Athletecism vs Intellect

[Dick Vitale]

#1....that's a dumb question, get back on topic.

#2.....you know good and well why the logo is Jerry West and not Russell or Robertson....now get back on topic.

[Honest Abe]

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="1198580" timestamp="1331958904"]
[quote author=NB-Dawg link=topic=97596.msg1198564#msg1198564 date=1331955604]
So the 'experts' had Duke as a number 2 seed, yet they lose to a 15 seed. So all of the 'Basketball Gurus' who know as much as one can know about basketball were wrong?? ??? Being a common man, how does this happen?
Additionally, Missouri was predicted by MANY to make it to the Final Four (by the experts). Yet, these 'Gurus' got it wrong! With as much 'expertise' will someone please explain how they got it wrong? ???
[/quote] Sh!t Happens
[/quote]
Yes, I know. It was a rhetorical question.

[mytwocents-28]

[quote name="stevenash" post="1198662" timestamp="1332003626"]
[quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=97596.msg1198649#msg1198649 date=1331999665]
[quote author=baddog link=topic=97596.msg1198646#msg1198646 date=1331998943]
So is your HC trophy. Our case is bare of state trophies, but we have some DC trophies, which is where everyone starts.

Bird made everyone around him better, just like Perkins made you look like a better coach than you are.

Lehigh did not outsmart or out athlete anyone. They played the game of basketball better. Funny how you dodged the athletic part of my post. Everyone in basketball/sports is an athlete.

You should go to the comedy central forum. You'd be a smash hit.

All in good fun DV.
[/quote]
Once again, you attack ME...Its not about ME...You seem obsessed..I am talking about a specific topic, not ME...I have done PLENTY in the 1st chair, and there is lots to go, but what exactly have YOU done? Its not important, because no one really cares....STOP MAKING THIS ABOUT ME...I said YOUR SCHOOL would never win state...I said YOUR SCHOOL HAS NEVER WON STATE IN ANYTHING...I did not comment on "baddog" at all...Do you even KNOW an NBA player? Have you ever even won a Rec championship? How about intramurals? Been to college? Exactly...NO ONE CARES...Its tough being a nobody, huh, baddog? ;)

[quote author=stevenash link=topic=97596.msg1198642#msg1198642 date=1331998604]
[quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=97596.msg1198630#msg1198630 date=1331993574]
Once again, its not about ME...I already own state rings, anyway.. ;)...I was talking about your school, not YOU...I've been...and you'll never go...not the issue..so stop making it one... 8)
Hey Nash, did Lehigh intellects stun Duke, or did they out athlete them? What about Norfolk State? Were they simply "smarter" than Missouri? ::)
Hey baddog....Michael Jordan was the best ever....Jerry West is the logo, and we all know why, but Bill Russell SHOULD have been, in that era...Jerry West? No...Michael Jordan....go ahead say West was better....Prove my point.. 8)
[/quote]

I did not see the Lehigh -duke or Missouri - Norfolk games so cant offer my opinion.  I can only assure you of this.  EVERY SINGLE time you try to suggest or infer racism has anything to do with this, I will have a response and will NEVER be railroaded or intimidated by those inferences.  I believe I stated this before but, with your "famous" pedigree, go ahead and tell me why the following is not correct.  If an individual aspires to become a good basketball player and knows he cant make himself into a player who is as quick, fast, or who jumps as high as his competitors, would it not be logical that he will try to concentrate on being a smarter player with some better skills in an effort to offset any physical disadvantage he may have?  Will he possibly put more work into shooting proficiency than someone else does to make himself a player someone wants on their team? Will he try to become more knowledgeable about positions on the court, responsibilities, etc?  Will he try to set that screen a little bit better than the average player does so as to become a better player?  Will he make an effort to perhaps be a little more cerebral than someone else is because he has no choice and making one or two more good decisions in a contest just might help his game?  If a coach has a group of these types of players ( yes, the ones who cant run as fast or jump as high) is he going to concentrate on whatever strong points those players have in order to try to help them compete or will he spend his time trying to magically make them more athletic?  Additionally, let go of the "state rings" stuff because it is not nearly as big of a deal as you portray it to be.  If it is, you need to defer to Cbosha.
[/quote]

The funny thing is stevenash, I completely agree with what you are saying here...My "pedigree" has taught me that throughout the years..I have no idea why you keep placing emphasis on where I come from, but I am proud of my lineage...Proud family name...I was born in it..and as always, I know what I know..As for the state rings, that was a pun intended at someone else...My dad always taught me to never make that my greatest accomplishment in life, and I believe that. 

My issue with this whole athleticism vs. intellect is the fact that it IS for all practical purposes what AAW described...In your mind, if they are of the caucasion persuasion, they MUST be a smarter team..Nash, you know NOTHING about the intellectual capacity of the Vermont team, yet in your mind they were "smarter" than the Lamar players based on what? How they played? or how they LOOKED? I watched that game and saw a Vermont team that was bigger, well prepared, and just a better overall team than Lamar...Had nothing to do with how much smarter they were than the Lamar kids...Yes you may donate to Lamar and all, but that still does not change your view of those kids, because they don't look like you...Your mocking of my "pedigree" speaks volumes...I think you are a nice guy, nash...I really do, but I also think you have your biases when it comes to this particular topic...No harm in that...it is what it is.
[/quote]

The pedigree comment is simply short speak for what you always remind everybody of and nothing else.  Sorry, but you and AAW are not capable of knowing what is in my mind.  You make an assumption and proceed on that.  As I also stated earlier, Princeton is an excellent example of the point I was making and if I am not mistaken, that team often consists of blacks and whites.  The Vermont team I saw was more patient and had more options in their arsenal did than Lamar, neither of which has anything to do with skin color.  They also shot the ball considerably better which also has nothing to do with skin color but rather with practice and dedication.  We all know what you know Dickie but you also should know what you don't know ( if, in fact, you can accept that as a possibility)  One of the things  you don't know is how to  deal with a situation without [b]assuming [/b] there is a racial component to it.  If you are familiar with the last two coaching stops my relative had, you know very well that I have had plenty of exposure and relationships with kids of extremely varied backgrounds and have a reasonably good feel and appreciation for their subsequent different values, attitudes and upbringings.  Your background is pretty much limited to one side of the issue and I would suggest to you that mine is more varied and obviously for a much longer time.  I watched South Dakota State have Baylor in a lot of trouble early in the game but Baylor ultimately prevailed.  Why is that?  Was it because the South Dakota State team had athletes equal to Baylor?
[/quote]
Funny how he hasn't replied yet.  8)

[east texas bb]

You can learn alot about the character of a person by what they say.  Not reputation.  Character. (John Wooden)
Now character can lead to a negative outlook on someones character, which you have done to yourself.  In alot of ways you are your own worst enemy.

The racial crap is enough, there are players from all races of people who have been great ball players.

You dont see others on this message board constantly bragging about their accomplishments, their pedigrees, ect  in their life, although I am sure many have had quite a few in basketball and other things.  The insecure person is the one that will yell out his accomplishments, saying look at me, look at me.  The reason all threads turn to you DV is because you make them about you because you are really an insecure person.  You talk first and think later and that is not a good thing to do in life. 
And no I am not going to discuss my accomplishments and failures, they have all been learning experiences. 
I just hope you dont go on a coaching message board and act like this, the reception will not be good.

[Dick Vitale]

You can call me what you want....I am speaking the gospel truth...that's what people DON'T want to hear...question..who accomplished more in the NBA....Russell or West? If you answer that HONESTLY, then you MIGHT understand my point...I said this a THOUSAND TIMES...Larry Bird was a phenomenal player...one of the best to ever do it....Magic was a better athlete and a better overall talent..Bird was tough as nails and fundamentally sound..Jordan was THE greatest ever. 

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="stevenash" post="1197840" timestamp="1331856038"]
South Dakota State leading Baylor 17-6.  Can the intellect hang on?
[/quote]Dang I'm behind! And the answer is NO!!!!!

[BLUEDOVE3]

If anyone watched the McDonald All Star Game last night, you saw a good mixture of athleticism and Intellect on the floor. ;)

[stevenash]

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="1203594" timestamp="1333039480"]
If anyone watched the McDonald All Star Game last night, you saw a good mixture of athleticism and Intellect on the floor. ;)
[/quote]

At that level, all players possess plenty of both attributes.

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="stevenash" post="1203631" timestamp="1333044490"]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=97596.msg1203594#msg1203594 date=1333039480]
If anyone watched the McDonald All Star Game last night, you saw a good mixture of athleticism and Intellect on the floor. ;)
[/quote]

At that level, all players possess plenty of both attributes.
[/quote] ???, then what level have you been referring to my good man?  ???

[stevenash]

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="1203640" timestamp="1333044907"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=97596.msg1203631#msg1203631 date=1333044490]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=97596.msg1203594#msg1203594 date=1333039480]
If anyone watched the McDonald All Star Game last night, you saw a good mixture of athleticism and Intellect on the floor. ;)
[/quote]

At that level, all players possess plenty of both attributes.
[/quote] ???, then what level have you been referring to my good man?  ???
[/quote]

I believe I have been talking about high school and colleges without a  lot of notoriety where they don't have legal access to the cream of the crop.

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="stevenash" post="1203644" timestamp="1333045748"]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=97596.msg1203640#msg1203640 date=1333044907]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=97596.msg1203631#msg1203631 date=1333044490]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=97596.msg1203594#msg1203594 date=1333039480]
If anyone watched the McDonald All Star Game last night, you saw a good mixture of athleticism and Intellect on the floor. ;)
[/quote]

At that level, all players possess plenty of both attributes.
[/quote] ???, then what level have you been referring to my good man?  ???
[/quote]

I believe I have been talking about high school and colleges without a  lot of notoriety where they don't have legal access to the cream of the crop.
[/quote]Legal access  ;D ;D

[stevenash]

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="1203655" timestamp="1333046428"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=97596.msg1203644#msg1203644 date=1333045748]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=97596.msg1203640#msg1203640 date=1333044907]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=97596.msg1203631#msg1203631 date=1333044490]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=97596.msg1203594#msg1203594 date=1333039480]
If anyone watched the McDonald All Star Game last night, you saw a good mixture of athleticism and Intellect on the floor. ;)
[/quote]

At that level, all players possess plenty of both attributes.
[/quote] ???, then what level have you been referring to my good man?  ???
[/quote]

I believe I have been talking about high school and colleges without a  lot of notoriety where they don't have legal access to the cream of the crop.
[/quote]Legal access  ;D ;D
[/quote]

In the case of the high schools, they are "supposedly" limited to those that live in their respective areas.  In the case of the lesser known colleges, they cant get a star player unless they can "outbid" the larger rivals via some benefits that arent supposed to be provided.