Does Classes that Specialize in One Sport really Help a 3A school?

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="Riding Solo" post="1209484" timestamp="1334191663"]
Karma for you Dove. ;D
[/quote]Lord knows I could use a few  ;D

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="catfever" post="1209525" timestamp="1334196332"]
Bridge City has a baseball and basketball.  WOS has baseball and basketball.  Silsbee has basketball and baseball.  HJ has basketball and baseball.  Who knows what the new AD at HF will have, but with a certain board member on the nomination committee and his kid play bball, they will probably be able to do thier sport.  So OF will be the only one in 21-3A that doesn't. 

All of you are correct.  Kids should learn the basics of all sports in the youth ages, but the sad part is there are more and more that are not being taught, and without those individual skills, the team will suffer.  Dove wasn't Universal offseason one of the things that you griped about when your boys were at HF.  Do they practice skills at Ozen now.  Also, there is 50 minutes allocated during school that they can practice as a team.  It is after school that they cannot do this until their season starts.  The coach can design any workout during this 50 minute period all school year.

Also, I never said kids couldn't practice football during this time.  That should be completely up to the Head football coach if he so chooses.
[/quote] When they were in middle school I initially had some concerns with weight lifting (specifically  leg squats). But the coach and I met and he explained what they were doing and the supervision involved and I felt HF's program was very beneficial to their growth and development. From what the boys are telling me, they get in a lot of weight lifting, running, and some gym time.

[footballin]

[quote name="Riding Solo" post="1209621" timestamp="1334238381"]
I just talked to  UIL director and yes you can practice a sport out of season duing the school year in the athletic period. I was wrong but I still feel the sameway about classes for individual sports. 50 minutes is not a lot of time to actually get in much work.  Most of the work is done after school. HJ is good not because they have a basketball class but because of their little dribbler program. I don't see the baseball class helping their baseball program. Silsbee they just have more athletes plain and simple. Don't see a basketball class helping Bridge City either. Here are the facts, unless Orangefield really grows at a rapid pace we will always be in the rear view mirrow of WOS, Silsbee and HJ in basketball, also WOS, Silsbee and BC in football. It will be hit and miss for us as long as we stay in this district. We simply do not have the number of athletes some of these bigger schools have. Orangefield needs to have their athlete's playing multiple sports in order to compete. If kids start specializing the program as a "WHOLE" is doomed. That is what we are talking about RIGHT, the "WHOLE" program.
[/quote]Perfectly put!

[falcolnfanatic]

I don't think it is necessary to have a " baseball or basketball" class. Like some other posters said the skills to make someone a good baseball or basketball player will not be acquired in a 50 minute class, it takes much more than that.

However what will hurt athletes that play other sports is the way they lift. Football lifts are typically designed to go alot of weight with fewer reps, which makes the athlete bulkier and more explosive. That is the exact opposite types of lift that you need for baseball. Baseball requires for leaner muscle which is acquired with lighter weight and increased reps. There are also certain lifts like bench press that are common in football that provide no benefit for baseball players and will even lead to increased injuries in pitchers. Bench press has been described as "the single mos dangerous weight room activity for pitchers". When I was in high school (class of 08) we lifted bench press atleast 3 times a weak with heavy weight. We didnt have specialized classes and the athletic period was purely designed for football even durring the offseason we were required to do football workouts. You couldn't even be in the athletic class unless you played football, which left the kids that specialized at one sport at a disadvantage.

So no it is not necessary to have a specialized class for each sport, but the workouts in the athletic period should be designed to benfit all athletes. If there is a kid who plays baseball he should not be required to football workouts he should have his own workout that will benfit him as a baseball player. If there are multiple sport athletes they should not be required to do football lifts especially bench press durring the baseball season.

Here is an article about the dangers of bench press for baseball players.

http://www.stevenellis.com/steven_ellis_the_complete/2005/03/heres_exactly_w.html

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="falconfanatic" post="1209673" timestamp="1334245806"]
I don't think it is necessary to have a " baseball or basketball" class. Like some other posters said the skills to make someone a good baseball or basketball player will not be acquired in a 50 minute class, it takes much more than that.

However what will hurt athletes that play other sports is the way they lift. Football lifts are typically designed to go alot of weight with fewer reps, which makes the athlete bulkier and more explosive. That is the exact opposite types of lift that you need for baseball. Baseball requires for leaner muscle which is acquired with lighter weight and increased reps. There are also certain lifts like bench press that are common in football that provide no benefit for baseball players and will even lead to increased injuries in pitchers. Bench press has been described as "the single mos dangerous weight room activity for pitchers". When I was in high school (class of 08) we lifted bench press atleast 3 times a weak with heavy weight. We didnt have specialized classes and the athletic period was purely designed for football even durring the offseason we were required to do football workouts. You couldn't even be in the athletic class unless you played football, which left the kids that specialized at one sport at a disadvantage.

So no it is not necessary to have a specialized class for each sport, but the workouts in the athletic period should be designed to benfit all athletes. If there is a kid who plays baseball he should not be required to football workouts he should have his own workout that will benfit him as a baseball player. If there are multiple sport athletes they should not be required to do football lifts especially bench press durring the baseball season.

Here is an article about the dangers of bench press for baseball players.

http://www.stevenellis.com/steven_ellis_the_complete/2005/03/heres_exactly_w.html
[/quote]These were my concerns. Felt better after visiting the school and my concerns for proper knee squats for no-football training.

[hitman009]

[quote name="Riding Solo" post="1209621" timestamp="1334238381"]
I just talked to  UIL director and yes you can practice a sport out of season duing the school year in the athletic period. I was wrong but I still feel the sameway about classes for individual sports. 50 minutes is not a lot of time to actually get in much work.  Most of the work is done after school. HJ is good not because they have a basketball class but because of their little dribbler program. I don't see the baseball class helping their baseball program. Silsbee they just have more athletes plain and simple. Don't see a basketball class helping Bridge City either. Here are the facts, unless Orangefield really grows at a rapid pace we will always be in the rear view mirrow of WOS, Silsbee and HJ in basketball, also WOS, Silsbee and BC in football. It will be hit and miss for us as long as we stay in this district. We simply do not have the number of athletes some of these bigger schools have. Orangefield needs to have their athlete's playing multiple sports in order to compete. If kids start specializing the program as a "WHOLE" is doomed. That is what we are talking about RIGHT, the "WHOLE" program.
[/quote]Sure you can get alot of stuff done in 50 min. If it is done right... You cant just have practice where one hits and the rest shag... that is stupid... set up stations where 4 in a group (working on a specific swing) @ 5 min a station... 7 stations = 21 kids getting plenty of reps in 35 min....
I was a three sport kid and went to HJ from 89-93. So I care about all sports.
The best way to run a program is to have a Freshman weight training class for all who particpate in ANY athletics.... and they lift no matter if they are in season or not.... who cares about the Sub Varsity games... as long as the kids are getting stronger, faster and better skills. when they get to be more than higher than that leave them alone. You cant make a kid play so why burn him because he says no.. should all football players not practice football during the period just because they are done and they wont play baseball??.... no... thats stupid..... Let the kids be... dont perswade them...  help them be mature adults!!
That is the way a real program should be put together

[Riding Solo]

Maybe you should become a coach then, since you have all the answers. By the way I played 4 sports. ;)

[catfever]

Many skills from all sports can be taught in 50 minutes.  My belief is that the Head Coach of the sport should be allowed to decide what days to lift weights, what conditioning or agility drills would benefit his kids, and what sport specific skill drills could help his sport.  Most coaches want to build something within their sport so they would want to get better in the offseason.  It is hard to do that when you have no control over what the kids do in the offseason.  Many people have gotten on here and said that kids should be motivated enough to do it on their own.  I completely agree and when I was younger we were like that.  Are we really naive enough to think that very many of them are going to do that today.  Kids have changed.  They don't live outside anymore to throw the ball around or shoot hoops.  Society has changed and athletics needs to adjust as well in order to progress.  Somebody mentioned the 2010 Bobcat baseball team.  That team had three young men who really knew how to work and were gifted with many natural talents as well.  They were very driven.  Those kids don't come around very often.  Not many teams have 3 Division one athletes on one team at the 3A level.

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="catfever" post="1209812" timestamp="1334253746"]
Many skills from all sports can be taught in 50 minutes.  My belief is that the Head Coach of the sport should be allowed to decide what days to lift weights, what conditioning or agility drills would benefit his kids, and what sport specific skill drills could help his sport.  Most coaches want to build something within their sport so they would want to get better in the offseason.  It is hard to do that when you have no control over what the kids do in the offseason.  Many people have gotten on here and said that kids should be motivated enough to do it on their own.  I completely agree and when I was younger we were like that.  Are we really naive enough to think that very many of them are going to do that today.  Kids have changed.  They don't live outside anymore to throw the ball around or shoot hoops.  Society has changed and athletics needs to adjust as well in order to progress.  Somebody mentioned the 2010 Bobcat baseball team.  That team had three young men who really knew how to work and were gifted with many natural talents as well.  They were very driven.  Those kids don't come around very often.  Not many teams have 3 Division one athletes on one team at the 3A level.
[/quote]Not even 5-A now ;)

[Riding Solo]

[quote name="catfever" post="1209812" timestamp="1334253746"]
Many skills from all sports can be taught in 50 minutes.  My belief is that the Head Coach of the sport should be allowed to decide what days to lift weights, what conditioning or agility drills would benefit his kids, and what sport specific skill drills could help his sport.  Most coaches want to build something within their sport so they would want to get better in the offseason.  It is hard to do that when you have no control over what the kids do in the offseason.  Many people have gotten on here and said that kids should be motivated enough to do it on their own.  I completely agree and when I was younger we were like that.  Are we really naive enough to think that very many of them are going to do that today.  Kids have changed.  They don't live outside anymore to throw the ball around or shoot hoops.  Society has changed and athletics needs to adjust as well in order to progress.  Somebody mentioned the 2010 Bobcat baseball team.  That team had three young men who really knew how to work and were gifted with many natural talents as well.  They were very driven.  Those kids don't come around very often.  Not many teams have 3 Division one athletes on one team at the 3A level.
[/quote]

I agree somewhat with your statement about the kids of today. I graduated from Orangefield in 1980 and believe me the parents of today would not like Coach Peveto. I played 4 sports and even though Basketball was my favorite I did not mind going through offseason for football because a position is earned not given. That being said there are football players that play basketball and I am sure they want equal practice time as the kids who only play Basketball. It is hard to practice when your whole team is not there. If you give to one it will take away from another. All this is mute point because as long as we are in this district it will be a struggle. Like you said those really gifted athlete's don't come around very often and neither will winning for orangefield. Don't get me wrong, I think our kids are awesome and for being out numbered they fight to the end.  Before the 2010 group came the last athlete to stand out was Jeff Granger. That was 22 years ago. I don't have a dog in this fight anymore. When I hear classes for an individual sport I see specializing and I will never agree to that. I guess I will be old school forever. Huck will be gone soon and some of you will win. I will just sit back and watch because when a new guy comes in and things don't go the way some of you want it to or the program does not progress, I will be there to say I told you so.

[footballin]

[quote name="Riding Solo" post="1209914" timestamp="1334259134"]
[quote author=catfever link=topic=98828.msg1209812#msg1209812 date=1334253746]
Many skills from all sports can be taught in 50 minutes.  My belief is that the Head Coach of the sport should be allowed to decide what days to lift weights, what conditioning or agility drills would benefit his kids, and what sport specific skill drills could help his sport.  Most coaches want to build something within their sport so they would want to get better in the offseason.  It is hard to do that when you have no control over what the kids do in the offseason.  Many people have gotten on here and said that kids should be motivated enough to do it on their own.  I completely agree and when I was younger we were like that.  Are we really naive enough to think that very many of them are going to do that today.  Kids have changed.  They don't live outside anymore to throw the ball around or shoot hoops.  Society has changed and athletics needs to adjust as well in order to progress.  Somebody mentioned the 2010 Bobcat baseball team.  That team had three young men who really knew how to work and were gifted with many natural talents as well.  They were very driven.  Those kids don't come around very often.  Not many teams have 3 Division one athletes on one team at the 3A level.
[/quote]

I agree somewhat with your statement about the kids of today. I graduated from Orangefield in 1980 and believe me the parents of today would not like Coach Peveto. I played 4 sports and even though Basketball was my favorite I did not mind going through offseason for football because a position is earned not given. That being said there are football players that play basketball and I am sure they want equal practice time as the kids who only play Basketball. It is hard to practice when your whole team is not there. If you give to one it will take away from another. All this is mute point because as long as we are in this district it will be a struggle. Like you said those really gifted athlete's don't come around very often and neither will winning for orangefield. Don't get me wrong, I think our kids are awesome and for being out numbered they fight to the end.  Before the 2010 group came the last athlete to stand out was Jeff Granger. That was 22 years ago. I don't have a dog in this fight anymore. When I hear classes for an individual sport I see specializing and I will never agree to that. I guess I will be old school forever. Huck will be gone soon and some of you will win. I will just sit back and watch because when a new guy comes in and things don't go the way some of you want it to or the program does not progress, I will be there to say I told you so.
[/quote] There were many athletes on the 2010 group, in fact just about all 9 starters were pretty impressive. Felts and Statum obviously attained much of the attention, but don't forget that Q. Evans is at Blinn doing quite well, Angelle went to Lamar and recently picked up his first collegiate W, Huckabay had a few smaller schools interested in him to walk on for baseball but ended up going with football at McNeese, Derick Evans could have went to college for any sport and if I'm not mistaken McNeese wanted him for baseball, with a bigger frame I think Deramus could have played somewhere as well. This was not some random lucky cluster of good athletic genetics that made this team successful, it was the skills they developed starting at a young age and the hard work put in outside of their mandatory practices that set these guys up for a successful season. To rely on HS coaches to develop those types of skills in that short amount of time is a little far fetched.

[Riding Solo]

[quote name="catfever" post="1209812" timestamp="1334253746"]
Many skills from all sports can be taught in 50 minutes.  My belief is that the Head Coach of the sport should be allowed to decide what days to lift weights, what conditioning or agility drills would benefit his kids, and what sport specific skill drills could help his sport.  Most coaches want to build something within their sport so they would want to get better in the offseason.  It is hard to do that when you have no control over what the kids do in the offseason.  Many people have gotten on here and said that kids should be motivated enough to do it on their own.  I completely agree and when I was younger we were like that.  [color=red]Are we really naive enough to think that very many of them are going to do that today.  Kids have changed.  They don't live outside anymore to throw the ball around or shoot hoops. [/color]  [color=red]Society has changed and athletics needs to adjust as well in order to progress.[/color]  Somebody mentioned the 2010 Bobcat baseball team.  That team had three young men who really knew how to work and were gifted with many natural talents as well.  They were very driven.  Those kids don't come around very often.  Not many teams have 3 Division one athletes on one team at the 3A level.
[/quote]

I keep reading your post over and over and while I do agree society has changed and so have kids but I disagree with the comment in red. Maybe I am misreading something and If I am I will be the first to say I was wrong. Basically I take what you are saying as athletics should change because kids have gotten lazy. Who's fault is it that kids don't play outside anymore? The kids are the ones that need to change. What happen to morals and respect. Those kids(2010 baseball) knew how to work because their parents instilled it in them and if a parent is not going to do that then a coach might as well. We live in a "Give Every Kid a Ribbon" society. Well sorry not every kid should get a ribbon only the man in the arena. It is not the critic who counts nor the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; Whose fate is marred by dust and sweat and blood; Who errs and comes short again; Who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions; And spends himself in a worthy cause; Who at best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement; And who at worst , if he fails at least fails while daring greatly; So that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat.

[ispeakjive]

[quote name="Riding Solo" post="1209621" timestamp="1334238381"]
I just talked to  UIL director and yes you can practice a sport out of season duing the school year in the athletic period. I was wrong but I still feel the sameway about classes for individual sports. 50 minutes is not a lot of time to actually get in much work.  Most of the work is done after school. HJ is good not because they have a basketball class but because of their little dribbler program. I don't see the baseball class helping their baseball program. Silsbee they just have more athletes plain and simple. Don't see a basketball class helping Bridge City either. Here are the facts, unless Orangefield really grows at a rapid pace we will always be in the rear view mirrow of WOS, Silsbee and HJ in basketball, also WOS, Silsbee and BC in football. It will be hit and miss for us as long as we stay in this district. We simply do not have the number of athletes some of these bigger schools have. Orangefield needs to have their athlete's playing multiple sports in order to compete. If kids start specializing the program as a "WHOLE" is doomed. That is what we are talking about RIGHT, the "WHOLE" program.
[/quote]

"WHOLE" program = Football program

Anyone who thinks that baseball or basketball players don't benefit from actually "playing" baseball or basketball or working on those individual sports during an athletic period is in denial or truly thinks that every boy in a HS should be playing football and maybe fit in another sport where possible during those specific seasons.  That just isn't the way it is anymore.  With the growth of select baseball and AAU / summer basketball, kids have more options to develop in other sports and what some of you perceive as the "specialization problem" is only going to get worse in all classifications.  There are more options to work on the non-football sports and unfortunately, some of the better athletes may like those better than football and shockingly choose not to play. 

Baseball and basketball players get next to nothing from doing football offseason workouts during their specific season.  The workouts should be sport specific, especially during the course of the season and if a kid chooses to specialize, he should not be looked at as letting the football program down.  I know this is Texas and football is king, but some of the arguments on here are ridiculous. 

[ispeakjive]

It's interesting that the people who say that kids should play multiple sports only seem to complain when a good athlete doesn't play football.  I don't seem to ever remember hearing those people lament the fact that a great football player isn't playing basketball or baseball or even soccer. 

[Riding Solo]

[quote name="ispeakjive" post="1209954" timestamp="1334268898"]
It's interesting that the people who say that kids should play multiple sports only seem to complain when a good athlete doesn't play football.  I don't seem to ever remember hearing those people lament the fact that a great football player isn't playing basketball or baseball or even soccer.
[/quote]

I guess you don't know the right people because I have always told kids to play as many sports as you can at the High school level.

[Riding Solo]

[quote name="ispeakjive" post="1209953" timestamp="1334268637"]
[quote author=Riding Solo link=topic=98828.msg1209621#msg1209621 date=1334238381]
I just talked to  UIL director and yes you can practice a sport out of season duing the school year in the athletic period. I was wrong but I still feel the sameway about classes for individual sports. 50 minutes is not a lot of time to actually get in much work.  Most of the work is done after school. HJ is good not because they have a basketball class but because of their little dribbler program. I don't see the baseball class helping their baseball program. Silsbee they just have more athletes plain and simple. Don't see a basketball class helping Bridge City either. Here are the facts, unless Orangefield really grows at a rapid pace we will always be in the rear view mirrow of WOS, Silsbee and HJ in basketball, also WOS, Silsbee and BC in football. It will be hit and miss for us as long as we stay in this district. We simply do not have the number of athletes some of these bigger schools have. Orangefield needs to have their athlete's playing multiple sports in order to compete. If kids start specializing the program as a "WHOLE" is doomed. That is what we are talking about RIGHT, the "WHOLE" program.
[/quote]

"WHOLE" program = Football program

Anyone who thinks that baseball or basketball players don't benefit from actually "playing" baseball or basketball or working on those individual sports during an athletic period is in denial or truly thinks that every boy in a HS should be playing football and maybe fit in another sport where possible during those specific seasons.  That just isn't the way it is anymore.  With the growth of select baseball and AAU / summer basketball, kids have more options to develop in other sports and what some of you perceive as the "specialization problem" is only going to get worse in all classifications.  There are more options to work on the non-football sports and unfortunately, some of the better athletes may like those better than football and shockingly choose not to play. 

Baseball and basketball players get next to nothing from doing football offseason workouts during their specific season.  The workouts should be sport specific, especially during the course of the season and if a kid chooses to specialize, he should not be looked at as letting the football program down.  I know this is Texas and football is king, but some of the arguments on here are ridiculous.
[/quote]

It will never get worse at the 4A and 5A level, plenty of kids to go around. 3A and down is a different story. All of you that approve of specializing I have never heard you once mention track, powerlifting, cross country, tennis or golf, just basketball and baseball. Are those the only two sports. I have never looked down on a kid for not playing football. My son only played basketball. Some schools make their basketball players run cross country, would you say they get nothing from that? Offseason football is a lot of conditioning and agility drills and I guess that does not help other sports. I agree the weight training could be a little different but to say the offseason football workouts do not help at all is a little ridiculous in it own self.  99% of the kids at Orangefield will not play at the next level on any given year. That is not being cruel just a fact. Here is another fact, lets say Orangefield does away with football all together will the other sports improve? No, it will not. All it means is more kids will be walking the halls instead of being involved in a sport. Lets talk about baseball, Bridge City has twice as many kids playing baseball than we do. Hard to compete with that and that is why we only beat them when a special group comes through. See, I care about every sport and in order for Orangefield to Progress as some of you say. We need kids to play multiple sports. You sound like you are from the "ME" generation, well I am from the "WE" generation.

[catfever]

Nobody ever said anything about doing away with football.  Football is a wonderful sport and makes kids more mentally tough and many kids love it, but what about the kids who don't like football.  The intention of my previous post and how athletics need to progress with society is that you can't keep doing things the way it was done 10, 15, 20 years ago.  Kids should practice skills on their own, yes, but if they are not going to, we can't just throw our hands up.  We have to weigh the importance of what needs to be taught (weights, speed, skills) and teach that.  It may change with any given group of kids.  Some kids may love to lift weights and will do it on their own, so you can work more on skills during that 50 minute period of time.  The opposite might be true as well.  That is what I meant by progressing.  Athletics has to be willing to change.  I am not about ME, I am about WE.  I look out for those kids who often get overlooked and what might be best for them.  I also disagree with you on the fact of Orangefield being competitive in all sports.  I believe they can be, but I do not think it will happen if things don't change.  Their fundamentals in baseball and basketball will get worse and worse and they will not be able to compete.  I went to many subvarsity basketball and baseball games this year.  It is already a problem.  I have even attended some baseball practices and just basic things are not known but there is not enough time to teach it during the season.  It needs to be addressed during the offseason.  Is Orangefield going to contend for state championships, probably not.  I do believe that they can compete for playoff spots and then in some years maybe district championships.

[hitman009]

[quote name="Riding Solo" post="1209969" timestamp="1334273130"]
[quote author=ispeakjive link=topic=98828.msg1209953#msg1209953 date=1334268637]
[quote author=Riding Solo link=topic=98828.msg1209621#msg1209621 date=1334238381]
I just talked to  UIL director and yes you can practice a sport out of season duing the school year in the athletic period. I was wrong but I still feel the sameway about classes for individual sports. 50 minutes is not a lot of time to actually get in much work.  Most of the work is done after school. HJ is good not because they have a basketball class but because of their little dribbler program. I don't see the baseball class helping their baseball program. Silsbee they just have more athletes plain and simple. Don't see a basketball class helping Bridge City either. Here are the facts, unless Orangefield really grows at a rapid pace we will always be in the rear view mirrow of WOS, Silsbee and HJ in basketball, also WOS, Silsbee and BC in football. It will be hit and miss for us as long as we stay in this district. We simply do not have the number of athletes some of these bigger schools have. Orangefield needs to have their athlete's playing multiple sports in order to compete. If kids start specializing the program as a "WHOLE" is doomed. That is what we are talking about RIGHT, the "WHOLE" program.
[/quote]

"WHOLE" program = Football program

Anyone who thinks that baseball or basketball players don't benefit from actually "playing" baseball or basketball or working on those individual sports during an athletic period is in denial or truly thinks that every boy in a HS should be playing football and maybe fit in another sport where possible during those specific seasons.  That just isn't the way it is anymore.  With the growth of select baseball and AAU / summer basketball, kids have more options to develop in other sports and what some of you perceive as the "specialization problem" is only going to get worse in all classifications.  There are more options to work on the non-football sports and unfortunately, some of the better athletes may like those better than football and shockingly choose not to play. 

Baseball and basketball players get next to nothing from doing football offseason workouts during their specific season.  The workouts should be sport specific, especially during the course of the season and if a kid chooses to specialize, he should not be looked at as letting the football program down.  I know this is Texas and football is king, but some of the arguments on here are ridiculous.
[/quote]

It will never get worse at the 4A and 5A level, plenty of kids to go around. 3A and down is a different story. All of you that approve of specializing I have never heard you once mention track, powerlifting, cross country, tennis or golf, just basketball and baseball. Are those the only two sports. I have never looked down on a kid for not playing football. My son only played basketball. Some schools make their basketball players run cross country, would you say they get nothing from that? Offseason football is a lot of conditioning and agility drills and I guess that does not help other sports. I agree the weight training could be a little different but to say the offseason football workouts do not help at all is a little ridiculous in it own self.  99% of the kids at Orangefield will not play at the next level on any given year. That is not being cruel just a fact. Here is another fact, lets say Orangefield does away with football all together will the other sports improve? No, it will not. All it means is more kids will be walking the halls instead of being involved in a sport. Lets talk about baseball, Bridge City has twice as many kids playing baseball than we do. Hard to compete with that and that is why we only beat them when a special group comes through. See, I care about every sport and in order for Orangefield to Progress as some of you say. We need kids to play multiple sports. You sound like you are from the "ME" generation, well I am from the "WE" generation.
[/quote]Im tring to follow your logic.  Are you trying to say kids should only work on the sport that is in season... except football...  because your football team has not been a successful as you would like??  That schools should cut their athletic programs during the day (when you say specific it means football as well)... and only work after school.. not very smart for any of the programs...
I understand where you are coming from... you are saying Baseball and Basketball are "taking athletes"... Making it hard to win on the football field...  The same problem HJ and Kountze has now... most of the "Athletes" play only Basketball...  SO HOW DO YOU FIX IT??
IMO....
*Hire the right coaches. If a coach is worries about just his sport and persuades them to play only one then get rid of him/her.  They all have to be on the same page.
*Create a Weight training class for all Freshmen who play in ANY athletics.  Make them work out even on game days.  Make them bigger stronger faster.
*Win at all levels esp. the lower. Don’t just worry about the Varsity and give them most of the reps... Why do most kids quit programs... not getting playing time or they don’t like getting their teeth knocked in every week.  If you win at lower, kids stay in the program....
*If a kid quits a sport, don't allow them to play another sport until that sport they quit is done for the season.  Teach them to finish something they started. A good life lesson..
*Educate the kids AND  THE PARENTS  about athletic scholarships... let them know how hard it is to get one, how much grades are important and what NCAA allows each sport to have to spend. Most kids quit a sport because they want to "concentrate" on one to get a scholarship.  Their parents spend lots of money on private lessons and select teams. Most do not understand that baseball D1 schools only get 11.7 scholarships to a 30+ man roster. They would be better off just saving the money and putting it into a scholarship fund for their kids.
As for sport specific athletic periods you have to keep them.  If a kids wants to play one, then let him get better at that sport. There comes a time where you just can’t play all the sports. 
I played in High school: Football, basketball, baseball, cross-country, track and club soccer.  They just kept interfering with each other. By the time one finished you were in the middle of another sport. esp. at HJ when we won to state in 91 or had deep playoff runs.  So I had to give up some..  By my Sr. year I was only playing Football and Baseball.  It’s a decision every kid has to make at one point in time.  Let the kid make his OWN mind up and support it...

[BLUEDOVE3]

Actually, I'm a firm believer if you have above average skills you can get a college scholarship. It may come as a walk-on making the team to getting that D-1 every kid and parent wants. Its about positioning, effort, luck, and some skill.

[hitman009]

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="1210107" timestamp="1334330984"]
Actually, I'm a firm believer if you have above average skills you can get a college scholarship. It may come as a walk-on making the team to getting that D-1 every kid and parent wants. Its about positioning, effort, luck, and some skill.
[/quote]but is some sports they are NOT FULL RIDES.  11.7 is what you can give. you have to spread them out.  Which one do you think a college coach is going to sign: a kid that has excellent skills but cant make the grade or A kid who has above average skill but does make the grade and can get a part acedemic scholarship.  The answer is number 2.  Most kids do not get a FULL RIDE in baseball. even the studs...
THANKS TITLE 9!!!!

[BLUEDOVE3]

[quote name="hitman009" post="1210111" timestamp="1334331658"]
[quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=98828.msg1210107#msg1210107 date=1334330984]
Actually, I'm a firm believer if you have above average skills you can get a college scholarship. It may come as a walk-on making the team to getting that D-1 every kid and parent wants. Its about positioning, effort, luck, and some skill.
[/quote]but is some sports they are NOT FULL RIDES.  11.7 is what you can give. you have to spread them out.  Which one do you think a college coach is going to sign: a kid that has excellent skills but cant make the grade or A kid who has above average skill but does make the grade and can get a part acedemic scholarship.  The answer is number 2.  Most kids do not get a FULL RIDE in baseball. even the studs...
THANKS TITLE 9!!!!
[/quote] Most kids get  a partial but get the chance to continue to play the game they love in college.

[Riding Solo]

[color=red]Im tring to follow your logic.  Are you trying to say kids should only work on the sport that is in season... except football...  because your football team has not been a successful as you would like??  That schools should cut their athletic programs during the day (when you say specific it means football as well)... and only work after school.. not very smart for any of the programs...[/color]

Dam man, alot of questions but I will try to address them all. LOL!!!! Not saying that at all, The bulk of the work is done after school. I do think that the kids should work on the sport in season. That being said Most AD's are a football coach first, so I do see where they are coming from. All I am saying is the work outs for offseason football are not as damaging to the other sports as some people are insinuating. I agree the weight training needs to change but the conditioning does not. As far as the football team, until they change districts and get in one where the numbers are even it will be a hit and miss, with more misses. So no, the success of the football team is not an issue and No they should not cut the athletic period because some work can be done.

[color=red]I understand where you are coming from... you are saying Baseball and Basketball are "taking athletes"... Making it hard to win on the football field...  The same problem HJ and Kountze has now... most of the "Athletes" play only Basketball...  SO HOW DO YOU FIX IT??[/color]
Yes, that is what I am saying but I am not just a football guy. I encourage kids to play as many sports as they can because those should be the best years in a young persons life and I don't want them to have regrets. Plus at a 3A school on down you need your best athletes palying multiple sports inorder for the program as a whole to succeed. Llike I said before it will hard for Orangefield to do that in the current district and I realize that. You know as well as I do the real world can be cruel. Most wish they could be back in high school. My point is, have no regrets. I will never look down on a kid who chooses one sport. That is their choice, some kids are not football, basketball, baseball, track, tennis or golf players. I understand that.  IMO the only way to fix it is for the parents to let the coaches and teachers to their job and the parents should stick to parenting. That is the way it was when I played.
I agree with everything else you said but it is not that easy. It is almost impossible to find a good coach who cares at each sport and every level. Times have changed as you well know. Coaching should be a passion just like teaching but most see it as a job even though it is. I remember this young coach after his first year told the AD, if I do not move up to the varsity I quit. I would have said goodbye. You know as well as I do because even though I am much older than you the same lessons were taught to the both of us. 10 years seem like a lot but really it is not. Sad but true it is all about the money these days. Some young people expect advancement when they have not done the time. Now, it is about a paycheck plain and simple.

[LP2012]

I know that in Liberty during the same athletic period, there is a football off season, baseball off season, and basketball off season. As soon as football is over, the baseball players go to their off season, basketball goes to theirs, and once the other sport is over players come back to football off season. the only problem i have with this is the few players that play football, baaskeball, and baseball never have a serious weight program, and it ends up hurting the kids as they become upperclassmen simply because they have not gaines much strength.