TEL]

[quote name="BaseballWarrior" post="990823" timestamp="1301533498"]
[quote author=TEL link=topic=82460.msg990805#msg990805 date=1301529445]
[quote author=EAGLE07 link=topic=82460.msg990503#msg990503 date=1301499789]
[quote author=whattheheck link=topic=82460.msg990383#msg990383 date=1301488950]
Smesny injury was ue to poor mechanics not pitch count.
[/quote]

It was both....
You can throw Andy Dewey's name in there also.
[/quote]
I agree EAGLE07, I think we had this discussion before. I also agree with what someone said earlier, you have to take care of your pitchers arm, ice, stay in shape, etc.. but I will still say that High School kids shouldn't be throwing 100 + pitches no matter what. Also, I know their are alot of good coaches out there but don't leave it up to them to take care of your kid.
[/quote]

Really? So parents... Go keep a pitch count and take your child off the field when they get to 100 pitches. How about trust the coach or take your kid off the team.


[/quote]
Not my point, but since you wanna go down that road. I'm saying don't just leave it up to the coach or his staff to care for your son's future. Parents need to take on that responsibility as well. The coach isn't with him 24/7. It's not even my kid, I don't have a dog in the fight. So your saying trust the coach no matter what? WOW! Do you have him over every night for dinner and to tuck your kids in also? :-* :-*

[SportsN3rd]

[quote name="TEL" post="990837" timestamp="1301535426"]
[quote author=BaseballWarrior link=topic=82460.msg990823#msg990823 date=1301533498]
[quote author=TEL link=topic=82460.msg990805#msg990805 date=1301529445]
[quote author=EAGLE07 link=topic=82460.msg990503#msg990503 date=1301499789]
[quote author=whattheheck link=topic=82460.msg990383#msg990383 date=1301488950]
Smesny injury was ue to poor mechanics not pitch count.
[/quote]

It was both....
You can throw Andy Dewey's name in there also.
[/quote]
I agree EAGLE07, I think we had this discussion before. I also agree with what someone said earlier, you have to take care of your pitchers arm, ice, stay in shape, etc.. but I will still say that High School kids shouldn't be throwing 100 + pitches no matter what. Also, I know their are alot of good coaches out there but don't leave it up to them to take care of your kid.
[/quote]

Really? So parents... Go keep a pitch count and take your child off the field when they get to 100 pitches. How about trust the coach or take your kid off the team.


[/quote]
Not my point, but since you wanna go down that road. I'm saying don't just leave it up to the coach or his staff to care for your son's future. Parents need to take on that responsibility as well. The coach isn't with
him 24/7. It's not even my kid, I don't have a dog in the fight. So your saying trust the coach no matter what? WOW! Do you have him over every night for dinner and to tuck your kids in also? :-* :-*
[/quote]

I totally agree with TEL. Some coaches only care about the W and will keep a kid out there even if it reaches over 125 which I have seen happen twice this season.