Ned gets road win at Vidor-Article PA News

[stevenash]

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1166251" timestamp="1327593164"]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=94873.msg1166246#msg1166246 date=1327592704]
Dang! Where I'm from those are strong statements. Boutte needs to come out of retirement for a year or two ;D
[/quote]

Then it will be some OTHER reason if he does and runs this area....again! 8)....He likes his cush office and polo shirts and slacks too much to give it up now!! ;D...BUT...You never know... ;)
[/quote]

I commend you for your loyalty and admiration.  But a dose of common sense/reality would be a nice addition.  Dickie, you are the one who insisted that somebody else try to look at this without bias.  You are way too close to this situation to make any unbiased evaluations

[team first]

Not a betting man, I work to hard for my money.
But no one can convince me other wise that ozen had way more talent than vidor. And there was only one ot game.

Vidor lost 3 games in district, and ozen lost 2.
All I know is when they faced each other with close talent, English won all 3

[Honest Abe]

Here is the truth:

In 2004, Ozen had as much (prob more) talent than Vidor. V had one 6'7" player, and the other 4 starters were ALL under 6'. George did NOT even start that year. In that ONE year where the teams were equally talented, Coach E's Vidor went 3-0 against Boutte's Ozen Panthers.
Since this year and last year's talent in Ozen is about what it was that 2004 year, there is nothing suggesting that Ned would not be on a 27 game district winning streak. Remember, THAT is what we r debating here.

This is my closing statement your honor.

[team first]

And wasn't meaning to disrespect what Boutte did in 07, calling it a great job. Awesome job it is

[Guest speechless]

answer my question:

what made Ozen a staple at the state tournament and why wasn't Nederland?

[Dick Vitale]

[quote name="stevenash" post="1166254" timestamp="1327593375"]
[quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=94873.msg1166251#msg1166251 date=1327593164]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=94873.msg1166246#msg1166246 date=1327592704]
Dang! Where I'm from those are strong statements. Boutte needs to come out of retirement for a year or two ;D
[/quote]

Then it will be some OTHER reason if he does and runs this area....again! 8)....He likes his cush office and polo shirts and slacks too much to give it up now!! ;D...BUT...You never know... ;)
[/quote]

I commend you for your loyalty and admiration.  But a dose of common sense/reality would be a nice addition.  Dickie, you are the one who insisted that somebody else try to look at this without bias.  You are way too close to this situation to make any unbiased evaluations
[/quote]

You may be correct, steve...but how can you argue with the numbers? I may BE too close to evaluate this without bias...No argument from me on that. 8)...I simply don't see whats so hard to see WHY Ozen is a "different" program than what it used to be, just a few years ago..

[quote author=team first link=topic=94873.msg1166259#msg1166259 date=1327593687]
Not a betting man, I work to hard for my money.
But no one can convince me other wise that ozen had way more talent than vidor. And there was only one ot game.

Vidor lost 3 games in district, and ozen lost 2.
All I know is when they faced each other with close talent, English won all 3
[/quote]

OK, and in 2007? what about 2006? and 2005? Come on, man...look at this through unbiased eyes for a second...I have ACKNOWLEDGED that Brian English can flat out coach...YOU have said that Boutte taking a team to Austin that was NOT VERY TALENTED and advancing to the title game was a "good job"... :o....Yet you say English would "x and o" Boutte to death....Based on what? Looks like you are not ready to give someone credit for accomplishing something because you think it was a "given" due to an abundance of talent...Thats just not the case.

[sleepy]

Both are great coaches and I don't think either would x and o either to death.  Boutte does not have the experience of coaching kids as weak as English has had in past years so who knows what he would do with those type of kids.

[Guest speechless]

answer my question:

why was Ozen a regular at the state tournament and Nederland not?

[Honest Abe]

Dickie V- you are in way over your head. You have about five different debates going at one time. Remember that this is about the 27 game district winning streak that Nederland currently has. You are bringing up all of these other years, which have no relevance to the debate at hand. If we stick to the facts, it suggests that Nederland would still have their win streak alive.

[Dick Vitale]

[quote name="sleepy" post="1166265" timestamp="1327594189"]
Both are great coaches and I don't think either would x and o either to death.  Boutte does not have the experience of coaching kids as weak as English has had in past years so who knows what he would do with those type of kids.
[/quote]
Great point...BUT...PA Lincoln 1993 had no player taller than 6'2" and was a FT away from winning the state title in Austin...They were in no way a dominant squad, but were well coached...AND WENT TO THE STATE TITLE GAME...That should speak volumes as well...But in most eyes here, going to state was a "right of passage" at Lincoln..and it was not...

[Guest speechless]

answer my question:

Why was Ozen a regular at the state tournament and Nederland not?

[Dick Vitale]

[quote name="NB-Dawg" post="1166268" timestamp="1327594515"]
Dickie V- you are in way over your head. You have about five different debates going at one time. Remember that this is about the 27 game district winning streak that Nederland currently has. You are bringing up all of these other years, which have no relevance to the debate at hand. If we stick to the facts, it suggests that Nederland would still have their win streak alive.
[/quote]

It is VERY relevant, because some of you act as if you have forgotten what Boutte has done here! NO...Nederland would not have won 27 games in a row had he still been at Ozen...NO WAY.. 8)

[quote author=baddog link=topic=94873.msg1166270#msg1166270 date=1327594775]
Good road win against VIDOR.....Ned!!!! 27 and counting. Some people can't handle it!!!
[/quote]

Yes it was!! LOL ;D

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="stevenash" post="1166250" timestamp="1327593027"]
Dove- I can't believe you waited that long to get in on this.  I will, of course, be unable to confirm your contention.  When the talent pool is down, there is only so much a guy can do.  As I said earlier, Pat Knight is getting quite a bit more out of the Lamar team than his predecessor with essentially the same players but Lamar is hardly dominating the conference.  I can assure you that the presence of Bill Belicek as head coach of the HJ football team would NOT, under any circumstance, propel them to district champs.
[/quote] To be honest, I'm just not that familiar with Ozen basketball, and definitely not with Nederland. The only time I saw Ozen back then was on the UIL web site or maybe local tv when they played Bosh's club in Austin. I'm just generally Phillis Wheatley fan when it comes to high school basketball ;)

[baddog]

Good road win against VIDOR.....Ned!!!! 27 and counting. Some people can't handle it!!!

[Dick Vitale]

[quote name="speechless" post="1166271" timestamp="1327594790"]
answer my question:

Why was Ozen a regular at the state tournament and Nederland not?
[/quote]

Ozen was built into an elite program....there are not very many around who can do it like that...answer.

[Guest speechless]

Ozen was "built"?  Explain...how?  What is required to "build" an elite program?

[Dick Vitale]

[quote name="speechless" post="1166276" timestamp="1327595132"]
Ozen was "built"?  Explain...how?  What is required to "build" an elite program?
[/quote]

Player DEVELOPMENT, and teaching a group of youngsters to embrace the total team concept and the importance of fundamentals, while emphasizing the value of hard work...DONE.

[Guest speechless]

Player development?  What type of developing was done?  Where did these players get developed?  I mean....they weren't born 16 years old?

[Dick Vitale]

[quote name="speechless" post="1166281" timestamp="1327595682"]
Player development?  What type of developing was done?  Where did these players get developed?  I mean....they weren't born 16 years old?
[/quote]

Simply keeping the gym doors open year around and working with the kids when its time....teaching basketball, along with life lessons beyond basketball....what are you getting at? whats your point?

[Guest speechless]

Just trying to figure out what it takes to become a regular in Austin.

So far I have:

-Player development
    -keeping the gym doors open year around
    -working with the kids when it is time
    -teaching basketball, along with life lessons beyond basketball

-teaching youngsters to embrace the total team concept
-teaching youngsters the importance of fundamentals
-emphasizing the value of hard work

Is that all?

[Dick Vitale]

::) ::) Really?

[Guest speechless]

Yes....always looking to pick things up.

Is that all you would say?

[Guest infield fly]

Why are we talking about the past when ozen can't do it now. This is just a way for disgruntled fans to say that someone doesn't deserve credit for what they have accomplished. You can play the if and or but game forever but the fact is nhs is 27-0 in district and ozen can't do anything about it. If my aunt had nuts she would be my uncle

[Honest Abe]

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1166272" timestamp="1327594851"]
[quote author=NB-Dawg link=topic=94873.msg1166268#msg1166268 date=1327594515]
Dickie V- you are in way over your head. You have about five different debates going at one time. Remember that this is about the 27 game district winning streak that Nederland currently has. You are bringing up all of these other years, which have no relevance to the debate at hand. If we stick to the facts, it suggests that Nederland would still have their win streak alive.
[/quote]

It is VERY relevant, because some of you act as if you have forgotten what Boutte has done here! NO...Nederland would not have won 27 games in a row had he still been at Ozen...NO WAY.. 8)
[/quote]

According to the facts presented here today, there is no evidence suggesting that Nederland's 27 game winning streak would not be what it is today regardless if Boutte was the coach or not.
In the past 2 seasons during this streak, Ozen has not had the talents of:

K. Perkins
Keenan Young
Brandon Chappel
Willie Jefferson
DeCarlos Franks

Since Ozen has been 'down' over the past two season, like they were in
2004, Nederland would still have a 27 game district winning streak.

I am not disregarding what Boutte did during his time, it was amazing. Nobody on this thread has said differently. But during his ONE down year, VIDOR swept them 3-0.

For the 4th time, the kind of talent Ozen has now was just the same in
2004, when Coach E's team went 3-0 against Boutte. The same would
happen with this Ozen team.

[Guest speechless]

[quote]Yes....always looking to pick things up.

Is that all you would say?[/quote]