Beginning game prayer - GREAT JOB VIDOR

[CanineDog]

Was at the Vidor game last Thursday and a young lady from Vidor gave an outstanding prayer over the loudspeaker before the game.  I sure do miss ánd wish God was more a part of our sports like he once was.  Why doesnt Nederland or any other team do this anymore???  It sure was nice hearing that prayer before the game .  Kudos to Vidor. [b][/b]

[ndn mom]

I agree 100%! Several of us sent letters to the PNG administration last year asking them to pray before the games but I am sure those letters were put in file 13!

[Eagle11]

It is good to see some schools still do it. I believe BH had a prayer before the Ozen game......not that it helped..... ;).

I was living in the West Hardin School district when this debate surfaced statewide. A couple of people got in contact with Jay Seculow, a lawyer that has defended prayer rights in school, and he said it just could not be driven by a school employee. It had to be student initiated and student led. It was much easier in a small town than it is in bigger places, less threat of lawsuits.

I am always glad to see a school still doing this.

[invictus]

I don't agree.

There is a separation of church and state, period.  Pray on your own all you want, but I shouldn't have to listen to it.

[QueenPirate]

As a Pirate, I am very glad that our school continues to pray before each game.  Every week the prayers are directed toward keeping the players safe and for everyone attending to have a safe trip home.

[Eagle11]

[quote name="PirateGirl4ever" post="1119099" timestamp="1321390349"]
As a Pirate, I am very glad that our school continues to pray before each game.  Every week the prayers are directed toward keeping the players safe and for everyone attending to have a safe trip home.
[/quote]
Keep it up Vidor.......kudos

[horndawg]

[quote name="invictus" post="1119094" timestamp="1321390195"]
I don't agree.

There is a separation of church and state, period.  Pray on your own all you want, but I shouldn't have to listen to it.
[/quote]

They make earplugs for next to nothing, use them. Not like it's hurting you or anyone, hel.l they're even asking for protection over your own (assuming you have one playing). So let me ask, does a moment of silence bother you too?

[VPATH]

With all the tragic loss of local teens I don't think we are praying enough. Like Horndawg said, you don't like it wear earplugs. Not only are they praying for protection of the players but also for the protection of the fans in their travels to and from the games.

[snafu]

[quote name="invictus" post="1119094" timestamp="1321390195"]
I don't agree.

There is a separation of church and state, period.  Pray on your own all you want, but I shouldn't have to listen to it.
[/quote]

The separation of church and state was only to keep the church from running the state.... as you express your freedom of right to speech we have to listen to it and no one bitches.... so why can you not afford us the same?

[snafu]

[quote name="Coach Comeaux" post="1119222" timestamp="1321397348"]
[quote author=invictus link=topic=91617.msg1119094#msg1119094 date=1321390195]
I don't agree.

There is a separation of church and state, period.  Pray on your own all you want, but I shouldn't have to listen to it.
[/quote]

The separation of church and state was only to keep the church from running the state.... as you express your freedom of right to speech we have to listen to it and no one bitches.... so why can you not afford us the same?
[/quote]

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The concept of the separation of church and state refers to the distance in the relationship between organized religion and the nation state. The term is an offshoot of the phrase, "wall of separation between church and state," as written in Thomas Jefferson's letter to the Danbury Baptist Association in 1802. The original text reads: "... I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between Church & State." Jefferson reflected his frequent speaking theme that the government is not to interfere with religion

[tvc184]

In 2000 in a 6-3 vote the US Supreme Court in Santa Fe (TX) Independent School District v. Jane Doe ruled that a policy "allowing" student led prayer over the PA system violates the Constitution.

A student (or anyone else) can stand up in the audience and say a prayer and everyone can join or refuse at their own discretion. Students can pray on their own in class or at sporting events like taking a knee with the team after coming onto the field. Those are protected speech.

Saying a prayer over the PA system however is unlawful per the 2000 ruling and is not considered private speech.

I don't agree with it but the high court has ruled. When Vidor allows such, it appears that they are violating a court order. In as such, if someone sues Vidor, they will likely win and Vidor might be held in contempt of court for each occurrence.

Until someone complains and files a legal action, pray away on over the loud speakers but they aren't on good legal footing if push comes to shove.

Nederland basically has a prayer before the game without using God or Jesus Christ. It is something like, "We ask for guidance and wisdom, we ask for safety for participants and spectators ...." and so on. It just does not end with "...in Jesus name we pray...." or by invoking God.

[rvbulldogs]

Amen Vidor!  It was awesome to hear a prayer before a high school football game.  I pray not only my home town Nederland will pray before games in the future but also other schools through out the country.  This country is in decline because of its slow removal of Christianity.  Its a matter of time things will get worse if we dont change the way things are going.

[GoDogs27]

[quote name="CanineDog" post="1118995" timestamp="1321385745"]
Was at the Vidor game last Thursday and a young lady from Vidor gave an outstanding prayer over the loudspeaker before the game.  I sure do miss ánd wish God was more a part of our sports like he once was.  Why doesnt Nederland or any other team do this anymore???  It sure was nice hearing that prayer before the game .  Kudos to Vidor. [b][/b]
[/quote]
Ummmmmmm. Because its ILLEGAL! There's a reason for it and its a good reason. If you want to pray then talk to God in your head. Why do i need to hear it? Also, if i want to pray, why would i want someone else to speak to my God for me? I can do it on my own and it be just as pleasing to him, no? Bottome line: this is just another attempt by the hardcore religious to try and stick their beliefs and ideas on other people. Get over it and realize that it does more harm than good. pray in your head.

[bulldawg64]

what has it  become a issue anyway?
pray at the game.who cares
vidor is great for having the guts
to do it.that is what is happening
now in time,to many people tripping!  :)

[Riding Solo]

[quote name="invictus" post="1119094" timestamp="1321390195"]
I don't agree.

There is a separation of church and state, period.  Pray on your own all you want, but I shouldn't have to listen to it.
[/quote]

:P

[bulldog1984]

thats whats wrong with our country these days, it the minorty winning and not the majority winning. I would say more than 90 percent would love prayer at the games leaving 10 percent not liking it. I guess thats what our country has come too. LET MINORTY RULE  ... I think not !!!

[SmashMouth]

I have heard prayer at Vidor and Lumberton.  I like it!

[JollyRoger81]

I love that Vidor still prays at the beginning of all home games, and I hope that never changes!

[Riding Solo]

[quote name="bulldog1984" post="1119386" timestamp="1321406271"]
thats whats wrong with our country these days, it the minorty winning and not the majority winning. I would say more than 90 percent would love prayer at the games leaving 10 percent not liking it. I guess thats what our country has come too. LET MINORTY RULE  ... I think not !!!
[/quote]

Good post bulldog.

[tvc184]

[quote name="bulldog1984" post="1119386" timestamp="1321406271"]
thats whats wrong with our country these days, it the minorty winning and not the majority winning. I would say more than 90 percent would love prayer at the games leaving 10 percent not liking it. I guess thats what our country has come too. LET MINORTY RULE  ... I think not !!!
[/quote]

Then you might as well throw out the Constitution if majority wins.

The majority could vote to kill all blondes (natural or bottle made) and it would be legal. After all, majority rules.

A saying that is attributed to Benjamin Franklin goes something like this when speaking of democracy......
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."

I wonder what the lamb would think about pure democracy.

[pirate68]

[quote name="tvc184" post="1119423" timestamp="1321407842"]
[quote author=bulldog1984 link=topic=91617.msg1119386#msg1119386 date=1321406271]
thats whats wrong with our country these days, it the minorty winning and not the majority winning. I would say more than 90 percent would love prayer at the games leaving 10 percent not liking it. I guess thats what our country has come too. LET MINORTY RULE  ... I think not !!!
[/quote]

Then you might as well throw out the Constitution if majority wins.

The majority could vote to kill all blondes (natural or bottle made) and it would be legal. After all, majority rules.

A saying that is attributed to Benjamin Franklin goes something like this when speaking of democracy......
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."

I wonder what the lamb would think about pure democracy.
[/quote]Great Post TVC....I think some people get caught up on this topic and forget that when you take out some parts of the constitution that is not popular with the majority you no longer have a democracy..
PS...I believe in prayer but very much respect the rights of the people that do not.

[mat]

[quote name="invictus" post="1119094" timestamp="1321390195"]
I don't agree.

There is a separation of church and state, period.  Pray on your own all you want, but I shouldn't have to listen to it.
[/quote]

I think some one that has a problem with some one praying for their safe travel home and the safety of those playing on the field has a real problem.

[akifan94]

This is what is wrong with our country. Too many idiots running around. If you do not like do not listen. Some of you should pick up a history book and learn a little about this great country and how it came to be. It damn sure wasn't because of people worrying about hurting the feelings of a few.  :'(

[GoDogs27]

[quote name="bulldog1984" post="1119386" timestamp="1321406271"]
thats whats wrong with our country these days, it the minorty winning and not the majority winning. I would say more than 90 percent would love prayer at the games leaving 10 percent not liking it. I guess thats what our country has come too. LET MINORTY RULE  ... I think not !!!
[/quote]Your logic is seriously flawed. Its got nothing to do with what percentage wants it vs. what percentage doesnt. If thats how you view this, you know nothing about America and our values. People that think this country was founded on God or Christianity, pick up a few history books. You sound ignorant.

Side note to help you out: God was never originally in the Pledge of Allegiance. The pledge was modified in the 1950's to add "under God". And your next point will surely be about the phrase "In God We Trust." well guess what? That wasnt added to currency until the civil war.

Now, praying at the games doesnt offend me or bother me at all. But what does offend me is when people try to warp our country's values around what they believe our country's values should be. Read up on our founding fathers and their whole entire reasoning for the revolution and why they set our government up the way they did.

[akifan94]

[quote name="GoDogs27" post="1119600" timestamp="1321414888"]
[quote author=bulldog1984 link=topic=91617.msg1119386#msg1119386 date=1321406271]
thats whats wrong with our country these days, it the minorty winning and not the majority winning. I would say more than 90 percent would love prayer at the games leaving 10 percent not liking it. I guess thats what our country has come too. LET MINORTY RULE  ... I think not !!!
[/quote]Your logic is seriously flawed. Its got nothing to do with what percentage wants it vs. what percentage doesnt. If thats how you view this, you know nothing about America and our values. People that think this country was founded on God or Christianity, pick up a few history books. You sound ignorant.

Side note to help you out: God was never originally in the Pledge of Allegiance. The pledge was modified in the 1950's to add "under God". And your next point will surely be about the phrase "In God We Trust." well guess what? That wasnt added to currency until the civil war.

Now, praying at the games doesnt offend me or bother me at all. But what does offend me is when people try to warp our country's values around what they believe our country's values should be. Read up on our founding fathers and their whole entire reasoning for the revolution and why they set our government up the way they did.
[/quote]

You are wrong. Our founding fathers did not want to become a church state. That had nothing to with prayer at school, Christmas trees, crosses or any other thing that might "offend" someone. What is ironic is that by passing a law against it the "state" is not separated at all from the church. The First Amendment reads "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."

I am currently reading "A Patriot's History of The United States" by Larry Schweikart. Try picking it up and educating yourself.